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Well mannered people and fun

I agree with the well mannered concept. I think I may have missed the more ribald entries, but I appreciate keeping it clean so all can enjoy.

That said, I have never been to a forum that was as constructive, supportive, and tolerant as this site. This is the ONLY forum I have been on (I have been on all types of entertainment and political forums) where one really wants to meet the people here. I feel that I have met some friends, which I can't say in other forums. A few forums/weblogs I have been to, if someone doesn't like your opinion on say something political, you're just called a socialist! (far from it here). If you don't like Wal-Mart, you're against free trade, and you're a socialist! Things like that. Often, when one gets together with folks at a gathering, if you mention that you collect appliances, 1/2 the people look at you like you're wierd. It is SO refreshing to come into a positive, open atmosphere.

The people here come from all lifestyles and interests, and viva la difference! (sp). That's what makes it great. And talk about tolerant! Where else can I blabber on about NuTone fans or Cadillacs or dishwashers, and not only reach others of interest, but find a great dialog!

I applaud the people behind this site (and like an idiot, I am not even sure who they are or if I have spoken to them), and I applaud those wishing to keep it on track and attractive to all others who may want to join. Creative, fun, good people are too few and far between to potentially turn any away!
 
Mom is a little over protective but...

She wouldn't let me go to the convention this for two reasons, one only I could afford to go and two, she was afraid that there would be a situation of some sort involoving rape. My mom visits the site once in a while to see whats goin on and what I have been posting about and so on. I'm not saying that I don't feel safe or anything, but with mom not there, me being only 15, and not being able to have someone my mom truly trusts to watch me constantly, she didn't think it safe for me to go. All because of the sexual inuenedo. So in my opinion, those of you posting it, are spoiling all the fun for me.
 
Jamie, you're still an under-aged minor. That is reason enough for your mom to not want you to go to the convention or anywhere else by yourself. I was returning from a business trip to Orlando last March. I saw twice flight attendants accompanying and watching out for teenagrs (about age 14) and making sure they got to where they were supposed to be. All set up by their parents as part of the airline ticket. My parents would have never even dreamed about letting me go somewhere without adult supervision and attendance. And it is correct and proper for your mom to monitor eveything you surf on the internet. I have no doubt Venus or Tom do the same thing for Austin.
 
I'm not sure what all the hub-bub is over here. They worst I've seen is a few pictures of guys in their younger years in speedos, and maybe a few pairs of underpants swishing around in sudzy water around an agitator. There have been some humorous comments and descriptions about these pictures, but hardly anything that I would say is over the line. I am hetersexual, and there are many homosexuals here that have made a few remarks abou what they find attractive...I have too! (like some of the quite attractive gals in the washer ad's!) I see nothing wrong with any of us offering these types of opinions and it's part what makes the forum fun and enjoyable. It is very interesting seeing the styles and how they have changed over the ages. Most people don't think about appliances hardly anywhere near as much as we do, but they are a very big part of everyone's daily lives, and it's certainly fun to talk about them, and the culture that surrounds them.
 
Jamie, your mom has legitimate concerns as a parent, and I wouldn't let a 15-year-old attend a gathering alone. However, you and your mom *were* at the 2002 gathering, so she should have an idea of how everyone behaves. I think the 2002 convention was a little more 'adult' than 2001 in Minne and 2005 in Omaha, particularly Saturday evening with the large number of attendees, the darkened area in front of the warehouse with the disco ball and so forth ... so perhaps she's basing her decision on that. But having attended all three 'major' gatherings, I can't imagine that anything bad could happen. There have been LOTS of good people involved each time, keeping watch on everything, making sure there are plenty activities and that everyone has a good time. The focus is on seeing the washers! Hands-on playtime with those fantastic vintage machines, and sharing ideas, experiences, and memories with fellow washer-o-philes!
 
15's too young to go alone to a strange city unchaperoned while you are there. Many kids fly alone but like said above they're watched by the airline till the person who is supposed to pick them up does so. Then too the parents have to make the decision at what age is appropriate. In my case it was 16 when I took off for Europe by myself for two months with my parents blessing and forwarnings, most people I've told this too say there is no way in Hades that they would let their 16 year old do that today,, well even back then around 1972 none of my friends parents would let them go with me either so that's another reason I went alone. Unfortunately in my mind all this news coverage from A to Z has just frightened more parents than is the reality. There were kidnappings and huge drug scenes going on over in Europe back then as there was here, maybe even more, certainly not less, my folks knew that then and so did I but that wasn't going to deter me or them from me going. Another reason why born/bred N.Americans in general are reluctant to let there 16,17 y.o kids go anywhere distant is because it just hasn't been part of the culture over here. Both my mother and father were from the UK and by the ages of 14 or 15 they said it was quite common for kids their age to go on bicycle trips to the continent with their friends,,hop a train and off to France for a few days biking around. In fact that's how my folks met, mom was with her girlfriends in Paris and dad was with his pals in Paris, both groups biking and staying at a youth hostel. So the story goes, mom and her GF's were sitting alongside a fountain one evening when dad and his pals came over to chat them up. It was quite hot and they all decided to jump into the fountain to cool off.. the next day when they went by the fountain they saw that it was all slimy green water..they alwasy had a good laff over that..The rest was history, dad joinedthe RAF, trained in Canada, Mom went to her aunts in Poughkeepsie. Dad came back over after the war to collect mom, they got married and he got a job with Westinghouse in Hamilton and they moved there. So you see,,had both sets of grandparents been too overly protective and not let their kids wander I might not be here today to amuse and bemuse you all. LOL
 
Floored...

Jamie,

I was absolutely floored to read your message. I was not a part of the convention -- but wish I had been. All the stories coming back have shown it to be an enjoyable grouping of good people with a common interest in these vintage appliances. New friendships made, old friendships renewed, and a lot of information sharing in a pleasant, jovial, no pressure environment.

Your mom is responsible for your upbringing, safety, and well being. It's good to see a parent actively involved in their teens life -- so few are these days, it seems. Far be it me to tell anyone what's right or wrong, safe or not, especially a parent. But I feel I must speak up and say, yes, there are messages with innuendo and rather risque comment -- I'm probably guilty of adding to that. Since my last post on this thread, I've been trying to watch out for that. But even with those type of messages, there are so absolutely many more that indicate what a singularly good group of people is here. Just as sadly as the African-American community must still endure diatribes about welfare queens buying steaks with food stamps and driving off in Cadillacs, gays endure still and will for probably the remainder of my life, the oversexed negative image.

I read your message shortly after you posted, and it's been on my mind since. One of the strengths I've seen of this good community is how easily people work to blend together. Sexuality just doesn't seem to be a major part of it. Nor a number of things. I fell out of the chair reading that one member I thought of as liberal, is actually a Christian conservative! But that simply proves the binding issue here is the preservation, restoration, and appreciation of the vintage appliances, with a focus on those in laundry room.

I'm into vacuums and small kitchen appliances, like some others here -- but not in the majority who's expression is in their interest in the washers and dryers. My past experiences in special interest forums, has been that those in the majority can act like elitist snobs. Not a bit of that here. Not even a hint.

As someone who is both a Systems Programmer for a major company, and a high school dropout with some college, I've a pretty good nose for snobbery. But it really is about the appliances here. And nothing else.

I'm contemplating possibly not posting for awhile, or finding a different venue for my vintage interests. I live in a small apartment, so here it's expressed in old vacuum cleaners. I don't add much, or give much to this community, I'm still learning a lot, and from this community I've learned much already. A row of shiny vacuums spanning nearly 80 years of history is the result.

These people here are currently the only ones who I can share that pride of restoration and appreciation. My Dual Sanitronic is my favorite -- because it was the first I cleaned up, polished, relubricated, and so forth -- all with skills, tips and suggestions from people here. Those people are now part of the story my collection tells.

But I must admit I'm very concerned about this thread topic, and if any of my postings make anyone the least bit uncomfortable, please, by all means, email Unimatic1140. Supply him with the Forum, thread, and post numbers for deletion. I don't want to spoil this forum for you, or anyone else, young, middle aged, older. Nor do I want to do anything to tarnish, or appear to tarnish, the high regard in which this community is held.

Respectfully, and sincerely...

John D.
St. Louis, MO
 
John...what's with this!!

I'm contemplating possibly not posting for awhile, or finding a different venue for my vintage interests. I live in a small apartment, so here it's expressed in old vacuum cleaners. I don't add much, or give much to this community, I'm still learning a lot, and from this community I've learned much already. A row of shiny vacuums spanning nearly 80 years of history is the result.

You can't go, the vacuum stuff is just starting to get going on here in the super forum and I think plenty of people like looking at the vacuum pic, discussing the different models. As much as I love reading about the washers and those pics I love seeing pics and peoples descriptions on any vintage appliance they enjoy, especially vacs. Besides there isn't to my knowledge any vac sites where you won't get your head bit off by those believing themselves the final authority, you just want to you know what to them. "bless them and send them on their way" LOL
 
Well.

I've kept my mouth shut for a while but now's the point where I think I need to speak up.

Yep, there are certainly a lot of randy gay guys on this board who've made some off-color comments. Only a very few, though, have gone over the top, at least in my opinion. I'm guilty myself, I'm pretty sure. What seems funny at the time doesn't always come out that way.

The unfortunate fact is that we're humans here and as such, don't always think before we post. Not making excuses, just stating a fact.

I know it doesn't always occur to me that there are young'uns on this board, a fact that we should definitely keep in mind before we start typing. I know I will.

That said, I must say I'm very concerned about Jamie's mother's comment. A little offended too, I think. I'm going to assume she never actually used the word "rape", and was really more concerned about, oh, just the vibe involved with a teenager being around a group of adults, many of whom are gay. I don't know--do people still worry about gays trying to "recruit" young people?

I will agree that 15 is probably too young to be taking a trip like that alone, though it would depend on the kid. I've met some 15 year olds that were going on 30, if you know what I mean. Would I send my own teenage son off to the convention on his own? Probably not, though again, it would depend on the kid. If I did think he was mature enough, my concern would be that the other members would be overprotective! I've been on the board long enough to realize that if anyone messed with one of us, that person would have the entire membership on his ass in a New York second. This is a remarkably tight-knit group.

The problem then, is that Jamie's mother probably doesn't check the boards enough. If she did, it wouldn't take long to realize that we're one of the most caring groups around. I got more birthday wishes from the members here than I did from my "in-person" family. If someone posts that he has a hangnail, the sympathy and caring comes flooding in. Remember when Lawrence was in the hospital so long with that infection? Lawrence, did you feel that the members here just forgot about you? Doubt it! Or when David was going through his unfortunate business situation. It was like a brother was having trouble, not just a person. Cory? Ben? Austin? Did you feel uncomfortable at the convention?
(Not trying to put anyone on the spot here. Just using the first examples that pop into my head. My apologies if anyone wants to be kept out of my ramblings.)

Wash-ins? Dinners? It seems like everyone's door is always open all the time. Personal (sometimes very personal) stories? Hopes? Fears? We don't seem shy about sharing them. Cripes, youall know more about me than a lot of people I see every day.

I guess what I'm rambling on about is we are family.

Family.

Oh, yes, indeed.

And just like family, we can be jerks sometimes. But we would never, never, NEVER let anything happen to one of us.

I for one am proud to be a member of this family.

veg
 
John---------hang in with us!

John,
I am fairly new to posting here and Robert and the members have been kind enough to let us vac folks post about our interest in vacuums complete with pics. I like reading your posts and I really appreciated the nose for snobbery comment!

The VCCC website is not user friendly and you can't download ANYTHING without going through the webmaster who runs that site with an iron fist. I am the former Pres of that group and I love this website, the members and the banter that goes on.

I do think any group no matter how big or small, how left or right, how male or female, etc., is going to at times have sexual innuendo. It is part of the human condition. At the vacuum conventions there is always some double entrende about crevice tools, beater bars, length of hoses, shag rug rakes and so on.

The "self-policing" that goes on here seems to keep everybody in check fairly well. When anyone pushes the boundaries too far, somebody is there to rein them in. This is the best forum I've seen doing that as no one is made to look like a fool.

So, please keep posting and I do enjoy the vacuum talk so keep it going!

Charlie
 
Veg used the right word...

...offended. But I was not "kinda" offended, I was majorly offended. I don't want to put a teen in a position of debate against a parent -- no way shape or form. But I just couldn't let that stand. I've read with the others, patiently and concerned, to the teens speaking up as is their proper right here -- as they are, I believe in looking at the interactions here, peers. But use of that term called for pushback. It went over the top for me.

I've much more to say, but I think it's best I leave my comments at that. Again, I say, if anything I post offends anyone, or makes you uncomfortable, have it removed. I will not protest.

I value this venue highly, and am really enjoying the enthusiasm here. Right now, this hobby is probably my sole source for a feeling of accomplishment and reward. I'll pledge here to honor others

Lastly -- Charlie, in response to your last post -- I'll let this picture of another Kirby attachment speak its thousand words...
 
Yesterday, Wednesday I had a docs appointment downtown and it was raining cats an dogs here. On top of that my cars windshield wipers quit. Oh so carefully I manage to get my car down the hiway to into town and pull into the closest train transit parking lot. No way was I going to drive any further, especially to downtown so I steeled myself up and took the train in (only my second time in the 18yrs I've lived here). I throw my ducats into the ticket dispenser and head down to the platform. Being summer holidays kids and teens everywhere and there's nothing said on this site that comes close to the smut and expletives their conversations were peppered with. I think many of you have been in similar circumstances
 
WOW

Well, for all of you that know me, by now you probably have figured out that I pretty much say what's on my mind!
I just read the post from Jamie on why he couldn't come to the convention.
I'm shocked that the word "Rape" was used!!! Acually I just about threw up! That has been the MOST uncomfortable thing that I have EVER read on this board! I don't know everyone personally but, I do know that was uncalled for! If at any given time someone at that convention would have even made a comment like that the other members would have kicked their ass. I don't know what in the hell would make someone think that the club members here are pedifiles! The club members here watch over the kids like they are there own! And everyone else for that matter! Jamie you couldn't have been more safe! I'm positive it would have been more safe than you attending school everyday! The more I think about it the more I get pissed! If this would have been a convention with a bunch of women would that comment been made? Or straight men? Bullshit!
However, At times I do agree that it gets a little steamy around here! I think the guilty have fesses up and realized that it isn't the place for it! I guess I'd better shut up now!

Still shocked and pissed!, Bethann
 
OK, I definitely agree with Bethann. I found that comment a little more than offensive, and I know it will cause a lot of unfortunate hurt feelings. I'm genuinely sorry if that happens as well. I thought the Convention was GREAT, and every member I met is like a member of the family!! No one, ABSOLUTELY NO ONE acted in that manner, and if I had heard that comment at Greg's house, I (as well as many others) would have been in that person's face faster than a Unimatic empties the tub (and I normally don't do confrontations)! I know for a fact that no one else felt "uncomfortable" there either. I'm still shocked that anyone would even remotely THINK of something like this...

In response to Steven's post, I'm straight, and I tend to post a few "babe-related" comments, so it does go both ways (I'm sure I'm one of the people you're referring to as well!).

--Austin
 
Austin hates when I post right after he does, but I had to chime in on this subject.

I feel that anyone under the age of 18 should be chaperoned when traveling. Airports are confusing to the *seasoned* travelers among us. I can't imagine an unchaperoned adolescent dealing with ticket agents, airport security, time tables, etc. I would be worried sick!

I also try to monitor the web-surfing. Our computer is in a central location, and is viewable by all. Anything deemed inappropriate is not allowed. After all, there is also a ten year old watching.

However, the comments about a possible "situation involving rape" at the convention made me go....."WHOA"! I agree with my old pal Veg, that there are some *randy* people and moments on some of these threads. Sometimes I wince and give out my usual *OY* (and sometimes I laugh riotsly)! But these comments are usually in good (albeit PG-13 or close to R) humour, and no harm is meant by them. We are all a little braver when writing than if we were to make the same comments face-to-face. If there is ever anything extremely offensive, all one has to do is let our esteemed webmaster know about it, and it is taken care of.

I not only felt completely at home and enjoyed myself immensely in the presence of our members at the convention, I had absolutely no problem letting Austin socialize, discuss, demonstrate, and enjoy himself! This is the nicest bunch of folks I ever met. There was no pretense, we had a common interest immediately, and everyone looked after each other. I was so happy to see everyone take Austin under their wings. He's never had so many *uncles*, *brothers*, *cousins*, mentors, and friends in one place!

It is unfortunate that this kind of *fear* would even come into play here. I would like to think that we know each other better than that.
 
Thank You RetroMom, Austin and Bethann

And Thank you Veg! I couldn't have said it better.

And I must say knowing most of these people here a long time and how much work is done behind the scenes the comment made by Jaimie's mom was also very UNFAIR! PERIOD!
It also demonstrates to me a lack of belief or faith she has in herself to say something like that off hand.
She doesn't "know" me!

This place is for appliances and the people that love them to share their hobby with.

I know I have made comments that were alittle daring, but it never got out of hand nor do I believe it ever would with this crowd!

The more mixed we are the better I feel! Christian Conservatives, Straights, Gays, raging Liberals, even Canadians!
I have never trusted a homogenous group, there is no true sharing when everyone is exactly the same.

As one of the founding members I say MIX IT UP and keep it mixed that is one of our greatest strengths!

Cheers to all
Jetcone
 
More .02 cents

I think we should all be aware of our audience and regulate ourselves! IN NO WAY Should this task fall on Robert as webmaster! HE has enough to do just running things!

Every adult here should be able to roll with a joke or remark they find they are uncomfortable with.
That is part and parcel of being a MIX.
BUT no ADULT OR CHILD should ever be allowed to push the forum into an uncomfortable zone away from appliances for very long. A comment is a comment a trend is something else entirely.

And I think all the members here do a very good job of keeping us on track with our hobby and away from bad trends!

Jon
 
When I was so ill.... (Families of choice, in action)

Once my friend Linda emailed David (appliancegarage), and he posted that I was in the hospital, the love and care and letters and phone calls from the other members here overwhelmed me --in the best sense of the word. I knew my news was on the board when Chuck D. called on a Friday evening when I was feeling lonely, sad, and had a certain amount of physical pain. His nice voice, and friendliness, and knowledge of appliances cheered me greatly. David had called earlier, but then he knew from Linda. (Yes she might be, but the term we both prefer is "woman friend."!)

During my 33 days away from my cat, my Maytags, my internet connection...it was my familieS of choice who kept up my spirits.

People from church, my NON-drinking buddies (1-31-82!--one day at a time), and especially YOU-- my fellow residents of Applianceville kept me laughing, and feeling less alone.

My biological family (almost all out of state) sent cards and phoned, but....you were there!

When I finally came home, and saw the care and concern in the threads about me, it was so beautiful.

I've only emailed some of you, but I am proud to know you all. I hope my circumstances will permit me to be there for the next convention--wherever and whenever.

Lawrence/Maytagbear
 
Having had numerous private emails on this subject

and chats.. Here's what I'm gonna say because of all the consternation it's caused.. Jaime is either not telling the truth and making up what his mother said, and if he is not then perhaps he should have his mother email and confirm it whatever. To say what he said even at 15 or whatever age should
be questioned for everyones sake
After all if she is that uncomfortable she would probably stop him from viewing the site altogether...
 
Okay, everyone take a deep breath and stop for a second.

We don't know for SURE that Jamie's mom actually said that. Fifteen year-olds aren't known for thinking before they act--or write. Benefit of the doubt time, folks.

QUOTE: "The more mixed we are the better I feel! Christian Conservatives, Straights, Gays, raging Liberals, even Canadians!"

Oh, please. Canadians? I like to think of myself as open-minded, but can't we draw the line somewhere? I mean, come on...;)

(Love ya, Pete!)

veg
 
Ummmm... Let us also remember that instead of going to our convention, Jamie when to the Clean show in Orlando and spent at least 2 days in a convention hall, I beleive unchaperoned. Let's see, spend a weekend with a group of people who all know eachother at a private home with names, addresses and phone numbers on file who feel nothing short of parental responsibility for our young proteges, or spend the weekend in a convention hall with thousands of strangers. Hmmmm...

Maybe Jamie's parents should have talked with Ausin's parents before convention. I know at previous conventions, the "washer widows" would congregate together and maybe do something touristy away from the washers; maybe the same should happen with our under 21 members and their family chaperones.

How completely out of hand this has become...
 
OK enough already please.

I'm sure most agree that this is getting a bit out of hand now. Maybe we need to remember that Jamie is only 15 years old and he was probably either exaggerating or misunderstood what his mother said. I know Jamie and his mom rather well and both are great, and I can't imagine his Mom really saying such a thing, but it is quite likely that her words might have been misunderstood by Jamie. Now when I think back to when I was 15 years old I might have done the exact same thing that he did especially if something was making me uncomfortable. I'm sure if you all think back to when you were 15 you might have been capable of doing the same types of exaggerations.

If Jamie was exaggerating or misunderstood his Mom and would like to apologize to us, we would certainly understand and forgive him. Either way, we want him to know that he is a wonderful member of our club and we are lucky to have him with us and certainly wouldn't want him to feel uncomfortable because of a slight misunderstanding.
 
Sincerest Apologies...

I would just like to apologize to anyone who was offended by my earlier post; that was not at all my intention. I would also like to apologize for using the word "rape", it did not come across the way I thought it would. I also do believe I misunderstood what my mother was trying to say when she told me that I couldn't go to the convention, I guess she feared of ANY, "funny business" that may have occurred not necessarily at the convention, but on the flight, or at the airport, etc, just as any mother would. I hope to resume enjoying this site to fullest again soon and attending wash-ins, conventions, and get togethers once I know that everyone knows I was not trying to offend anyone with my remark, but merely commenting on my observations. I now regret that I used the word "rape" as reading back I can see how I may have offended anyone and frankly, I was a little offended to by my own remark now seeing how many may have read the text. I guess it is one of those things where you mean it one way but most everyone takes it completely the other way. Again, I SINCERELY apologize for any offense this may have caused to anyone and I wish that if not at least that post but this whole thread be deleted and forgotten by all so we can get on enjoying what this site is all about and all of it's members.
 

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