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My big old GE console is solid state, and it sure ain;t of the devil..LOL!!!! I would love to find a early Astro Sonic in a modern cabinet, every one I find here is old early American or French provential...I grew up with that style,,,NOT happening!..I saw a beautiful 63 Astro Sonic at the Goodwill a while back without a scratch on it....French Provential!!LOL
 
Converting changers from ceramic cartridges

My parents had a low end Garrard changer that almost certainly came with a ceramic cartridge, but was converted over to a magnetic. No idea why that conversion was done. The cartridge was a Shure, probably M44, and I'm under the impression the person who did the conversion also might have modified the arm to add a counterweight.

Then, to finish it off, a phono preamp was added to match the Shure to the input on the receiver. Stand alone phono preamps are now quite common in audiophile circles. My parents were tuned into a Hot Audiophile Trend years and years before it became hot. LOL

>Grado made a magnetic cartridge that was designed to be used in changers.Don't know if they are still available.

As far as I know, Grado has nothing today specifically targeted at changers. I have no idea about years back, but I can say that I have seen Grado cartridges on a couple of changers, including one that looked exactly like what my parents had. It was sort of shock, actually, because Grado now seems like a specialist high end company...and I see one of their products on a mass market system.

I suppose a current Grado could be used in SOME changers. But I'm thinking the changer would need to a fairly modern one, and have been a fairly good one new. One issue: the changer needs to handle a cartridge that tracks lightly. I'm under the impression some changers need heavy tracking forces to trip the change mechanism.

Also note one Grado issue: the cartridges can pick up hum easily (from turntable motors and AC transformers). I've had little trouble, but some people have had so much trouble that they consider Grado unusable.

I don't have a console, but if I did, I'd probably choose something other than Grado for it.
 
vintage console site that has some toxic entities on it

I don't think it's just that unnamed site. It seems like toxic, opinionated people exist across a wide chunk of the audio world. No matter what you have, there is someone out there who will call it a piece of junk.

One of the pieces of advice I ever heard basically says the ONLY opinion that matters is the opinion of the owner. He or she is the one who buys and has to live with the investment.
 
Yes,just remembered that Grado is now hi-end-they also make Hi end Hi-Fi headphones.So if you were going to look for a mag cartridge to use in a vintage changer--some homework will be required.I sort of remember when I did this and another fellow I knew made conversions.There was a point in time you could get a simple,one tube(12AX7)mag preamp from Radio Shack for like 50 bucks and did the job very well!The High end models are just to ridiculosly priced to consider.Other option were the ones sold by radio station suppliers.These would have 600 ohm balanced outputs to match other station audio equipment--consoles.Often these preamps were switchable to use it as a TT preamp or a mic preamp.For TT use a phono equalizer was switched in to match the RIAA curves.For mic use--flat.I encountered a lot of these tubed preamps in older Gates-Harris consoles.2 6J7 tubes.Modern ones of coarse solid state.The solid state units you could match the cartridges impedance and capacitance.You adjusted those for flat response with the Shure test records.Did a lot of this servicing radio stations.-And at the agency I work now-24 studios-installed and set up two TT's in each Technics SL1200 with Audio Technica cartridges-offhand don't remember their model#s.
 
Grado Hum

Grado cartridges aren't shielded. That's why they pick up hum from turntable motors, sometimes.

In the world of Dual turntables, some Grado cartridges will hum and others will not. I have even heard that if you have two of the same Dual models one will hum with a Grado cartridge and the other will not.

On the www.audiokarma.org website there is a grid of Grado cartridges with a listing of what turntables which Grado models will hum with. While I have never owned a Grado cartridge I have heard from plenty of people who did and they are happy with the sound if the cartridge doesn't hum on them.

I think in a lot of console stereo's ceramic cartridges kind or restricted the quality of the sound. A magnetic cartridge would sound much better if the turntable could handle it.
 
Playing Records On Vintage Changers: If playing your records on vintage equipment brings pleasure or joy, by all means, play them! Life is short. If you intend to donate or sell a pristine collection, then you might want to think twice. But if seeing those records spinning and changing on the player of your choice makes you smile, have at it![this post was last edited: 2/28/2015-03:45]
 
I had no idea!

People had such strong feelings about records..I have collected records for over 40 years, ever since I was a kid, some are like new, some scratched and worn, but like everything I have, I use them, a few scratches doesent really bother me, I do handle my records very carefully , and keep them clean, but I do play and enjoy them, I play something almost every day, I have had many different kinds of stereos and Hi Fi setups thru the years, my favorite is my 62 Phonola consolette with reverb, it is certainly not the most powerful thing on earth, but it plays good, has a good rich sound and the VM changer works like a charm, My Mother and Dads best friends bought it new in 1962 from Allied Radio,which sent out a catalogue in those days, their late Daughter Jodi told me she played the first record ever played on it, Telstar by the Ventures, I spent many hours as a kid sitting on the floor listening to it while the adults played cards and talked so it has sentimental value,no where near the best stereo ever made, but I sure have enjoyed it, both as a kid, and later when it was given to me, ive had it 25 years or so.
 
I have several hundred record albums, most of which were purchased in thrift stores. The entire lot might be worth $300, it would be a fight to get that out of them. They range from pristine to trash, the trash being purchased for musical content, not appearance. Our mom got an RCA Victor/Breck Shampoo promotional album through the mail, and a ten record set of light classical music from RCA/Reader's Digest around 1960. They were played on a child's RCA portable, and to this day, none of the discs have a mark on them. The record set case is a different story. The first "real" stereo was a $59 Sylvania BOL portable for Christmas 1966, with the first Monkee's album. Parents weren't into consoles or records, but we kids always took care of the discs we got with allowance or gifts. I think my brother still has all his records, but his nice component system he had in the day is long gone.
 
>,just remembered that Grado is now hi-end

To a degree, I think they always were a high end company, at least in the sense of being a serious audio equipment maker. Admittedly, they might have had a cheaper entry point in, say, 1975 than they do now. But at the same time, 1975 was also a much different era than now. One obvious difference: there were more people playing records then. I also get the sense that era was one during which more "normal" people had component systems. So there was some incentive for cartridge companies to make strong entry point models. They'd have sold, plus there would be the hope that someone who buys today's rock bottom Grado or Shure will come back and buy a better model one day.

>So if you were going to look for a mag cartridge to use in a vintage changer--some homework will be required.

I think homework would be required. I'm not up on all the ins-and-outs of changers. But it's pretty clear that there is a huge variation across the years, the makers, and the models.

But...that is the reality of turntables in general, I guess.
 
>Grado cartridges aren't shielded. That's why they pick up hum from turntable motors, sometimes.

Yes.

>In the world of Dual turntables, some Grado cartridges will hum and others will not. I have even heard that if you have two of the same Dual models one will hum with a Grado cartridge and the other will not.

I've heard this about other makes. I remember hearing about one Rega model that was variable. Even though it was the same turntable, and the same motor design, some would hum, and others wouldn't.
 
The Pickering V15 / NP/AC or the Stanton 500 series with a spherical stylus was always a good choice for a magnetic upgrade, but now Stanton has changed hands suppy is drying up.

An elliptical stylus is a poor choice for an upgrade on an old record changer as these require very low tracking forces and demand very low tracking error.

Ken D.
 
@tolivac,

They also don't like Jack Daniels Or Jim Beam ;-)

Technics SL1200 in nighclubs have a hard life. :-)

My Glaser Steers is currently using a Stanton DJ cart, it works, but I don't use that changer that much.
 
@kenwashesmonday,

LOL, well we won't talk about the fun we had at an Antique mall when we tested out the various victrolas with Little Richard Tutti Frutti. That got some attention in the busy mall. (The record was an Ebay sale that went sour, it has a steadily worsening crack in it.)
 
Not to plug Dual changers.. but... Dual record changers actually change the VTA (vertical tracking angle) of the stylus as records are added from the stack to maintain best tracking while playing. And the spindle doesn't drop the records down, they are lowered down via an elevator type spindle and finally, the spindle rotates with the record(not stationary) to prevent record hole wear. Dual designed their turntables to be gentle on records. Even the 1000 series Dual's from the mid 60's even will handle cartridges that track as low as 1-3/4 gr.

And on Dual turntables you shouldn't try to use MC (moving coil)cartridges. MC cartridges actually like a little mass to the tonearm. Dual tonearms are built using a low mass philosophy. Usually this will result in a MC cartridge sounding "tinny" on a Dual.

Another Technics turntable that is pretty nice is the SL-1500, a predecessor to the SL-1200.These were hot in the 70's & 80's and can be had for almost a song now.

I think the early 70's was when America really got into component stereo for home use. Retailers like Playback and Pacific Stereo really had quite the selection. There also used to be independent stereo stores that you could go to an "audition" any piece of equipment you wanted to.

I bought a girlfriend a Pioneer SX-424 receiver, a pair of AR-4x speakers and a Dual 1245 turntable with a Shure V-15 cartridge all for about $325.00. And even though it was low powered it sounded great!
 
I have three different carts I run on my Technics SL1200, The Signet from 1988, an Empire with the pink headshell, (can't remember which it is, I think it's from about the early 90's) and a Shure V15 III.

Sound quality wise, the Shure is the best and it has an original, correct needle in it. The Signet is next and finally the Empire. The Empire is the "hottest" cart.

The Signet did okay with the Shure test record.
 
>There also used to be independent stereo stores that you could go to an "audition" any piece of equipment you wanted to.

Strictly speaking, there still are such dealers. My area has a good number. The problem, though, is that such stores these days often cater to limited audience of serious audiophile types, who are able and willing to make a substantial investment in equipment. This issue frankly really concerns me. People with lower budgets should have a place where they can get the best quality possible for their dollar. Also, practically, the long term survival of the decent audio equipment industry might be helped by those low end sales. The individual sale might net practically no real profit, but it can help create enthusiasm that will translate into buying better equipment one day.
 
Back to the "limitations" of consoles...

I was thinking about an experience I had about 25 years ago. At that time, I was using a mass market rack system of the 1980s. [Insert shudder.] I don't recall the specific market position. It was probably not TOL, but it was also not BOL. There were big three way speakers, graphic equalizer, CD changer, remote control, etc.

At that time, I also had a tubed monophonic console. No idea what the market position on that was, although I'd guess it was also neither BOL, nor TOL. For me, the console was basically a cool toy. But one fine day, I decided what the heck, why don't I try running the rack system turntable through the console to hear what it would sound like playing a record? (The console came to me with a broken changer.) So I took that rack system turntable, and connected it. I don't remember how I connected it--I must have done something to match the moving magnet cartridge on the Plastic Deck to the phono input on the console. All I really remember was that I had the rack system turntable connected, and I dropped a record on. And guess what? The console sounded better than the rack system. I don't recall the specifics, just the "better." Or as my local audio dealer phrased it, "more enjoyable to listen to." Even though the console was mono, probably low powered (certainly lower power than the rack system), probably a lesser output transformer, 30 years older, and presumably with components that probably weren't ideally functioning (e.g. it probably could have used new power supply capacitors, possibly some new tubes here and there, etc).

Not long after, the rack system was sold off. Not entirely because of the console experience, although that was probably one factor.

I now have to wonder what would have happened if I'd tried out a turntable better than what the rack system had... Indeed, I wonder why I didn't do that--it could have bridged the gap between the sale of the rack system, and the day I got the next system.
 
Over the years I've developed a fondness for stereo consoles. They're sort of like swimming pools...you don't necessarily need to use one to simply enjoy it.

 

As fas as Westinghouse, one day I'll get this "mock clock" stereo/phono out of my garage and clean it up.

twintubdexter-2015030114054108496_1.jpg
 
Oh, those 80's rack systems

I had forgotten about those things. They were mainly just for looks. The performance of most of those was very lacking. Sure they looked like a nice system, but those nice looking components were really cheap. And a lot of brand name manufacturers like Sony, Kenwood and Pioneer all made them. It's my personal opinion that they were designed for people who didn't know anything at all about stereo but wanted something to impress their friends with.

That's something that you can still go to a stereo specialty shop and audition your components before you buy. In Houston just about the only place you could do that at is Best Buy. All the other stereo shops have shut down and are long gone. What you have now are home theater stores specializing in that genre of sound.

And if you think you may have a problem finding a stereo shop, try finding a place that will service your stereo equipment! They all will tell you "Just throw it away and buy a new one." I have an SAE preamp and amp. I had some work done on the SAE preamp and I had to mail it to a specialist in South Dakota. Nobody else around here knew how to work on them, even though I have the SAE Service Manuals.
 
@twintub,

Thanks! Surprised at the Garrard tt. Looks to be about a mid 60's model. In fact, that's a model that a magnetic cart can be installed.

How does it sound?
 
It sounds sort of like a mid-line console stereo standing on it's side. Made by Westinghouse Canada. I purchased it from an old lady who was living in a travel trailer that was up on cinder blocks. The place was packed with stuff like you see on "Hoarders" so I'm sure she welcomed the extra space. Fortunately it was near the door. The experience made me appreciate my modest home. 
 
Rack systems

I had direct experience with only my rack system, so I can't comment about all rack systems. But I can say the one I had was piece of junk in just about every way imaginable.

It looked sort of impressive when new "in a lots of high tech looking controls, flashing lights" way. But it didn't take long for me to realize that it was image over substance. Almost from the start, there were reliability issues. Some were minor that I could fix (a belt that drove the tape deck counter acted up somehow). But amplifier took one trip in for service to fix a solder joint.

And while the sound quality was probably a step above what I'd had previously (one of those cheap compact systems with turntable/tape deck/receiver in one box, and external speakers), the rack system really didn't have very good sound quality in an absolute sense. Serious listening was difficult, and not something I did much of. One time I tried seriously listening a long time, and ended up having a headache. Although that headache might have been coincidental. And, towards the end, I played one track off a record, and noted in the liner notes that it was supposed to be a boys' choir. But I thought it sounded more like a women's choir. Perhaps, though, I was just overly cynical about the rack system by that point...

I'd have to agree that rack systems had an appeal for those who didn't know audio. Impressing others with flashing lights, etc might or might not have been a point. But one thing I recall was the ease of buying the things. One complete system, and available for sale in countless places.
 
Service/repair

>And if you think you may have a problem finding a stereo shop, try finding a place that will service your stereo equipment! They all will tell you "Just throw it away and buy a new one."

And that is indeed a real problem. There are stores, fortunately, that do have a repair department. But many stores don't, or have serious limits on what they can/will do.

Manufacturer support can also be appallingly lousy once equipment is past a certain age. Even on equipment that cost more than GNP of a developing nation. Even schematics can be hard to come by (presumably due to trade secrets).
 

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