When did GE start to go bad?

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I thought Jack Welch was making ALL of GE go bad and it was just a matter of time before he pressured the Appliances division to be cheap.

Chet, for all the people who thinks the CEO of a company like GE should be an engineer, Jack Welch had a degree in engineering.
 
Jack Welch had a degree in engineering.

All of the junk appliance designs made in the last 30 years were also designed by engineers being micromanaged by bean counters. The days of making the best possible design 100% backed by engineers with full control and beaming pride ended by WWII. Today, it's all about churning out the cheapest, lightest POS heavily using 3rd world sourced components while making the biggest profits, carefully engineered with planned obsolescence. On top of that, making laughable warrantee claims like a 10 year warranty on a stainless steel inner tub and motor of a washer and obsoleting parts as soon as 3 years (Samsung is notorious for this one). What a crock of shit.
 
chetlaham

That is correct. You could hear the dishwasher draining when called for, all while the dishwasher was spraying dishes. It had the GE characteristics. The detergent dispenser sounded like somebody slamming a door shut. It also did that when dispensing rinse aid. It has always done that since we got it.[this post was last edited: 4/18/2025-00:12]
 
qsd-dan

I blame Jack Welch wholeheartedly. He is the reason why the filter-flo washer and dryer design were killed. That GE model T sounded tortured while agitating and the companion dryer sounded like a car accelerating. That GE dishwasher sounded like it was going to attack due to the loud vibrations you'd hear across the house. I also thought the GE filter-flo washer sounded like a rock band when on normal speed during agitation. It was the motor doing that.[this post was last edited: 4/18/2025-00:15]
 
Reply number 50

Good morning, Chet , you had me howling with laughter in your reply number 50 there was no difference between GE dishwashers between 1967 and until a few years ago when they stopped making the standard tub design, all of the different years had their own problems, but they weren’t worse in the 90s in fact they’ve gotten a good deal better than the early ones that rusted out had bad grinders from the beginning had bad motors from the beginning. It wasn’t until the PSC motors that they ever had a decent motor.

After all the lengthy posts you posted defending GE dishwashers as being so great and then you just turn on always something exciting from your sandbox.

The black shaded pole motor was absolutely the worst motor in any dishwasher that was mass produced and the pump assembly attached to it was never any good always had problems with main seal leaks, grinders, and trip shaft seal leaks other than that I guess it was OK lol

You’re always good for a laugh. Have a great day lol

John L
 
Black and White Reasoning

John, see reply 54.

 

The dishwashers I'm defending are between 1983 and 1994.

 

Being able to point out a specific period of GE's success isn't turning "turn on always something exciting" due to your inability to see grey scale or think outside of binary black and white reasoning.  

 

 

Also saying there is no difference between a 55 year run of GE dishwashers then go on to contradict yourself saying they've gotten better since the plastisol days tells me you have very limited experience servicing GE along with your protracted black and white perception of the world.

 

 
 
GE never made the best appliances

GE used to make good appliances, but they were never as good as a Whirlpool or Maytag. Their older appliances weren’t half bad, but they weren’t the best.

Even the Filter Flo machines weren’t as reliable as the competitors, but are definitely much more reliable than a WCI Frigidaire, GE HydroWave, or a GE Model T, they also had better cleaning performance. The Filter Flo was still a good machine.

The Maytag dependable care machines were highly reliable and those things were built like tanks and they lasted at least 20 years on average.

The Whirlpool direct drives lasted 14-20 years on average. When they broke it was often a small part like agitator dogs or a motor coupler.

The GE laundry appliances made in 1996 to 2016 were terrible. The reason why so many rental properties have a Model T or HydroWave in it is because they were bargain machines.

GE also made HydroWaves and Model Ts under their Hotpoint brand.

I’m going to link a YouTube video to a failing HydroWave again to prove how bad they were. Just because your HydroWave was trouble free for 16 years does not mean most were.

HydroWaves never declined or got better in quality, they were just always terrible machines ever since they came out. The bargain HydroWave models were the worst.

Some of the GE fridges were known for board issues, according to Lex Vance’s YouTube videos.

The newest GE profile machines do NOT rinse, do not buy those machines. They just drain and refill for rinse, even with the fabric softener selection on. Do not buy THE fancy GE’s, if you buy GE washing machines right now, buy the cheaper GE machines.

The GE commercial that irritates me the most is the HydroWave commercial with GE saying they were good machines, they are NOT good machines and they were worse than Model Ts. I like how they also said “they are not chug chug chugging away your clothes like traditional top loads do”. They also said they are good when kids are taking a nap, well the wash cycle was quiet, but the spin cycle was kind of loud for a washing machine without bad bearings.

If the motor bearings or mode shifter bearings on the HydroWave failed it’d obviously be louder.

The GE dryers were more reliable than their washers but they weren’t as good as a Whirlpool.

I’ve been recommending Whirlpool machines until recently when I found out that their newest products have bad reliability issues. Any Whirlpool machine made from 2023 to early 2025 has the control board problem. Even in 2014 when I knew nothing about washers, I told people to avoid GE washers and dryers due to reliability issues and told them to buy anything other than GE. I also said GE made the worst washing machines ever.

 
Dan, best synopsis of the major brands I have ever read on here. Spot on! You said what I've been trying to say all along just not as eloquently written or on point as you just did.

 

 

My honest opinion? Bring back the direct drive but with precision manufacturing. It is the only washer that does speed, serious washing, serious rinsing and longevity in one machine.
 
You can’t bring back the older direct drives

The reason why the direct drive was discontinued was due to a U.S. passed in 2011 that would mandate washer efficiency, in order for them to come back, the law would have to be reversed which likely won’t happen.

Another thing I forgot to mention with GE HydroWaves and Model Ts is that when they went out of business they went crazy, they just were shaking so violently and banging so much and sometimes they’d bang so hard that it’d dent the cabinet or cause the cabinet to blow off, that’s actually scary.

I remember using a HydroWave on vacation and once it went off balance that thing was going absolutely crazy, because of their poor suspension system and the lack of balance sensors. It had a bad mode shifter of course so it had the Speed Queen “TR” wash action.

It eventually stopped draining meaning a drain pump maybe failed. I don’t hate GE washers as much as I used to and I’ve been quiet impressed with the newest models lately, they’ve significantly improved and seem to hold up as well as your run-of-the-mill Whirlpool-built VMW washer.

The newer Whirlpool VMWs are much worse than the original models. The older VMWs made before 2020 were pretty decent in terms of reliability if taken care of properly. In fact, I recommended Whirlpool VMAX and VMW machines until about now.

All the 3.8 to 3.9 cu ft Whirlpool models with the redesigned stainless steel drum (3.8 to 3.9 cu ft), depending on if it has the agitator or washplate (such as the WTW4950HW, WTW4955HW, WTW4850HW, WTW4855HW) were known to violently bang on the spin cycle and cause a hole in the wall, likely due to their poor tub design. The models with the older stainless tubs made before 2018 never had this problem likely due to a better and thicker balance ring (which is now only used on the Maytag commercial units), they’d bang around if the load was uneven or if suspension rods were bad but they never violently tilted or dented the side of the machine like those models do. They also make a horrible popping type of noise when on spin cycle even if balanced due to this poor tub design, while the older ones never did. The higher end models don’t make as bad of that popping sound but they often have vibrations on the spin cycle if new, either due to many of them being unleveled or just that poorly designed balance ring.

The Whirlpool 4.2 to 4.3 cu ft machines (like the Maytag MVWC565FW, MVWX655DW, Whirlpool WTW5000DW, or several Kenmore models), actually used the proper balance ring, the main issue with those units is the plastic tub bushing often worn out, causing them to shake violently on the spin cycle. Neu has found a solution to fix the problem. Another common issue with those was the hub, where it’s wear out. The reason why the smaller Whirlpools don’t have as much of this problem despite using the same hub and center sleeve was because the tub was smaller and less heavy causing less friction on the parts.

The older agitator VMWs made in 2010 to 2015 (2010 to 2017 for Kenmore machines), with the older style balance ring were good machines, but the suspension rods on those were known for failing which isn’t that hard of a repair to begin with. When the suspension rods went bad on those they’d run wild.

All the older VMWs were known for bad bearings, whether it had an agitator or washplate, and it often occurs after around 7-8 years of operation. To fix it you have to either change the transmission, run it until it dies, or buy a new machine.

Rarely see bearing issues on the bigger VMW machines (4.2 cu ft and beyond), but VMAX and the first generation Cabrio design are a different story.

This is what a bad tub bushing on a Whirlpool VMW washer looks like.

 
Surprised no one brought this up

GE did release a model that was basically a Speed Queen. From my gathering, these machines were problematic. I still would've taken a T over it no matter how much I think it's really cool. But definitely for certain I'd take one of these over any new GE top loader today and thank goodness SQ still makes classic top loaders like this.

panasonicvac-2025041811562505699_1.jpg
 
I'd have taken that washer over a model T any day. While the reliability and longevity were short lived, in that time it could still clean, rinse, and spin clothes without all the extra BS being the frosting on the cake. I'd rather have a short lived washer that does its job, then an ever shorter lived washer that can't even turn over a load.

 

If everyone were like me GE would've probably redesigned the seals, transmission and added a metal outer tub producing what would be a Speed Queen today. 

 

I wouldn't be angry at the discontinuation of the filter flo because GE would've actually had a realistic product.    
 
I also would’ve taken that washer over their others

I also would’ve taken that washer over a Model T or HydroWave, while they did have some durability issues, they cleaned clothes just fine. These Speed Queen style washers were also sold under the Amana and even Maytag brand name

HydroWave was AWFUL, they turned over absolutely nothing. The T-Models turned over a little bit when loaded well, but the HydroWaves didn’t turn over clothes at all. The HydroWaves also had stupid programming.

The worst cleaning older washer has to be the WCI Frigidaire, those didn’t turn over anything.

The newest GE washers clean better than both the Model-T and HydroWave.
 

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