Whirlpool FL washers accumulate mold, class action lawsuit says

[DADoES]

 
1.  ALL washers, ALL brands, FRONTloaders and TOPloaders, can develop mold and munge.

2.  User carelessness and bad habits is the primary cause.  The push to cold (and cooler warm & hot) water promotes and exacerbates the problem.

3.  Suspect the reason for picking on frontloaders is the purchase cost premium and repair cost premium that's involved, and they're "newfangled" to the consumer-off-the-street.

 

[launderess]

Mould & Mildew Will Grow Anywhere Conditions Are Favourable

Damp/humid conditions + warmth + food source ='s mould/mildew.

Washing machines both top and front loading have been around for almost >100 years now so where is this sudden plague of mould coming from? IMHO washing machine makers should lay some of the blame squarely at the feet of regulations/laws mandating water and or energy usage.

When washing machines in particular front loaders were allowed to use the amount of water required to get the job done we never heard of "washer cleaning" cycles. There was no need for such nonesense. Long as proper laundry techniques were followed including proper dosage of detergents with hot water, muck and grime were mostly flushed down the drains.

Today consumers use mainly liquid detergents and cool to cold water in washing machines that on average often do not rinse well. All that residue of soils and surfactants make up a nice breeding ground for mould.

 

[hoovermatic]

I have been using FL/h/axis TL machines almost consistently since 1981 and I have never had a mould/mildew/odour problem. I never wipe the door seal dry at the end of a cycle, I have never used a cleaning cycle or any washing machine cleaning product. I always leave the door ajar when the machine is not in use - simples! This sounds like lawyers making money from clueless consumers.

 

[Iowegian]

@foxchapel:

Tires rarely fail due to overinflation. If you're talking about the Ford/Firestone Ford Explorer fiasco, I can tell you that the suit wasn't brought or settled over overinflated tires.

And the talk-radio favorite example of McDonald's coffee didn't end up making that woman rich, either.

We had a 2-term President a while back that claimed minority women on welfare were driving Cadillacs, too.

Did you hear the one about the Doctor that bought a Craftsman mower and gave himself a heart attack because there wasn't anything in the instructions telling him to stop pulling the starter rope when it wouldn't start?

 

[Iowegian]

@whirlcool:

I think you are talking about the General Aviation Revitalization Act.

While there were a spate of lawsuits from parties with an interest in small airplane crashes in the late 1970s and early 1980s, it's useful to think why that happened. People that bought small aircraft tended to be financially successful, which gave them the ability to buy small aircraft in the first place. Successful entrepreneurs tend to be risk-takers in their business dealings, and spread out their success into other endeavors. Type "A" personalities, if you will.

The genesis for the legislation that absolved light aircraft manufacturers from liability came from 2 things:

1. The recession of the late 1970s/early 1980s that pummeled the small airplane business. As a result, the market value of Cessna dropped dramatically. The recession of the late 1970s/early 1980s really hurt their business jet business. It hit their small airplane business, worse than the biz jet business but the core value of Cessna was the biz jet worth.

2. General Dynamics purchase of Cessna in 1986. General Dynamics had strong political connections (being a gigantic defense contractor that made everything from fighters to nuclear submarines) and used those connections to their advantage. They were buying Cessna for their undervalued business jet business, not their little airplane business.

Business jets are flown by professional pilots for the most part, and there are usually 2 crew members flying them. Not much liability attached to that.

General Dynamics wanted to buy the plum part of Cessna, and not have the little airplane part hurt their bottom line. Hence, the GARA act. Not drunk pilots or distraught wives.

But, as the saying goes, "everything old is new again". General Dynamics eventually sold Cessna to Textron - and Textron owns Lycoming, which makes piston engines for small airplanes, Bell Helicopter Company, and EZ-Go Golf Cart company.

So, things are never as simple as they seem.

If you're eyeballs aren't totally worn out by now, I can tell you about how we ended up with Allied-Signal, which managed everything from oil wells to nuclear warhead production. It's a fascinating story of American business, where the expected outcome was where Signal Oil would take over Allied Chemical...

 

[arbilab]

Don't get me started on Allied Signal. I was an inadvertant stockholder. They bought Ampex, which I already owned, and ran it into the ground. They also bankrupted Mack Truck. To escape their bad name reputation they bought Honeywell and adopted the name.

 

[jerrod6]

Probably a combination of factors:

 

Ever wonder why Downy is now telling  you to shake the bottle well before each use.  Probably because they have removed some thickener that P&G found to contribute to build up in energy star washers - but they won't dare say that.

 

Then there is the washer and the government energy programs.  No one is telling consumers to use the hottest water the fabric can stand.  Instead everyone is telling folks to wash in cold water.  So what is cold?  60F, 70F, 37F?  Even if you wash in warm water -  warm is now 80F or less.  Hot on some machines is 110F for regular loads.  With ATC consumers cannot use water hotter than the washer will mix it. 

 

The Whirlpool user manual:   This states that bio-film may build up.  HUH?  Even when I saw the phrase bio-film,  MOLD did not come to my mind -  until I thought about it.  I wonder how many consumers read over that line and .....just didn't get it. 

 

Never had any clean machine cycle until recently.  Why would we need one now?  Use of cold washes, use of hot washes using temps that use to be considered warm, use of thick liquid detergents, over use of detergents since the instructions don't mention anything about adjusting for soil level at all ..just load size..  unless things are heavily soiled and then you are supposed to use more...and now we have pacs that can clean small loads and large loads because.....the pac can tell the difference and adjust for load size and soil level?......I bet not.

 

[Iowegian]

@arilab:

Wow, someone that remembers Ampex!

Alexander M. Pontienoff was a skilled engineer, but if it weren't for Bing Crosby bankrolling him...who knows what would have happened.

Short story: Magnetic tape recording technology was one of our spoils of war that we took home from the Nazis post WWII. Along with missile technology and jet engines...

Bing Crosby was getting tired of performing his radio show for the East coast, and having to stick around the studio to do it again for the West coast four hours later. Bing Crosby bankrolled Ampex because Bing only wanted to perform once a day.

Captured German technology, plus Bing Crosby's capital is what started Ampex...

Bonus points if you know who Jeep Harned was...

 

[arbilab]

Remember Ampex? I worked for them in 1969. Made my living making broadcast videotape work for ~20 years. The only Ampex video machines I DIDN'T work on were the tube version and AVR2.

Knew the Crosby connection, though I otherwise have general contempt for him as a person. Jeep is a new one on me. Know who E. Stanley Busby was?

Would you like to have the official Ampex book "Videotape Recording"? It's an incomparable reference to anyone interested in technical television history. I'm not likely to live much longer (or I wouldn't give it away) and nobody I know would value it. It's otherwise unobtanium as it was a corporate publication not a commercial one and could be a priceless collectable at some point in the future. I'd just like it to have a good home. It's the only thing I have that hardly anyone else could possibly have.

 

[tolivac]

Ampex

YES!!!!Used to deal with their decks in the radio industry-WORKHORSES!!!lets see-Ampex 300,350,3200,ATR100,440,it goes on.The agency I now work for had the 300's in their studios-Rec/PB.The central recording branch used the 3200-high speed dubbing.Other radio stations had 350,700,440.Loved these machines-they worked well,built solid-and easy to fix when they broke.Back in the early 90's my workplace tried an AEG "Magnetophone" to try to replace the Ampex machines-Instead they went to Studer.810-HORRIBLE machines to work on.But they worked well otherwise.Now the Wash DC plant has gone digital and all of the Ampexes are gone-went to the Library of Congress-they use the machines to convert and transcribe digital audio material to analog-the analog archives better than digital and is easier to retrieve.The machines would be in their archives in Culpepper,Va.Now that I work on transmitters-so miss my ol' freinds the Ampexes.Have a few service books on the machines I worked on and the book Arbilab has would be interesting-if no one wants it,would be intertested-another AMPEX guy!!!And--I own an Ampex 300! still works-full track mono.It has the orig tube Rec/Pb amp.

 

[foxchapel]

the overinflated tire . .

@Iowegian - No, it was not the Firestone lawsuit. This was a guy putting air into a tire, at a pump, at a service station. I do not think Firestone was even mentioned in the article; pretty sure it was another brand.

 

[launderess]

Meanwhile Back At The Ranch

If one goes by Internet complaints mould growing in this new crop of modern front loaders seems to be a major issue. None of the major appliance makers will admitt to it, and all suggest the issue is one of consumer's poor laundry habits (not leaving door ajar after use and so forth), but one can only guess it is tied into the puny amount of water these machines use.

 

[dj-gabriele]

but one can only guess it is tied into the puny amount of wa

NO, it's not!
My washing Candy machine uses the fantastic amount of 39 Litres of water per wash and we don't know the meaning of mould, same goes in the other washer, a Whirlpool, at a whopping 44 litres!

It's all down to bad habits!

A friend of mine and my sister have the same WIA600 Indesita washing machine, my sister's machine is pristine, as she was instructed on how to properly wash and maintain the machine, my friend's one is so mouldy that the door boot needed to be changed (by me!)

 

[nmassman44]

I can say that after my experience with the GE/Frigidaire front loader that we got from a friend that was so proud to wash only in cold water and never leave the door open to air it out..the smell was unreal not to mention the clumps of "biofilm" that came off the drum when I ran hot water and Tide washer cleaner thru it. After all those years of washing in cold his clothes smelled like they were washed in a sewer.
It amazes me how these detergent manufacturers push cold water washing...especially in a front loader. To me cold doesnt clean..its like washing your hands in cold water after you just cut up chicken and they are kinda greasy...it doesnt work well. But thats what people believe that it works. I always tell people you dont take a cold shower or bath when you bathe do you...

 

[foxchapel]

washing most of our laundry in cold water is like . . .

. . . washing a skillet in cold water, that has been used to fry chicken.

 

[sudsmaster]

I second the fact that mold (really, fungus) can grow anywhere.

When I bought this house in '97, it came with a '78 GE Filter-flo. Nice washer, but it had this funky old cigar smell to it. When I lifted the top off it, there was a thick crust of brown mold all around the underside.

I figure the former owner had perhaps bought into the cold water washing myth. The washer is now parked in my collection in another building on the property, replaced by a Maytag Neptune that has never had mold in tub or odor problem, and I don't do anything special like keeping the door open. But then I do only hot or warm washes, with STPP. And the Neptune design provides aeration via ports in the door panel and a big gap in the detergent compartment lid. There is some slight surface mold in the detergent compartment, but that is easily removed with a sponge or brush once or twice a year.

 

[neptunebob]

But the Neptune had another design flaw that grew mold. Above the dispensers was a plastic case that all of the fresh water went into. One day I unscrewed it and black mold everywhere! I had to use a screwdriver and bleach to scrape it all out. As I remember, the Kenmores we had had a smaller case the water went into but it was open on one side and made of polyethylene so water never hung around. Cleaning this case out did help keep the mold away from the rest of the machine until it grew again. And me and my mother always used hot water and often used bleach. Now we have the GE (LG) top loader and the drawer where you place the detergent and the softener has a coating of mold which has to be cleaned off, it will not even come off in the dishwasher. Somehow I think this machine will be a stinker too.

 

[neptunebob]

Oh, another thing...

I cannot believe that Bing Crosby was such a wuss that he could not perform twice a day, althought we probably would not have videotape if he did not fund Ampex. I have performed in college and community theatre musicals where I had to be on stage for maybe 2 hours at a time and had to do it twice a day, the day before and the day after and while I was tired after ALL of that, if I can do it I see no reason Bing couldn't handle it. Maybe all of the smoking and being mean took his energy away? I also had to move furniture on stage and then after all was done help "Strike" the set and prepare the auditorium for the next use too.

 

[arbilab]

One gets the impression Bing was a diva. Got things 'his way' just because he could. But like you said, Uncle Alex's little DOD motor company couldn't have financed the audio machines without Bing nor the video machines without the audio.

E. Stanley Busby was the logic designer for ACR-25/AVR-1 among other projects. The VR-1000 team was Charles Anderson, Ray Dolby, Alex Maxey, Shelby Henderson, Charles Ginsburg and Fred Pfost. The anniversary of videotape broadcasting was Nov 30 1956.

Somebody would have come up with practical videotape if Ampex hadn't, but not in 1956 they wouldn't. As George Harrison said about Ringo's drums in Hard Day's Night, Ampex loomed large in my legend.