Whirlpool vs Samsung, LG
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Sadly, trying to compare anything built today with something built more than ten years ago is not comparing apples to apples no matter who manufactures it.
True Steve. The newest major appliance I purchased was a top mount refrigerator from WP this past June.. don't know if I will get 25 years like I did on the old WP but this unit is nice for what it is and seems well made. I guess anything today is a crap shoot.
The only thing Whirlpool gained dominating the market the way it did was putting drop-down doors on Myrag dryers, and perhaps the triple-action Surgilator in Maytag's washers....
Quite a reflection of the quality and reliability, if there is such a define in the way each brand used to build its appliances reliably, they are about equal in that you're getting a Maytag that will work and last as long as a newer a Whirlpool, but at least a Whirlpool saved Maytag from the decline of machines that were more like the Admiral lines that they bought and built like...
-- Dave
Quite a reflection of the quality and reliability, if there is such a define in the way each brand used to build its appliances reliably, they are about equal in that you're getting a Maytag that will work and last as long as a newer a Whirlpool, but at least a Whirlpool saved Maytag from the decline of machines that were more like the Admiral lines that they bought and built like...
-- Dave
Whirlpool household
My family is a Whirlpool household as well! Our family of three uses all appliances HEAVILY. The only thing "needing" a part is the Duet. It wasn't spinning easily and the repairman threw in a new control board just in case (warranty). Our dishwasher could be more solid inside, and the microwave handle is falling apart after 8 years, but again hard use. Whirlpool is definitely our brand of choice since we can't afford Miele. I will never purchase a Samsung appliance. Too many people I know have had major issues and repairs early on. Ironically, my grandparents have a brand new LG fridge that is very nice but has the linear compressor. It replaced a horribly unreliable and poorly engineered Amana fridge.
My family is a Whirlpool household as well! Our family of three uses all appliances HEAVILY. The only thing "needing" a part is the Duet. It wasn't spinning easily and the repairman threw in a new control board just in case (warranty). Our dishwasher could be more solid inside, and the microwave handle is falling apart after 8 years, but again hard use. Whirlpool is definitely our brand of choice since we can't afford Miele. I will never purchase a Samsung appliance. Too many people I know have had major issues and repairs early on. Ironically, my grandparents have a brand new LG fridge that is very nice but has the linear compressor. It replaced a horribly unreliable and poorly engineered Amana fridge.
I don't know that the pricing between WP, GE, LG, or Samsung are all that different....in checking pricing from place to place, maybe a 25 to 50 dollar difference, and that could just be a sale, but nothing major in pricing to jump for joy.....
just like theres not much of a price difference from shopping Sears, Lowes, HomeDepot, HHGregg, etc.....
I will admit, Samsung dryers are super quiet.....
and LG FL washers seem to have a lot of leaking from around the dispenser drawers, and hence rusting around the front area....
may not be all, just the ones I have come across all seem to have the same issues...
just like theres not much of a price difference from shopping Sears, Lowes, HomeDepot, HHGregg, etc.....
I will admit, Samsung dryers are super quiet.....
and LG FL washers seem to have a lot of leaking from around the dispenser drawers, and hence rusting around the front area....
may not be all, just the ones I have come across all seem to have the same issues...
firedome
Well-known member
opinion from one cheapskate BOL consumer ...
we've been extremely satisfied with 2 WP BOL top freezer fridges we bought, one 7 yrs ago for camp and one 2 yrs ago for here. Also a WP BOL TL washer 7 yrs ago, not one problem with any of them. Actually the same goes for a BOL GE d/w bought 8 yrs ago and a GE BOL TL washer a couple years ago. Zero issues and decent enough performance from all of them. Considering they were as about as low priced as any appliancesmade, if one goes belly up there's not too much to complain about, really, but we're not expecting that to happen any time soon. That said given a choice for new we'll buy US made, however the next house will be primarily vintage US stuff... just for fun!
we've been extremely satisfied with 2 WP BOL top freezer fridges we bought, one 7 yrs ago for camp and one 2 yrs ago for here. Also a WP BOL TL washer 7 yrs ago, not one problem with any of them. Actually the same goes for a BOL GE d/w bought 8 yrs ago and a GE BOL TL washer a couple years ago. Zero issues and decent enough performance from all of them. Considering they were as about as low priced as any appliancesmade, if one goes belly up there's not too much to complain about, really, but we're not expecting that to happen any time soon. That said given a choice for new we'll buy US made, however the next house will be primarily vintage US stuff... just for fun!
I find LG front loaders aren't nearly as flexible as Whirlpool and Maytag front loaders. Steam is only relegated to certain cycles with LG. and steam is a way to force the heater to heat up the water and get the environment inside the tub hotter. You can't get extra hot or steam on LG's towels cycle. LG's Perm Press cycle doesn't offer steam or extra hot. I use steam option and hot water on my wrinkle free white dress shirts, gets those collars clean. With Whirlpool I can opt for extra hot as well as steam on Towels cycle. And same temperature option on Delicates. Even steam and extra hot on quick wash. On comparable Maytag Maxima extra hot and steam on Wrinkle Free (comparable to Whirlpool's Delicate) as well as Bedding, which I imagine is similar to Whirlpoo's Towels. I want to be able to get any water temperature I can select. Cold Water cycles are totally useless as far as I'm concerned.
vacerator
Well-known member
"Tariff"
On what exactly? Whirlpool imports it's parts. LG's, (at least ranges) for the US market are assembled in Mexico also.
Remember what the Japanese auto industry, then the Korean's did to avoid a tariff or high dollar exchange rate? They built plants here.
No offense to you Richard, happened before you were born or just a tott.
Before the pan pacific trade deal we just exited, things were as they are. Before NAFTA, we had many plants in Mexico. NAFTA mainly included Canada, and replaced the auto-pact, which made one go there if one came here. Inglis made their own machines in Canada before, until the old belt drive wig wag design was phased out there, later than in the US.
The ceo's of FCA, Ford, GM, etc. met with vice president Pence this week to discuss the movement of NAFTA revisions proposed by Trump. Activity has been slow.
I don't buy into what politicians say about much. They don't own the companies.
They try to pose as servants in order to become masters though.
The golden rule is he with the gold rules, and always follow the money.
The system is designed so the companies compete rather fairly. They all optimize for lowest cost of design and production to compete in the marketplace.
They are not going to spend billions of dollars and a decade if not two to build parts plants stateside again.
The bulk of manufacturing is now in Asia. We were told by 1990 that was how it was going to go. That the US would be a technical and financial and service majority economy. We haven't put all eggs into that basket. As robotic technology further advances, they will further replace humans in factories. Humans maintain them, and the computers and electrical components that control them, at least for a time. Artificial intelligence may enter into that much later. My guess is that Asia and China will beat us, at least during this administration. That is far different from building towers and oil rigs. The Microsoft, Apple, and other tech geniuses don't seem to have much influence at this time with govt.
Think for a minute, do you actually think Tesla motors, etc. would get any subsidies to start up under this administration? While many say Tesla is a failure, they have advanced battery technology, and sell enough cars to make a profit now.
Just my educated opinion being from the motor city, and having had a large enough corporate career knowing the dynamics.
My dad knew the Whirlpool Clyde division dynamics well also. They had and have their efficiency experts.
On what exactly? Whirlpool imports it's parts. LG's, (at least ranges) for the US market are assembled in Mexico also.
Remember what the Japanese auto industry, then the Korean's did to avoid a tariff or high dollar exchange rate? They built plants here.
No offense to you Richard, happened before you were born or just a tott.
Before the pan pacific trade deal we just exited, things were as they are. Before NAFTA, we had many plants in Mexico. NAFTA mainly included Canada, and replaced the auto-pact, which made one go there if one came here. Inglis made their own machines in Canada before, until the old belt drive wig wag design was phased out there, later than in the US.
The ceo's of FCA, Ford, GM, etc. met with vice president Pence this week to discuss the movement of NAFTA revisions proposed by Trump. Activity has been slow.
I don't buy into what politicians say about much. They don't own the companies.
They try to pose as servants in order to become masters though.
The golden rule is he with the gold rules, and always follow the money.
The system is designed so the companies compete rather fairly. They all optimize for lowest cost of design and production to compete in the marketplace.
They are not going to spend billions of dollars and a decade if not two to build parts plants stateside again.
The bulk of manufacturing is now in Asia. We were told by 1990 that was how it was going to go. That the US would be a technical and financial and service majority economy. We haven't put all eggs into that basket. As robotic technology further advances, they will further replace humans in factories. Humans maintain them, and the computers and electrical components that control them, at least for a time. Artificial intelligence may enter into that much later. My guess is that Asia and China will beat us, at least during this administration. That is far different from building towers and oil rigs. The Microsoft, Apple, and other tech geniuses don't seem to have much influence at this time with govt.
Think for a minute, do you actually think Tesla motors, etc. would get any subsidies to start up under this administration? While many say Tesla is a failure, they have advanced battery technology, and sell enough cars to make a profit now.
Just my educated opinion being from the motor city, and having had a large enough corporate career knowing the dynamics.
My dad knew the Whirlpool Clyde division dynamics well also. They had and have their efficiency experts.
vacerator
Well-known member
Another example;
Europe already has automated robotic pharmacies. Will this eventually displace pharmacy techs? I don't know, but it may indeed.
Europe already has automated robotic pharmacies. Will this eventually displace pharmacy techs? I don't know, but it may indeed.
Pharmacy Techs
Ohio is requiring that all technicians are registered through the state and pay annual fees. Sooner or later they will be requiring that we are all state certified. This will reduce the workforce quite a bit considering all the dinosaurs and less mentally capable people who work in our pharmacies. Unfortunately, Insurances are starting to mandate using mail order as well. But that's another topic!!
Ohio is requiring that all technicians are registered through the state and pay annual fees. Sooner or later they will be requiring that we are all state certified. This will reduce the workforce quite a bit considering all the dinosaurs and less mentally capable people who work in our pharmacies. Unfortunately, Insurances are starting to mandate using mail order as well. But that's another topic!!
vacerator
Well-known member
Ohio also
made dietician's be not only registered, but licensed, where as Michigan did not.
By 1996, Michigan clinical dietician's were mostly part time, per diem, and or had their perks and benefits slashed. Many were bachelor of science degreed.
Richard, back in the 80's some Sony, Sanyo, Sharp, etc. televisons were assembled in California.
made dietician's be not only registered, but licensed, where as Michigan did not.
By 1996, Michigan clinical dietician's were mostly part time, per diem, and or had their perks and benefits slashed. Many were bachelor of science degreed.
Richard, back in the 80's some Sony, Sanyo, Sharp, etc. televisons were assembled in California.
speedqueen
Well-known member
...Assembled in California
That only furthers my point and proves that the last bits of protectionism created jobs here. When the tariffs fell and the slanted trade deals came, those manufacturers moved production back to their home countries or China.
When a forign manufacturer has factories here, we get jobs. When a US company outsources labor we still get the profits(US shareholders) and tax dollars. When a forign manufacturer sells goods here we get NOTHING but the overpriced, cheaply made goods.
As to my age, were any historians around during the Roman Empire? I suggest that they be discredited as well, based on the same logic. I'm one of the sore few of my generation that laments the replacement of documentaries with reality TV on The History Channel. Don't even get me started on "Ancient Aliens"!!!
That only furthers my point and proves that the last bits of protectionism created jobs here. When the tariffs fell and the slanted trade deals came, those manufacturers moved production back to their home countries or China.
When a forign manufacturer has factories here, we get jobs. When a US company outsources labor we still get the profits(US shareholders) and tax dollars. When a forign manufacturer sells goods here we get NOTHING but the overpriced, cheaply made goods.
As to my age, were any historians around during the Roman Empire? I suggest that they be discredited as well, based on the same logic. I'm one of the sore few of my generation that laments the replacement of documentaries with reality TV on The History Channel. Don't even get me started on "Ancient Aliens"!!!
vacerator
Well-known member
Yes Richard, perhaps
and there are and were other factors besides that, and always the lowest cost to produce.
As factories built through the 1960's had asbestos, and other hazardous materials used in manufacturing, along with very old plants, it was also cheaper to open new ones elsewhere. Even the land had to be remediated of toxins. These are called EPA superfund sites. Heard of Love Canal where Hooker Chemical was near Niagra Falls NY? Another in our own backyard was Carboloy carbide tool at 8 mile and Hoover.
California too saw many close, not only in the rust belt. As avaiation declined after WW2 there, some remained open until the push for cleaner air, water, and land impacted them. The Ford plant in Pico Rivera closed in 1981, which was in part due to that and slower sales of full size cars. So production was consolidated between Hapeville Ga., and Oakville Ontario for both the east and west coasts.
Maybe one reason California has so many high tech jobs today, and is one of the worlds largest economies is that two years of college is paid for by the state.
Even those in agriculture graduate from USC, and other univeristies.
Not very many want monotonous factory production work these days. I never did.
My grandfather used to ask us, do you want to be smart, or be garbage man in his native Italian accent. He was a steel mill foreman. My dad used to tell us also "if you don't use your head, you use your feet, or hands." Even garbage collectors do better today than most small factory workers.
and there are and were other factors besides that, and always the lowest cost to produce.
As factories built through the 1960's had asbestos, and other hazardous materials used in manufacturing, along with very old plants, it was also cheaper to open new ones elsewhere. Even the land had to be remediated of toxins. These are called EPA superfund sites. Heard of Love Canal where Hooker Chemical was near Niagra Falls NY? Another in our own backyard was Carboloy carbide tool at 8 mile and Hoover.
California too saw many close, not only in the rust belt. As avaiation declined after WW2 there, some remained open until the push for cleaner air, water, and land impacted them. The Ford plant in Pico Rivera closed in 1981, which was in part due to that and slower sales of full size cars. So production was consolidated between Hapeville Ga., and Oakville Ontario for both the east and west coasts.
Maybe one reason California has so many high tech jobs today, and is one of the worlds largest economies is that two years of college is paid for by the state.
Even those in agriculture graduate from USC, and other univeristies.
Not very many want monotonous factory production work these days. I never did.
My grandfather used to ask us, do you want to be smart, or be garbage man in his native Italian accent. He was a steel mill foreman. My dad used to tell us also "if you don't use your head, you use your feet, or hands." Even garbage collectors do better today than most small factory workers.
speedqueen
Well-known member
My mother used to work at former Carboloy which was once a division of General Electric. She worked in the office starting in the late 1970s as a PBX switchboard operator and worked up to being an inside sales representative, which, at the time, was the most coveted position in the office as corporate paid for travel expenses and work was like a perennial vacation. By the time she left to become a stay at home mother in 1999 all perks of the job were gone and "College Educated" employees were being hired that knew nothing real about their job.
As to Hooker Chemical, an often forgotten bit of history is that Hooker actually sealed in the waste site better than most were at the time. They lined and capped Love Canal with thick walls of clay, a practice still used today. They also didn't even want to sell the property as they thought it was a liability to do so, but the city begged them and eventually they decided to sell for $1 but included a disclaimer telling what the site was and that all responsibility was to the new owner, the City of Niagara Falls. It was the city who drew up the property boundaries, sold some land to a developer, and put the school dead center of the dump. They destroyed the clay cap during construction and the rest as we shall say is history.
An interesting fact is that during longitudinal studies of the cancer rate at Love Canal they determined that there wasn't an elevated occurrence.
As to Hooker Chemical, an often forgotten bit of history is that Hooker actually sealed in the waste site better than most were at the time. They lined and capped Love Canal with thick walls of clay, a practice still used today. They also didn't even want to sell the property as they thought it was a liability to do so, but the city begged them and eventually they decided to sell for $1 but included a disclaimer telling what the site was and that all responsibility was to the new owner, the City of Niagara Falls. It was the city who drew up the property boundaries, sold some land to a developer, and put the school dead center of the dump. They destroyed the clay cap during construction and the rest as we shall say is history.
An interesting fact is that during longitudinal studies of the cancer rate at Love Canal they determined that there wasn't an elevated occurrence.
Washer Prices
Fortunately, whoever sells pdf's of ephemera on here has sold me the 1954 Cooper Supply Catalog, which appears to be a very comprehensive distributor of TV's, radios, and major appliances.
Looking in there at washers, the automatics that would compare to our machines today average $300, with GE's best at $350. Maytag isn't distributed by them, but every other major and minor brand appears to be there (except Sears and Wards, of course).
The exchange rate between 1954 and today is $ 1:8.98. So, basically all the major washers brands for automatics would be roughly $2700 in today's money. And remember, their salaries were lower than today's, even though the average annual income in this country hasn't gone up since 1973, in constant money.
So, if I paid a little under $900 for the SQ 432 that I bought a couple of months ago, dividing it by 9 would mean that it would've cost only $100 in 1954. One hundred Dollars then would only buy an off-brand, probably crappy wringer washer.
So what can we expect? If Whirlpool, SQ, GE, etc., could build and sell their machines for $2700 I expect we'd get a lot better and more durable machines. As my local appliance dealer told me when I bought that w/d pair, the margins for manufacturers of washers in particular has gotten so slim that they just aren't that interested in them any more. It's worth thinking about.
Fortunately, whoever sells pdf's of ephemera on here has sold me the 1954 Cooper Supply Catalog, which appears to be a very comprehensive distributor of TV's, radios, and major appliances.
Looking in there at washers, the automatics that would compare to our machines today average $300, with GE's best at $350. Maytag isn't distributed by them, but every other major and minor brand appears to be there (except Sears and Wards, of course).
The exchange rate between 1954 and today is $ 1:8.98. So, basically all the major washers brands for automatics would be roughly $2700 in today's money. And remember, their salaries were lower than today's, even though the average annual income in this country hasn't gone up since 1973, in constant money.
So, if I paid a little under $900 for the SQ 432 that I bought a couple of months ago, dividing it by 9 would mean that it would've cost only $100 in 1954. One hundred Dollars then would only buy an off-brand, probably crappy wringer washer.
So what can we expect? If Whirlpool, SQ, GE, etc., could build and sell their machines for $2700 I expect we'd get a lot better and more durable machines. As my local appliance dealer told me when I bought that w/d pair, the margins for manufacturers of washers in particular has gotten so slim that they just aren't that interested in them any more. It's worth thinking about.
speedqueen
Well-known member
1954 Prices...
John, could you tell me what the price of my 1954 Bendix Duomatic(electric) was? Sorry to bother you with the request.
Thanks, in advance.
-Richard
John, could you tell me what the price of my 1954 Bendix Duomatic(electric) was? Sorry to bother you with the request.
Thanks, in advance.
-Richard
vacerator
Well-known member
Richard;
My friend (not college degreed) worked at Carboloy from 1994 through 2005. Seco Tools of Sweden already owned it. He also worked in the office building as a c.a.d. designer. His boss, and several others died of cancer. By 2006, most of the staff and shop floor had been laid off. The Tennessee plant remained open. A few transferred there. None of the displaced qualified for retraining under the TRA act because their jobs weren't auto industry direct related, even though they supplied the cutting bits that made drive axles for the auto industry.
Back in the GE days, or before, the facility had a bank, and a pharmacy for workers he told me.
My friend (not college degreed) worked at Carboloy from 1994 through 2005. Seco Tools of Sweden already owned it. He also worked in the office building as a c.a.d. designer. His boss, and several others died of cancer. By 2006, most of the staff and shop floor had been laid off. The Tennessee plant remained open. A few transferred there. None of the displaced qualified for retraining under the TRA act because their jobs weren't auto industry direct related, even though they supplied the cutting bits that made drive axles for the auto industry.
Back in the GE days, or before, the facility had a bank, and a pharmacy for workers he told me.
