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Nothing can clean and rinse a large load of dirty clothes effectively in just 35 minutes. Not the old Speed Queen, not anything. You're expecting too much of a fundamentally primitive machine. That's why almost all industrial OPL machines are front-loaders with long cycles and powerful on-board heaters...
 
New SQ TL Washer Vs The Old Ones

This is is why SQ is still making the machines with the transmission, the older machine does a very good job washing most clothing loads in around 35 minutes.

 

We have built and used over 1/2 BILLION top load washers in this country over the last 70+ years and while they have their faults no  one has ever suggested Americans do not wear and have about the cleanest best smelling clothing that one will experience anywhere in the world.

 

John L.
 
... the f***?

How on earth does a FL have less wash action?

The main reason FLs need a little more time are:

a) Saturation takes a little longer.
b) Balancing is thing with a FL.
c) Most FLs at least rinse twice.

A TL that double rinses needs about 40min, lots of FLs take about the same.
A FL that tricks a little about (aka LG TurboWash) and thus only has to balance twice can do an average load in the same time a TL would.
 
here goes a caca-disturbing comment...

<span style="font-size: 14pt; color: #008000;">Some people like dogs and dislike cats. Some people don't like front-load washers (especially those like me with painful backs) and prefer top-load machines. There's plenty of room for both of these models to exist happily in America's homes. There's no need to defend front-loaders as if the people that own top-load washers are stupid. Like stainless steel they're nothing new. And as for them being "the choice" in Europe, most washers (if you're fortunate enough to have one) are found installed next to the toilet or the kitchen sink. "Compact" is a polite way to characterize them, "puny" is more accurate.</span>

twintubdexter-2018070414520402549_1.jpg
 
I didn't mean to imply that you can't get your clothes clean with either method, but a traditional U.S. top-loader can do it in less time due to it's use of brute force.

Yes, a front-loader needs more time. It also will benefit more from an internal heater since a front loader holds less water, and washes for a longer time.

Then there's the fact that most U.S. homes have a water heater that stores 30+ gallons of 140f+ water ready for use.

Front loaders rinse at least twice? Well they'd better, since they do each rinse with so much less water.

A Traditional U.S. top loader also rinses twice, first a spray rinse during the first spin, then a deep rinse.[this post was last edited: 7/4/2018-18:32]
 
It is only MODERN front loader that take more time. Early (up to the 80's)front loaders washed in the same amount of time as top loaders. Up to 15 to 20 minute wash on normal cycle, with rinses about 30 to 35 minutes to complete the cycle. They tumbled in one direction(not stopping every few turns to reverse which takes time) and didn't bother with balancing the load they just went into spin. When done the clothes were very clean and if loaded properly not too knotted into a rope( well not worse than Fridgidare).Jeb
 
Most front-loaders until recently used lots of water to rinse, but a single deep rinse after a spray in the spin is simply not enough. Even with two deep rinses, the SQs don't rinse that well. They're OK for lightly-soiled stuff, but if you need to really clean and sanitise properly dirty stuff, they're not up to the job.

The best front-loaders, other than the 1950s Bendixes, were always those of European manufacture (we'll ignore the fairly woeful Westinghouse designs). Find an old 1960s AEG or Miele, and you'll find a machine with vigorous reversing action (tumbling, soaking and dropping is far more effective than the gentle rollover of most top-loaders, pace Frigidaire), that fills with cold water, heats it internally to temperatures up to 95 celsius (Constructa, Bauknecht, Brocke and possibly others went up to a full 100 celsius boil-wash), and you generally get four or five deep rinses with loads of water. The wash portion of the cycle alone will be about 45 minutes to an hour, because that's what you need to sanitise effectively, killing dust mites, bacteria etc. The whole job will take about two hours.

The one agitator top-loader that sold well this side of the Atlantic was the Hotpoint 24" variant of the GE Filter-Flo design. Guess what? They had onboard heaters, spun at up to 1100rpm and would do a 95-celsius boil wash...
 
Rinsing

That a certain rinse sequence is the best is just plain wrong. Lots of factors play into different rinse considerations.

First and formost, while it seams illogical, water isn't the main ingredient in rinsing, extractions is.
Sure you can rinse well with dozens of gallons of water, but most modern washers can rinse remarkably well with verry little water.

The trick can be mathematicly explained:
Each rinse is a dilution phase. Lets say, at the end of a wash portion a fictional load of laundry contrains the amount 1 of water which has a detergent concentration of 1. So our overall amout of detergent in the laundry is 1 (concentration times amount).

Let's say the washer adds twice the amount of water the laundry holds. That would mean our 1 detergent is now diluted in 3 parts of water. Thus, the concentration drops to 1/3.
After the drain, our laundry still holds 1 water, with 1/3 detergent concentration, so 1/3 detergent total.

For the next repeat of that, that would be 1/9, then 1/27, then 1/81, then 1/243.

After an average final spin, let's say, about 1/4th of water remains in the load.
So after that spin, about 1/1000th of detergent stays in the load

So after 5 rinses, we have 1/243 of detergent left in the load of laundry.

Starting with the same 1 detergent concentration and 1 water after the wash, we now place an average spin before the first rinse.

Let's say out cotton load retains about athird of the water after an average spin.
So now, the amount of water in the load is 1/3 and the amount of detergent is 1/3 as well.

To resaturate the load, we need 2/3 of water and this time, the washer only adds 1 water for the rinse.
So a the end of the first rinse, we have 1/3 of detergent dissolved in 2 water, so a concentration of 1/6 and after the drain 1 water and 1/6 detergent in the load.

After the second interim spin, we have 1/3rd of 1/6, so 1/18 of detergent in the load.

After the next rinse, there is only 1/36 in the load, and after the spin, only 1/108.

Repeat the rinse, we are at 1/216.

With an equal final spin, at the end, there is 1/880 of detergent left in the load.

So I sacrifice 12% rinse performance, but I only use about half the water. Adding another rinse makes my rinse results far surperior while still using less water.

(These numbers are just wild guesses and are ment to drive a point home).

Thus a good rinsing sequence starts with proper extraction.
However, especially after hot washes or with certain clothing, too intense extraction can cause wrinkels or push dirt back into fibres.
It's impirtant as well that as little foam as possible is produced during extraction. Thus properly stepped spinning is verry important.

Actually, most Miele machines since the 70s or 80s already use a compromize: Their motor technology dosen't allow for propper stepped spinning. Thus, to keep suds production during the first interim spin down, they use 2 rinses before they spin for the first time. Then they follow that up with 2 more rinses and interim spins.

Spray rinses work best with thin, flat fibres. Thick, bushy fibres absorb a lot of water in the fibres themselfes and not between them.
Spray rinses can be imagined in the was that the spray away what is stuck between the fibres, but not what is stuck within them.
Fibres which keep a lot of water inside them need agitated rinses to work the detergent out of the fibres.

The amount of water needed also greatly varies.
Bigger water quantities do give better dilution and allow for quicker rinses as water can be worked through the laundry much faster.
As some fibres need lots of water working to release the detergent, some fibres need more water for proper rinsing by nature.
Some bulky items just need big quantities of water to allow for proper dilution action due to their size.
But many everyday fibres need verry little water to saturate them and to work them through properly.

So, for example, typical cotton flat weaved iteams like most underwear, most types of shirts, most socks can be pretty well rinsed with verry little water verry quickly and efficently.

More absorbent cotton like sweatwear, towels and more rugged items like jeans need proper extraction and a little more water with longer rinses.

Thin, flat synthetic items will rinse perfectly in verry little water with verry short rinsing times as plastic can't really absorb water.

Microfibre items however store huge amounts of water and release it only when pushed to do. So those need lots of water often with verry particular extraction.
 
what i have heard wensday

here what I have heard said by a service tech himself sometime its best to keep and have repaired the old set rather than buy a new set washers today are also like computers when they sense fill for the main wash they analyse in order to put the right amount of water compared to older machines that have a water level in term of top load from large to small washer model changes over the years and also before I forget if your in the market to buy a new washer you need to chose the one that fits your needs in term of cycle everyday use.
 
Extraction & rinsing

 

 

This is one reason why I really like my Kenmore He5t FL, it does full speed spins between the wash / rinses.  Granted I don't wash super grungy items on a regular basis, but it cleans everything really well.  

 

I have a MT Neptune 6500 and I need reconnect it and confirm, but I've got a strong hunch it doesn't spin (only drains) after the wash before filling for the first rinse.  I do know it spins after each rinse however.

 

I used to have an older "GE" compact TL washer (built by Hitachi) with a spinning impeller  at the bottom of the tub.  While it's a neat older washer, it would only drain & refill after the wash and first 2 rinses, the only time it spins is after the 3rd rinse.  I rarely used it because of this.

Kevin 
 
My 2005 Miele W2240 spins before and after all rinses. So did the old 410/412/416 and 420/421 Deluxe machines of the 60s and early 70s. Ditto the old AEG Lavamats.
 
So in the regard of effective rinsing without excessive water usage the old US Bendix and Westys had their European FL cousins beat! A suds kill, a spin, a rinse, another spin, and another rinse and a final spin.
 
Henene4 - I shall have to look up some more videos, but I've definitely seen 420s and 421s that spun before every rinse, ditto the old AEG Lavamat Nova/Regina/Deluxe with the backlit controls...
 
Yeah, I used a small 's' to indicate plural, not a suffix - 420 was called "De Luxe" I believe? Then there was the 520 - was that just a rebadge? And the 421 seemed to go through a few changes, different doors for a start.
 
My W423 from 1977 doesn’t spin after the wash or first 2 rinses. It only spins after the last 3.

The W723 from the 1990s also doesn’t spin until the last few rinses either.

I’m not 100% sure but it was only when they went to 2-3 rinses in the 1900 or 2000 series that they began spinning after every rinse. That was the late 90s early 2000s
 
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