bendixmark
Well-known member
sealant
You want to use clear non flowing silicone that blue stuff wont last.
You want to use clear non flowing silicone that blue stuff wont last.
70's Lady Kenmore Agitator Removal
- Thread starter flyingethan
- Start date
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flyingethan
Active member
Good to know about the silicone.
I have the machine completely apart. Appliance Express in Arizona is getting into the machines that they have outside to see if what they have is in better condition than what I have. They will let me know next week.
I am dropping off my base, and tub at the machine shop on Monday. They said that they can slide a new piece of thin wall stainless steel tubing over the existing center post and weld it to the base and the top of the center post thus sealing the rusty exterior of the existing center post. Hopefully this will prevent further rust while adding strength to the center post and provide a nice clean surface for the tub seal to slide over. I hope it works.
They also said that they might be able to fabricate a new center post hole for the tub out of a piece of steel and weld it either over the old hole or cut out the old hole and weld in a new piece. If they can do that than they will also be able to weld over the rust spot adjacent to the air dome. I am concerned that they won't be able to do it because of the porcelain coating in the tub. We'll see.
Now I have another question. How do you get the bleach tube off of the tub without breaking it? And, how to you get the lint filter off of the tub?
I have the machine completely apart. Appliance Express in Arizona is getting into the machines that they have outside to see if what they have is in better condition than what I have. They will let me know next week.
I am dropping off my base, and tub at the machine shop on Monday. They said that they can slide a new piece of thin wall stainless steel tubing over the existing center post and weld it to the base and the top of the center post thus sealing the rusty exterior of the existing center post. Hopefully this will prevent further rust while adding strength to the center post and provide a nice clean surface for the tub seal to slide over. I hope it works.
They also said that they might be able to fabricate a new center post hole for the tub out of a piece of steel and weld it either over the old hole or cut out the old hole and weld in a new piece. If they can do that than they will also be able to weld over the rust spot adjacent to the air dome. I am concerned that they won't be able to do it because of the porcelain coating in the tub. We'll see.
Now I have another question. How do you get the bleach tube off of the tub without breaking it? And, how to you get the lint filter off of the tub?
Great progress on a Leaky LKM Washer
The thin SS tube over the center-post works great, we have done it on four washers so far.
It is easy to remove the lint filter, you just unscrew the pot-metal ring on the inside of the outer-tub and the filter lifts off. I would replace the LF while you are doing all this work, the new filter comes with new mounting nut and gasket as well.
The bleach hose can be softened [again] with boiling water or a heat gun and pushed in from the outside of the OT and cleaned and reinstalled with a good sealant.
The thin SS tube over the center-post works great, we have done it on four washers so far.
It is easy to remove the lint filter, you just unscrew the pot-metal ring on the inside of the outer-tub and the filter lifts off. I would replace the LF while you are doing all this work, the new filter comes with new mounting nut and gasket as well.
The bleach hose can be softened [again] with boiling water or a heat gun and pushed in from the outside of the OT and cleaned and reinstalled with a good sealant.
flyingethan
Active member
I brought my base and tub to the machine shop today and they think that they can install a thin-walled stainless steel sleeve over the old center post and repair the holes in my tub. I'm excited and looking forward to seeing the finished product.
However, the rubber seal/ boot at the very top of the center post (I can't locate it on the parts diagram at Sears Parts Direct) will have to be pulled out because the heat of welding the new stainless steel sleeve will melt that seal/ boot.
How do you un-install that rubber seal/ boot on the top of the center post?
It looks like it's function is simply to keep water from entering the top of the center post between the center post and the gear case outer drive shaft.
Does it just pop in and out or do you need to use a special tool to "press" it in? The "center post upper drive bearing" (part # 54207) is metal so I am not worried about that being affected by the heat of welding. I just need to know how that rubber seal/ boot goes in because I will have to replace it if I can find another one or re-use the old one if I can get it out in one piece.
Any other rubber seals in the center post that I should be concerned about during the welding process?
Combo52, when you have had a SS tube installed over an existing center post did you have the top of the sleeve welded to the center post as well as the bottom or did you leave the top un-welded so as to not affect the rubber boot/seal at the top of the shaft?
On the tub, the center post hole is being cut out and replaced with a piece of steel flush welded in and the hole being cut into the new piece of steel. The machine shop is not sure if they can re-create the lip that is part of the original hole but they will try. If the tub center post hole does not have that flanged lip I am a little concerned that I may have a difficult time creating a good seal between the tub and the center post via the washer tub seal (part # 356934). At least it will be better than what I have now.
However, the rubber seal/ boot at the very top of the center post (I can't locate it on the parts diagram at Sears Parts Direct) will have to be pulled out because the heat of welding the new stainless steel sleeve will melt that seal/ boot.
How do you un-install that rubber seal/ boot on the top of the center post?
It looks like it's function is simply to keep water from entering the top of the center post between the center post and the gear case outer drive shaft.
Does it just pop in and out or do you need to use a special tool to "press" it in? The "center post upper drive bearing" (part # 54207) is metal so I am not worried about that being affected by the heat of welding. I just need to know how that rubber seal/ boot goes in because I will have to replace it if I can find another one or re-use the old one if I can get it out in one piece.
Any other rubber seals in the center post that I should be concerned about during the welding process?
Combo52, when you have had a SS tube installed over an existing center post did you have the top of the sleeve welded to the center post as well as the bottom or did you leave the top un-welded so as to not affect the rubber boot/seal at the top of the shaft?
On the tub, the center post hole is being cut out and replaced with a piece of steel flush welded in and the hole being cut into the new piece of steel. The machine shop is not sure if they can re-create the lip that is part of the original hole but they will try. If the tub center post hole does not have that flanged lip I am a little concerned that I may have a difficult time creating a good seal between the tub and the center post via the washer tub seal (part # 356934). At least it will be better than what I have now.
flyingethan
Active member
After further inspection of the parts diagram it looks like the seal/ boot that is in the top of the center post is actually called the "washer tub seal" (part # 356934). It looks like it just pushes in to the top of the center post.
Also, I can't tell if the seal at the bottom of the center post will be affected by heat of welding. It looks like that seal is just called a "seal" (part # 54209). I'll just have to wait and see if it is still good after my base gets fixed.
The seal between the center post and the tub is called a "washer door boot" (part # 96690). I actually already have a new one of those ready to be installed when the base and tub are done.
I'm excited about the possibility of actually being able to keep my washer in working condition. Fingers crossed.
Also, I can't tell if the seal at the bottom of the center post will be affected by heat of welding. It looks like that seal is just called a "seal" (part # 54209). I'll just have to wait and see if it is still good after my base gets fixed.
The seal between the center post and the tub is called a "washer door boot" (part # 96690). I actually already have a new one of those ready to be installed when the base and tub are done.
I'm excited about the possibility of actually being able to keep my washer in working condition. Fingers crossed.
flyingethan
Active member
Update! I just thought that I would share some of my progress with y'all.
I've posted a picture of what the rim of my tub looked like yesterday and what it looks like today. Those big holes are gone and the patched area looks fantastic. I'm very stoked.
I figured out answers to some of my own questions that I posted above. The washer tub seal that is in the top of the center post does just pop out. Putting in a new one won't be a problem. The bottom seal for the center post is the same way as far as I can tell.
My machine shop guy said that he can't find stainless steel tubing the correct size to weld on over my old center post. However, he has steel tubing that does fit. So, that's what I will do then I will coat it with POR15 when it's done.
I'll post more pics when the parts are finished being repaired.
I've posted a picture of what the rim of my tub looked like yesterday and what it looks like today. Those big holes are gone and the patched area looks fantastic. I'm very stoked.
I figured out answers to some of my own questions that I posted above. The washer tub seal that is in the top of the center post does just pop out. Putting in a new one won't be a problem. The bottom seal for the center post is the same way as far as I can tell.
My machine shop guy said that he can't find stainless steel tubing the correct size to weld on over my old center post. However, he has steel tubing that does fit. So, that's what I will do then I will coat it with POR15 when it's done.
I'll post more pics when the parts are finished being repaired.
flyingethan
Active member
Combo52,
Where did you buy your stainless steel tubing from? The machine shop that I am using can't find the correct size tubing in stainless steel.
Where did you buy your stainless steel tubing from? The machine shop that I am using can't find the correct size tubing in stainless steel.
flyingethan
Active member
Another question for everyone. Do you think it's a good idea to add/ change my gear case oil while I have the washer apart?
I've never noticed it leaking any oil. I see what looks like a drain plug on the the gear case. Looks like the natural place to drain and replace the oil.
I've never noticed it leaking any oil. I see what looks like a drain plug on the the gear case. Looks like the natural place to drain and replace the oil.
Rebuilding A KM Washer
Hi Ethan, Great progress, You may want to change the oil but there may be several even important things that you should be doing if you want to possibly get upwards of another 20 years use out of this washer.
My Friend Smitty got us around 4 feet of the thin wall SS tubing from a supplier in NJ, I will talk to him shortly and see if he can figure out where it came from, I would like to get some more myself as I have at least another dozen BD WP-KM washers that I want to rebuild in the future as well as rebuilding some for other folks in the group. You would be much better off with SS tubing, the orignal center post was heavily plated to prevent rust, the problem with just painting it is if you get even a tiny gap in the paint it may rust pretty fast. The other way we have talked about preserving these old center posts was to cover them with a vinyl-plastic type sheath. My vacuum cleaner butty Jason has said that it might be possible to get heat shrink tubing large enough to cover a center post and shrink it in place over the center post old or new to protect it from water. I will ask him about this as well when I see him a little later.
There is no drain plug on the transmission for oil changing purposes, I can tell you how to check the oil quantity and quality so you can determine if it is really necessary.
If you send me an Email with your phone# and best time to call I can describe in much better detail, John L.
Hi Ethan, Great progress, You may want to change the oil but there may be several even important things that you should be doing if you want to possibly get upwards of another 20 years use out of this washer.
My Friend Smitty got us around 4 feet of the thin wall SS tubing from a supplier in NJ, I will talk to him shortly and see if he can figure out where it came from, I would like to get some more myself as I have at least another dozen BD WP-KM washers that I want to rebuild in the future as well as rebuilding some for other folks in the group. You would be much better off with SS tubing, the orignal center post was heavily plated to prevent rust, the problem with just painting it is if you get even a tiny gap in the paint it may rust pretty fast. The other way we have talked about preserving these old center posts was to cover them with a vinyl-plastic type sheath. My vacuum cleaner butty Jason has said that it might be possible to get heat shrink tubing large enough to cover a center post and shrink it in place over the center post old or new to protect it from water. I will ask him about this as well when I see him a little later.
There is no drain plug on the transmission for oil changing purposes, I can tell you how to check the oil quantity and quality so you can determine if it is really necessary.
If you send me an Email with your phone# and best time to call I can describe in much better detail, John L.
kb0nes
Well-known member
What is the outside diameter of the center post? I'm guessing it is a bit over 2". In this size range 304SS tube is still stepping in 1/8" increments for the most part. Give me the diameter and I will find a source. There are many online metal retailers today so the options are great, even for small quantities.
The heat shrinkable tube idea seems like a excellent way to extend the life of the center post. I looked at Raychem and 3M to see if they have an adhesive lined product but most stop at about 1" dia. If you coated the center post with a good adhesive before shrinking that should keep the water out. The center post on Ethan's machine may need a bit more support then the heat shrink tubing though.
The heat shrinkable tube idea seems like a excellent way to extend the life of the center post. I looked at Raychem and 3M to see if they have an adhesive lined product but most stop at about 1" dia. If you coated the center post with a good adhesive before shrinking that should keep the water out. The center post on Ethan's machine may need a bit more support then the heat shrink tubing though.
flyingethan
Active member
I measured the outer diameter of the center post at 1 3/4 inches. The machine shop just called me and said that my parts are ready. I plan on picking them up tomorrow. I will post pics when I get the parts back (the tub and base).
I am thinking that painting the post with POR 15 might be good enough. However, I like the idea of applying heat shrink around it. Especially if I use an adhesive and shrink up the material before the adhesive dries. Then when it dries that heat shrink would really be bonded to the post. That is a good idea. I also like the idea of sealing the top and bottom, where the heat shrink ends, with silicone which will really keep the water out. I've yet to find the right size heat shrink but I will keep looking.
I am thinking that painting the post with POR 15 might be good enough. However, I like the idea of applying heat shrink around it. Especially if I use an adhesive and shrink up the material before the adhesive dries. Then when it dries that heat shrink would really be bonded to the post. That is a good idea. I also like the idea of sealing the top and bottom, where the heat shrink ends, with silicone which will really keep the water out. I've yet to find the right size heat shrink but I will keep looking.
flyingethan
Active member
Check out my tub and base. They came out very good. The machine shop used cold rolled steel just bigger than the original center post. They milled the outer diameter of the cold rolled steel tube down to a thickness that would accept the center post tub seal. Then they welded it to the base just past that first relief where the original center post is mounted through (I hope that makes sense) to give it structural integrity. At the top of the post they welded it to the original post, filled it in and ground it flat to the same height as the original center post. The "new" post is a little bit thicker than the old post but is strong and solid.
I have all new seals for the center post and the tub for when I put it back together.
The machine shop repaired the big holes on the rim of the tub (the area where the water inlet sprays the water into the tub/ basket) and the small hole next to the air dome. They cut out the old center post hole and welded in a new steel plate. They cut the correct size hole in the new steel and even created a lip to seat the tub onto the tub seal.
I am very happy with the results. All in all it cost less than I though it would. Especially considering that these parts are N/A.
I have the POR 15 (as well as the de-greaser and metal prep) ready to go. I sanded the base down and I am ready to paint it as soon as I get some dry days (it's been raining here for a while). I got all of that hardened soap scum off of the bottom of the tub and I will paint the exposed metal areas and the small surface rust areas with POR 15 of the tub as well.
I plan on painting a few small areas of the inside of the washer cabinet with POR 15 as well. There are a few small surface rust areas that probably won't cause any future problems but I might as well take care of everything since I have it apart.
I will update when I get the parts painted.
I have all new seals for the center post and the tub for when I put it back together.
The machine shop repaired the big holes on the rim of the tub (the area where the water inlet sprays the water into the tub/ basket) and the small hole next to the air dome. They cut out the old center post hole and welded in a new steel plate. They cut the correct size hole in the new steel and even created a lip to seat the tub onto the tub seal.
I am very happy with the results. All in all it cost less than I though it would. Especially considering that these parts are N/A.
I have the POR 15 (as well as the de-greaser and metal prep) ready to go. I sanded the base down and I am ready to paint it as soon as I get some dry days (it's been raining here for a while). I got all of that hardened soap scum off of the bottom of the tub and I will paint the exposed metal areas and the small surface rust areas with POR 15 of the tub as well.
I plan on painting a few small areas of the inside of the washer cabinet with POR 15 as well. There are a few small surface rust areas that probably won't cause any future problems but I might as well take care of everything since I have it apart.
I will update when I get the parts painted.
flyingethan
Active member
Nothing new to report. I have been inundated with life so I haven't had the time to continue my project. I hope to continue working on my washer this weekend.
Appliance Express in Airzona is still trying to locate the parts that I need. I have already fixed the parts that I have but I figured I would buy the extras from them if they are in good shape just to have as a backup. We'll see if they come up with the parts.
Appliance Express in Airzona is still trying to locate the parts that I need. I have already fixed the parts that I have but I figured I would buy the extras from them if they are in good shape just to have as a backup. We'll see if they come up with the parts.
The Lady Kenmore Rebuild
It was fun talking to you the other week Ethan, it is always nice to meet other folks that get excited about restoring vintage machines.
I have lots of projects that are on hold, so when you get to it let us all know.
John L.
It was fun talking to you the other week Ethan, it is always nice to meet other folks that get excited about restoring vintage machines.
I have lots of projects that are on hold, so when you get to it let us all know.
John L.
flyingethan
Active member
Hey everybody! First of all I want to give a shout out to Combo52 (John L.). John talked to me on the phone and gave me lots of good advice. Thanks John.
My washer is put back together and working beautifully! If you've been following my project I had serious rust issues on my center post, tub and basket. I had the center post and tub welded on which did wonders. I took my washer completely apart and went through just about everything. I POR 15'd just about all of the tub, basket and the base. If fact, I painted the entire base and basket. We'll see how that works out. I used all new seals on everything and used 100% silicone on all points that could leak. I greased all of the parts that needed to be greased and put it all back together.
My washer is working like new. It's quiet, smooth and leak free. I'm very happy. It's like getting a brand new 1977 Lady K.
Check out my pic of my washer back in it's natural habitat. This forum is awesome and I very much appreciate everyone's help.
I'll post a vid later. I took video of me testing my washer in my driveway and I filmed everything working. Now I can't find that video. That sucks because it showed everything all clean and pretty. O well.
My washer is put back together and working beautifully! If you've been following my project I had serious rust issues on my center post, tub and basket. I had the center post and tub welded on which did wonders. I took my washer completely apart and went through just about everything. I POR 15'd just about all of the tub, basket and the base. If fact, I painted the entire base and basket. We'll see how that works out. I used all new seals on everything and used 100% silicone on all points that could leak. I greased all of the parts that needed to be greased and put it all back together.
My washer is working like new. It's quiet, smooth and leak free. I'm very happy. It's like getting a brand new 1977 Lady K.
Check out my pic of my washer back in it's natural habitat. This forum is awesome and I very much appreciate everyone's help.
I'll post a vid later. I took video of me testing my washer in my driveway and I filmed everything working. Now I can't find that video. That sucks because it showed everything all clean and pretty. O well.
flyingethan
Active member
I found my video. My voice is pretty low so it's hard to hear what I am saying. The water that you see on the machine is because I had failed to hook up one hose and it got water on some of the washer. But there are no leaks and it works good. The agitator is brand new and it does ratchet back when clothes are in the washer. In the video the agitator is not ratcheting due to the lack of clothes.
I can't figure out how to post video's here. Anyone know how to do that?
View attachment flyingethan++7-5-2015-19-15-46.jpg
I can't figure out how to post video's here. Anyone know how to do that?
View attachment flyingethan++7-5-2015-19-15-46.jpg
Ethan, that was quite a successful project and what a beautiful set you have. (I hope someone responds to your question about how to post videos on this site -- I haven't been able to figure it out, either!) Awesome job!
Videos can't be uploaded directly like pictures. Best is place them on a YouTube account. View your video at YouTube and copy/paste the URL into your AW post. AW is coded to recognize YouTube URLs and will automatically embed the clip into the post.
70series
Well-known member
Congratulations on getting that fantastic set up and running again! I look forward to the video.
Yay Ethan
Glad you stuck with this project and got it all done, it is always great to see a restoration project finished. I hope you get many good years out of this washer.
I would love to have the black lid for the Triple-Dispenser that you have on your machine for a black pair I have, let me know if you would consider trading it for an Avocado one, Thanks John L.
Glad you stuck with this project and got it all done, it is always great to see a restoration project finished. I hope you get many good years out of this washer.
I would love to have the black lid for the Triple-Dispenser that you have on your machine for a black pair I have, let me know if you would consider trading it for an Avocado one, Thanks John L.
flyingethan
Active member
Thanks everyone.
Combo52, John L., I would love to trade for an avocado lid for the triple dispenser. However, mine is not black. Actually it was white and I painted it black. If you still want to trade let me know.
I will work on the video.
Combo52, John L., I would love to trade for an avocado lid for the triple dispenser. However, mine is not black. Actually it was white and I painted it black. If you still want to trade let me know.
I will work on the video.
76 LKM Washer
Oh, I have a black one the is worn looking, and I had already considered painting it, I will still keep a lookout for an Avocado one, I think that I do have a good used one somewhere, I will let you know if I find it.
Oh, I have a black one the is worn looking, and I had already considered painting it, I will still keep a lookout for an Avocado one, I think that I do have a good used one somewhere, I will let you know if I find it.
flyingethan
Active member
Okay, here's one youtube video. I am in the process of loading another one. Enjoy!
fester
Well-known member
Thin wall tubing and other useful things
I've had great luck at freeing rusty, stuck parts with either PB Blaster or better still, Aerokroil. It's like WD40 on steroids. TEST ON A SPOT TO BE SURE IT DOESNT REACT WITH YOUR PLASTIC PARTS! It usually doesn't, but better safe than sorry. Also, have you all checked with a custom muffler shop for the stainless steel tubing? 1 3/4" O.D. tubing is a fairly common size for bikes and imports. Their is also an online vendor of exhaust tubing in both stainless and inconell. I'll post a link if I can find it.
I've had great luck at freeing rusty, stuck parts with either PB Blaster or better still, Aerokroil. It's like WD40 on steroids. TEST ON A SPOT TO BE SURE IT DOESNT REACT WITH YOUR PLASTIC PARTS! It usually doesn't, but better safe than sorry. Also, have you all checked with a custom muffler shop for the stainless steel tubing? 1 3/4" O.D. tubing is a fairly common size for bikes and imports. Their is also an online vendor of exhaust tubing in both stainless and inconell. I'll post a link if I can find it.
flyingethan
Active member
Here is my second vid:
FEster,
I checked and the machine shop guy checked all over the country and we struck out. I am sure that the correct size diameter stainless steel tubing is out there but I couldn't find it. I could have it milled but that could get a bit pricey. My machine shop guy used a slightly bigger (like a sixteenth or eighth inch bigger) diameter size stainless steel tubing. He did a fantastic job of welding it at the base and top. It looks absolutely factory. And it's strong. I also had him weld in (build up) metal where it was missing on my tub. That also came out excellent. All of that only cost me $350. I consider that a deal since those parts are darn near un-obtanium in good condition. Anyways, I used the recommended process for applying POR15 to everything (the same process that body shops use by sanding/ grinding where I needed to, using the correct metal cleaner/ de-greaser, metal prep and painting temps and dry times). So far, so good.
FEster,
I checked and the machine shop guy checked all over the country and we struck out. I am sure that the correct size diameter stainless steel tubing is out there but I couldn't find it. I could have it milled but that could get a bit pricey. My machine shop guy used a slightly bigger (like a sixteenth or eighth inch bigger) diameter size stainless steel tubing. He did a fantastic job of welding it at the base and top. It looks absolutely factory. And it's strong. I also had him weld in (build up) metal where it was missing on my tub. That also came out excellent. All of that only cost me $350. I consider that a deal since those parts are darn near un-obtanium in good condition. Anyways, I used the recommended process for applying POR15 to everything (the same process that body shops use by sanding/ grinding where I needed to, using the correct metal cleaner/ de-greaser, metal prep and painting temps and dry times). So far, so good.
fester
Well-known member
Stainless tubing
Next time try stainlessheaders .com , burnsstainless.com or globaltecheng.com . Even Summit Racing and Jegs performance have some sizes, but not all gauges / wall thickness choices. These links aren't to the same place I was originally talking about. I can't seem to find the saved link for that, but they should have something that will get you where you need to be.
Next time try stainlessheaders .com , burnsstainless.com or globaltecheng.com . Even Summit Racing and Jegs performance have some sizes, but not all gauges / wall thickness choices. These links aren't to the same place I was originally talking about. I can't seem to find the saved link for that, but they should have something that will get you where you need to be.
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