American vs. European Washers and Dryers

[MrX]

European standards

Almost all European countries (except the UK and Ireland) use 16 amp 230V outlets. The circuits supplying these outlets are usually either 16 or 20A radials (star configuration) and are also protected by an RCD (GFCI)

(broadly similar to the way things are wired in the USA, just with 230V rather than 120)

The UK and Ireland adopted a rather odd and different approach:

Outlets (Sockets) are usually connected to a 32A "ring circuit" which operates a bit like a power bus serving a number of rooms. The circuit is connected to the breaker at both ends (i.e. it's fed with power from both ends). The outlets basically tap into this power bus.

Every plug in the UK and Ireland carries an individual fuse rated 1 to 13amps depending on the rating of the applience. This fuse protects the appliance and its cord from overcurrent faults.

Any applience that is "hardwired" must be connected via a "fused spur" which is basically a wall plate with the same fusing arrangement as a UK plug.

Most installations are also protected by an RCD (GFCI)

The advantage of this system is that any outlet can provide its maximum rated 13Amps without having to have too many dedicated radial circuits.
It makes wiring a little less complicated.

Also, because each plug carries a fuse, it's possible to have much more accurate protection of small appliances e.g. a lamp might have a 3amp fuse while a washer would have 13A)

The fuse provides the over-current / overload protection while the RCD on the panel provides shock protection.

-----

Because the UK and Ireland (as well as one or two other European countries) use outlets that cannot provide the full 16Amps (the general european standard) appliances often use clever power management software to slightly reduce the maximum load! (this is certainly true of some miele appliances) others simply use slightly lower power heaters in their UK / Ireland versions.

In general however, most appliances sold in Europe don't go above 3KW which works in all countries.

 

[MrX]

Also regarding the UK plugs and outlets vs. the "schuko" normal european grounded outlets.

The UK outlets originally needed a swich as it was very easy to touch the live pins while inserting / removing a plug. European outlets are recessed making it completely impossible to touch the pins. Thus, there is absolutely no need for a switch.

A European directive required the introduction of sheathed pins (they're partially covered in plastic) making it very difficult to get a shock from a modern UK plug.

The switches on outlets haven't been a requirement for a VERY long time, but people generally seem to prefer to keep them as they can be quite a handy feature. Many outlets are unswitched though.

Also, because European schuko outlets are recessed, most of the pin surface can be used to make contact. In a UK or US outlet the pins only make contact when almost fully inserted, this is because the outlet is not recessed it would be possible to touch the pins until that point. So, only the tips of the pins really make any connection. This reduces the surface area making contact and can result in hot pins / burn marks on outlets / etc.. It's not unusual to see a brown ring around the hot side of a UK outlet that's used to power heavy appliances e.g. electric kettles (3KW) ... particularly as the outlet ages and the contacts become looser!

On the safety comparison: While the UK may have earthing as standard since the introduction of the current plug/socket system in the 1950s the standard of wiring in a typical UK home can be quite low in comparison to many northern European countries where regulation of electrical work is far stricter.

E.g. old UK panels had re-wirable fuses. i.e. if a fuse blew you replaced it, not with a cartridge or a screw in fuse, but with a peice of fuse wire! (these are still common in the UK... [ireland used the standard german screw-in cartridge system]

Rewirable fuses simply don't exist and haven't existed since the 1920s in most other countries!

Regulation and inspection of electrical installations is also not as strict as it is elsewhere in Europe and electrical work, can in theory, be carried out by pretty much anyone who is reasonably competant.

Many othe European countries also have much much tighter requirements for RCDs (GFCIs) e.g. in Ireland ALL outlets must be protected by an RCD (that's been in force since the late 1970s)

So, really it depends how you look at it, while the UK plug and socket may in some ways be well designed and some aspects of the system may be quite good. In other areas it's far from the safest system in the world!

(Also regarding grounding / earthing.. European plugs don't use a ground pin, they use scraping contacts at the top and bottom of the plug which make contact with two springs on the recessed outlet. Or, alternatively (in france) the outlets have a grounding pin sticking out which fits a receiving hole in the front of the plug. The same plug works with both systems!)

 

[MrX]

for those of you who have never seen one

European grounded outlet CEE 7/4 (Originally German standard)

Used in almost all of Europe (variation in France which is still compatable)

Not used in : UK, Ireland, Italy, Switzerland and Denmark.

Used: Everywhere else including the entire former soviet union!

Basically the defacto standard.

 

[MrX]

The French variation

Used in France, Belgium and a couple of eastern european countries

CEE 7/5

Works with the standard european grounded plug, so no incompatablilty issues.

 

[MrX]

And absolutely finally... the UK fused plug

And finally, my last bit of international electrical systems education!

The UK fused plug (this is where the fuse goes in)

 

[yaktx]

U.S. voltage/current

Actually, the specified method of calculation uses 120/240 as the standard voltage. 120*20=2400.

The 80% rule applies to "continuous" loads (3 hours or longer), and cord-and-plug connected loads. This is not always followed to the letter. My Whirlpool heavy-duty dryer states 23A heater, 4A motor. That's 27A on one leg. 27*1.25=33.75, yet it is cord-and-plug connected on a 30A circuit. It's rare to see a dryer that isn't. Of course I never run it on high, so it's more like 24A most of the time.

Manufacturers are free to overstate nameplate load and have a variety of reasons for doing so. My '98 Frigemore (Gibson brand, BTW) lists 12A. Actual amps: 6 on fast spin, 9 surge. I suspect the reason is that the Code has rules about dedicated circuits. 80% of circuit capacity max, so 12A maxes out a 15A circuit. More than 50%, and a dedicated circuit is required. 12*2>20. So don't bother calling Electrolux (or WCI, that's what my machine says) if your breaker trips because you plugged in your gas dryer to the same outlet. The Code says you are breaking the rules!

There is no design rule stating that a washer and gas dryer must be able to share a 20A circuit. The National Electrical Code does not explicitly mandate a second circuit installed for a gas dryer, but many local codes do (if there is a gas valve installed at the same location). It is always a good idea.

Incidentally, anybody see any new hairdryers rated less than 1875 watts? A 120V 15A outlet is actually rated 125V, 15A, so the manufacturers get creative and say 125*15=1875. Sounds more powerful, but if your wall gives you 120V, you are going to get 1800W.

Oh, and get those vacuums. They figured out that "POWERFUL 12 AMP MOTOR!!!!" sounds much more sexy than "POWERFUL 1/3 HP MOTOR!!!!"

 

[toggleswitch]

More examples of voltge and socket configurations.

Try the link!

http://kropla.com/electric2.htm

 

[kenmore1978]

30 amp dryer outlet

"The 80% rule applies to "continuous" loads (3 hours or longer), and cord-and-plug connected loads. This is not always followed to the letter. My Whirlpool heavy-duty dryer states 23A heater, 4A motor. That's 27A on one leg. 27*1.25=33.75, yet it is cord-and-plug connected on a 30A circuit. It's rare to see a dryer that isn't. Of course I never run it on high, so it's more like 24A most of the time."

Actually, the heater is split between TWO legs of the 230 volt circuit. The motor and controls will be on one leg or the other, so one leg will be loaded a little more than the other

 

[Cybrvanr]

Many of the times, the ampere rating is designed to protect not just the outlet, but also the WIRING between the outlet and the breaker (or fuse) box.

I worked a job at the school here where we first went into an auditorium and determined we would need a 30 ampere, 115 volt circuit to power the amplifiers for the surround-sound system they wanted. The room currently had a standard 15 ampere circuit common everywhere here in the USA.

We came back a week later to install the equipment and saw a 30 ampere outlet ready to go that we eventually connected up all the high-power audio amplifiers and other sound equipment to. After everything was in, we put a few CD's into the system and gave it a "test drive". When the music got loud, the amplifiers started cutting out and getting flakey. I determined that the amplifiers were overheating, so I checked speaker impedances and everything else. It came down to the fact that the amplifiers had a serious voltage drop across them whenever the sound would start cranking...but why?

The idiot electrician at the school simply used the existing piece of 14 gauge wire that was installed for the old 15 ampere circuit to make his so-called 30 ampere circuit by just replacing the breaker at the box with a 30, and changing the outlet from the standard outlet to the bigger 30 ampere plug!

Imagine if the amplifiers were not "smart" enough to shut down when the load got heavy! We could have had a major fire on our hands from overheated wire!

 

[MrX]

Doesn't sound good!

Are you sure that guy was an electrician?!

 

[MrX]

Here's the 16amp standard CEE 7/7

Found in almost all of Europe (Except UK, Ireland, Italy, Denmark and Switzerland)

(Italy is now adopting a comprimse standard that accepts Italian 3pin plugs and CEE 7/7 as many appliances ship with the CEE 7/7 rather than the italian plug fitted.)

All European outlets (except the UK and Ireland) accept a common 2-pin non-grounded flat plug used on small appliances.

View attachment 4-17-2005-12-12-9--Mrx.jpg

 

[toggleswitch]

bad bad electrician

That's almost as stupid as putting a penny behind a plug-type ("edison"?)fuse to prevent it from blowing. No protection to wires.

For our international friends, that copper coin (penny) allows the side contacts to be fed electricity from the back contact, and the threaded-in fuse (has threads in like an American light-bulb) just then holds the penny in place.

MAJOR no-no!!!

I think these are similar to "German-style" plug fuses mentioned earlier by another member.

 

[MrX]

The German style fuses (used in much of Europe) are called "Diazed" the newer compact version is "neozed"

They're a little bit different to the US edison fuses in so far as you can't overfuse a circuit without considerable "hacking".

There's a screw in fuse holder, into which you insert a beer bottle shaped fuse. The diameter of the tip of the fuse corresponds to its rating and a ring in the bottom of the fuse holder will only accept that size.

 

[MrX]

There's a European neozed and diazed panel side-by-side. The Neozed fuses are just miniturised so that they can be slotted into a modern sized panel.

As far as I know the system was developed by siemens or AEG in the early days of power distribution.

You can't really hack them quite as easily as a US plug-fuse with a coin!

When the fuse blows a little coloured disk appears in the window of the screw in fuse cap.

Similar, but not quite the same as a US Edison fuse.

Mostly breakers thesedays though!

 

[kenmore1978]

U.S

The original screw-in "Edison" type fuses were always a problem in that the different amp ratings had the same size scew threads, allowing over-fusing and the "penny" thing. They do make a type of screw-in fuse called Type S. These use adapters that screw into the Edison base reeptacles and have little prongs that keep them from being unscrewed. The threads in these adapters will then allow ONLY the correct rated fuse to be screwed into it, i.e, a 30 amp Type S fuse CANNOT be screwed into a 15 amp adapter. There was also, for a while, a product that was a circuit breaker constructed to screw into Edison base fuse receptacles, thereby converting fuses to circuit breakers. A button would pop out when the breaker tripped. I had these in a 1925 house I used to live in back in the 70's that still had the original 2 wire 30 amp 120 volt service in it.

 

[MrX]

Modern European Panel (French in this case)

Explanation of the numbered items:

1) Meter
2) Main Switch (to isolate entire home. It also provides very basic RCD/GFCI protection and overcurrent protection so you can't over load the service)
3) RCD (Residual Current Device) (Same as GFCI)... several of these on the panel.
4) Circuit Breakers
5) RCD (as explained above)
6) Lightening / Spike protection.
7) Emergency lamp (removes from the panel should the power go and you need to see!.. it charges while inserted)
8) "Energy management moduels" ... these control the temprature of heating (space and water) and make the best use of low night rate tarrifs for various appliances e.g. washers / dryers / dishwashers etc.
9) Water heater timer and remote switch.
10) Remote switching
11) Remote dimming
12) dial-in remote control unit.. you can phone up turn on lights/water/etc with a touchtone phone + pin.
13) Automatic window shutter controls (roller shutters, both manual and automatic are very common in france)

All european panels use the "DIN rail" system which allows you to add any number of modules to do all sorts of things. These kind of energy efficiency / home automation sollutions are becoming far more common.

A normal panel would still look similar and have all of the breakers and protective devices and perhaps fewer timers!

 

[toggleswitch]

Night rate tarrifs.

WOW. AN AMAZING FRENCH Electrical PANEL.

Anyone else have day /night rates ("Peak"/"Off-peak)?

Many areas (I have seen these in FL, MA and NY states) have electronic devices that turn off electric water heaters, the central air-conditioner and/or the pool filter. In exchange for the intrusion and inconvenience the power company grants the particular consumer a discount.

I think US power rates are highest in
HAWAII, then Long Island, then NYC. Anyone have a site or know about this?

Last I recall NYC was $0.12 (12 cents) per KwH (Before taxes)

 

[kenmore1978]

electric rates

try this link

http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electricity/epm/table5_6_a.html

 

[kenmore1978]

power rates

NY is high, but HI blows it away!

 

[MrX]

Night Rate

We've had night rate power in Ireland for many decades. Basically at midnight (or 11pm) the meter starts counting on a night rate dial.

Old installations had 2 meters and a huge time switch (the same size as a meter) that swapped meters at midnight without interrupting the supply obviously.

From the 1970s they just combined 2 dials into one meter the time switch just sent an impulse to tell it to switch dial.

and more recently the meters are digital and just store two sets of KWH counts for day and night rate.

You can buy washers, dryers and dishwashers that are designed to take advantage of night rate power. They've a delay timer on the control panel. You just select how many hours you want the machine to wait before starting.

The main use of night rate power here remains "storage heating". Your house had "storage heaters" which are basically electric heaters full of special heat-retaining bricks. At night, the elements come on and heat the bricks up (taking advantage of the night rate power). The heater then, using dampers and fans, controls how much heat's given out during the day and uses little or no day-rate power.

The hot water tank is also typically highly insulated and would be programmed to fully heat over night at the cheaper rate.

Exactly the same setup is used in the UK and elsewhere.