Another Maytag A206 Question

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I'm sorry, John, but I must disagree with you this time. The set screw must dig into the 'meat' of the stem. If it makes it into the channel or groove, the screw will move back and forth in that channel due to the torque from the tub and agitator and cause a click or knock noise and eventually shear off, ruining the stem. I've seen it many times from rebuilds done by other companies...

Another thing to check that can make a knock noise during agitation is loose bolts where the tub support arms attach to the damper. Just something to check...

RCD
 
Gosh Doug,

I'm kind of at a loss here. When you ran that machine empty with the basket out did you grab that agitator shaft and try to stop it. If it started knocking again that might have directed you to some kind of slop or play somewhere along the drive path. I should have suggested before to put the different agitators on the shaft while you had that basket out and grabbed the column with your hands to give it some resistance to try and get the machine to repeat the noise. Sorry.

I don't suppose the splines in the agitator or on the shaft could be worn and causing a knocking sound when the agitator switches direction? Resistance on the agitator with an empty tub might reproduce the symptom.

What about stop lug adjustment? Could this be a symptom of this sound, guys? See thread # 28069 in the 2010 archives, Doug. I don't know if it will help or not. It's a step I forgot to mention in my thread # 38714 that I regret. Sorry if has caused anyone any trouble.

My manual says that the stop lug is the only adjustment that is made on the clutch-brake package. If a malfunction is present in the wash cycle, the trouble could be either in the brake package, radial bearing, tub bearing and seal assembly, or the transmission. It also says, under trouble-shooting.

Machine Noisy In Wash.

Transmission trouble - Remove transmission and replace necessary parts.

Worn agitator spline - Replace agitator or have it resplined.

Brake assembly - Brake shoes worn. Dismantle brake and replace shoes. (If I had to do that, I'd probably just replace the brake.)

Pump - Remove and inspect pump. (Doesn't sound like your problem.)

Belts - Replace belt. (Doesn't sound like your problem.)

Motor pulley loose - Tighten pulley. (Doesn't sound like your problem either.)

The only replaceable splines are in the bakelite agitators and I don't think yours is that old. Even if it is, I think replacing an agitator spline can be a dicey procedure.

That's about all I know to tell you, Doug. If anyone else has some ideas, please throw them in if you want.

Brian

p.s. I don't understand why you would have trouble getting the old agitator off. It should pop off and on if well greased. [this post was last edited: 9/18/2012-03:00]
 
Hey Drew,

Now that you mention it, I'm noticing some oscillation of that outer tub. It seems to coincide with the knocking sound. I don't think that outer tub's supposed to move during agitation is it? You might be on to something there.

Brian
 
Smokey,  do you think your Tag has that 60 hz pulley that comes up in discussion around here from time to time.  Your agitation is much faster than my center dial tag. I don't know about the knock. Just an observation,  faster agitation is a good thing. alr
 
MT DC Care Washer Seal Assembly

Andy we do get to disagree at times that's one of the things that makes this site so informative and fun.

 

I have probably only replaced a hundred or so of these center assemblies and never had a problem and sometimes when tightening the set screw I could tell that it went in a lot deeper so you must in any case you must really tighten it, so I cannot see why it would hold better in one area that another. I would thing that MT would have designed this better or had detailed instructions how to avoid it being assembled this way if it could really cause a problem.

 

                             Hope all is well in Reno I will try and call one of these days, John.

 

 
 
Hi everyone -- thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I know its hard to diagnose a mechanical problem from a blurry video with crappy audio.

redcarpetdrew: I never thought about the damper bolts; I'll check them over.

alr2903: I'm not familiar with a 60 hz pulley. The agitation seems as fast as I remember--maybe a little faster with the new belts I put on; the old ones were pretty worn out.

Brian: If the outer tub is moving does that mean the tub bolts aren't tight enough? I'll have to check that out too. I know I tried holding the spin tub and it still made the knocking sound. It didn't seem as loud or as constant with the newer style agitator as it did with the old.

I remember when I took the machine out to the workshop (about 10 yrs ago) I didn't want to store it with the agitator on and I had a really hard time getting it off then. I usually took it out at least once a year; I put a new rubber stop ring on, but it's still really hard to take off and I did grease it. The newer agitator was also hard to remove. I took the old black one and put it on my newer Maytag and it slid right on & off with no problem.

Speaking of the agitator shaft, is there supposed to be any play when you pull up on the shaft? It seems to move just a fraction when you pull up on it and it makes a thump sound.

Thanks again for the advice. I'll check some things over tonight. Doug
 
The set screw

Hello John and Andy,

I don't want to get between you guys on a debate, but since I started the subject I feel compelled to remark.

As documented in the Helical Drive Service Manual on page 23 and 24 it reads as follows.

"Note: Previously, the mounting stem used a short "nylok" set screw. When replacing stem use Allen wrench to tighten set screw securely.

Currently a longer set screw is being used. When replacing the mounting stem and tightening the set screw it is possible that the set screw will line up with one of the flutes in the center plate.

This may be determined if when tightening the set screw it turns in flush with the mounting stem. If this is the case, tighten set screw securely as shown in Drawing 25 (Drawing omitted). Then loosen and retighten as shown in Drawing 26 (Drawing omitted). If set screw is too tight when aligned with one of the center plate flutes there is the possibility that it will cause a bind against the agitator shaft and prevent agitation.  <span style="text-decoration: underline;">If set screw aligns with threads on center plate, tighten set screw securely.</span>"</p>
 

I took liberties with the last sentence and underlined it to make a point. It is not underlined in the manual.  It is possible that the engineers at Maytag may have discovered, through empirical evidence, that the set screw was better placed on the thicker, threaded part of the center plate to prevent possible problems. As has been noted in the past, a set screw tightened in a flute may not hold as well as it has less metal to "bite" into and in turn could cause indexing of the basket which would strike the set screw during agitation and eventually could cause a groove to be carved around the neck of the center plate. Also during braking, the screw could be placed under severe force and sheer off. Personally, I don't think the people at Maytag would have wrote this in there service manual if there was no reason for it. The machines I have seen seem to do better when they are assembled in this way.

 

I haven't seen as many machines as John has, I'm sure, but the application seems logical and sound to me. Sorry I didn't post the pictures. They basically just showed the difference between how far in the set screw went in the two positions. Thanks for listening to my ramblings.
smiley-smile.gif


[this post was last edited: 9/19/2012-01:26]
 
Doug,

There is a spring/thrust washer between the agitator drive shaft pinion and the top gear case cover that is supposed to hold the drive shaft down tight inside the transmission. One can see it between the pinion and the gear case cover when the top is off. It provides quite a bit of resistance when one tries to turn it while it's disassembled. Especially when the cover, orifice and shaft have been cleaned and degreased.

This play in the shaft sounds unusual and a bit disturbing. One expects a Maytag to be very quiet and when it's not it's aggravating. You can either put up with it or look for a replacement gear case cover, if that turns out to be what's really wrong. Putting in a new drive shaft is a terrible project and there's no guarantee of success, all though I'm going to give it a try on my 806. I have a back-up plan if it doesn't work.

Brian
 
I checked all the damper bolts and outer tub bolts and everything seems secure. I read over the thread about the stop lug. I've attached a video to show how mine is working--maybe I did that wrong? I didn't think when I first put it back together there was as much play as what there is now. I thought I had it set a 1/2 inch--looks more like a full inch movement now.

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Yeah, I think that's wrong. This could be my fault for not addressing the drive lug setting in my trans. rebuild post. I wish I would have addressed this. I hope it hasn't caused too many people trouble.

Take the screw and the washer off the end of the drive shaft. Spin the pulley slowly on the end of the drive shaft in a clockwise direction until it stops or you feel resistance. Hold it there. With the pulley held in that stopped position as mentioned before, put the drive lug on the end of the shaft with the lug to the left or counterclockwise of the pulley lug. The space between the two lugs should be about 3/8 to 1/4 inch apart. The drive lug is flat on one side and a little rounded on the other. Put the flat side toward the pulley and the rounded side toward you. Then put the washer on the screw and screw it into the bottom of the drive shaft. Now you can let go of the pulley. Put the rubber cap back on.

Put some solvent or cleaner on a rag or paper towel and clean down inside the grooves on all the pulleys. Make sure your belts are clean and dry too. Put them back on. Your drive lug adjustment should be correct now.
 
Hi Brian,

Thanks for the info--I'll try again. It is certainly not any fault of yours. I've poked around on this site & others for information on different areas of the work I was doing. Since I'm really new at this it's my own fault for not following the instructions I do have!

Thanks for taking the time to help me so much!

Doug
 
I was just putzing around the workshop tonight and got out the tub cover--that's going to be fun.  Is the tub cover supposed to sit on the lip of the outer tub or is it supposed to go down over the lip?  I know there is supposed to be a clearance so the spin tub doesn't rub against the tub cover.  Either way I think that's going to be one of the more difficult steps. 
 
A while back QSD_DAN and I did a "how to" thread on doing a tub bearing and seal on a Maytag. See if this helps...

RCD

www.automaticwasher.org

Changing a Maytag tub bearing and seal: A how to...

Recently, Dan wanted me to show him the steps on changing a Maytag Dependable Care platform tub bearing and seal on his HA806 that I gave him. What we here at the shop call a 'stem and boot job'. There has been interest expressed on my possibly sharing that with all of you. In the interests of...
www.automaticwasher.org www.automaticwasher.org
 
Reply # 152 in thread # 38714 is how I did it. I've also used two heavy plastic coat hangers placed 180 degrees apart and sandwiched between the basket and the tub cover for adjustment. And I've just eyed it with the washer top down and pushed the tub cover into the collector tub until I got about a 1/4 inch space between the washer cover and the tub cover. You have to make sure it doesn't move when you're putting the tub gasket and clamp on or it will be all out of whack.

The tub cover's supposed to slip down inside the collector tub.
 

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