Oh and as for the Whirlpool Powerclean, come on. I love that machine as much as anyone else here, but the world has moved on. Consumers expect quiet and they expect a tall tub. And the government (until the current administration at least) expects lower water usage. You can sing the praises of these machines all day in the Imperial forum but it's tiring to constantly see 40+ year old designs, even really good ones, talked about as the solution to all our appliance problems in 2025.
Dishwashers losing popularity in US Homes???
- Thread starter appnut
- Start date
Help Support :
phillymatt53
Well-known member
Goofy Glenn Strikes again!
I almost always eat all my food, unless I'm feeling ill. Occasionally I'll buy something that sounds good, but when I begin eating it, am not pleased with the taste. I recently got a can of baked beans that I thought I'd like, but the flavor was not something I cared for. I ate part of them, and threw the rest out. I now know not to buy them again. I like Bush's beans the best, and will get them from now on. I also got some Cheez-Its Smoky Cheddar, but didn't like them, so I gave them to my former neighbor kid when he was over.
phillymatt53
Well-known member
And now you can also qualify to be chastized for wasting food by DADoES/Glenn.
I think this article is political BS trying to advance DT's anti-environmental agenda.
Everyone I know has a dishwasher and uses it on a daily basis. I grew up in a house that had one and have had one my entire adult life. It's an absolute nonnegotiable requirement wherever I lived. Mine gets used at least once daily and it's an emergency if it goes down.
Everyone I know has a dishwasher and uses it on a daily basis. I grew up in a house that had one and have had one my entire adult life. It's an absolute nonnegotiable requirement wherever I lived. Mine gets used at least once daily and it's an emergency if it goes down.
Only because people pre-rinsed before, during and after the Power Clean. When tall tubs came along many people did not realize their dishwasher couldn't clean because dishes were already going in predominately clean.
Timeless classics do not have an expiration date. The logic displayed on this forum is parallel to society stopping the use of fire or the wheel in place of an inferior substitute because the both were discovered 2 millions years ago and 3,500 BCE respectively and the inferior substitute being drawn up yesterday. Actually if anything the fountain pumps used on modern dishwashers are at least 100 year technology.
I'd rather the holy grail have been discovered, invented and perfected 40 years ago then tomorrow let alone never. The discontinuation of the Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module and Maytag Jet-Clean was marathon run in reverse.
I (and mom) didn't pre-rinse from the beginning with the family's first dishwasher, a KDI-17a. Rinse/Hold was run on accumulating loads at first, until I/we soon figured out that leaving the dishware wet-dripping with dirty water and the residual in the sump caused much more odor than not running Rinse/Hold. No more Rinse/Hold with any dishwasher since that moment, and no odor.
Signed: Goofy Glenn
Last edited:
Right, but you had a KDI-17a. KDI-17a could get away without pre-rinsing to a significant degree. These dishwashers could filter out and flush soil, in good amounts. Their weak point was a short main wash, not 100% ideal self cleaning of the particle filter, and some models had poor(ish) water distribution but compared to most other dishwashers they came the closet to minimal prep until the Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Module and TOL Maytag Jet Cleans came along.
Personally, I find it better to let soils dry on rather than running rinse and hold after every meal. Rinse and hold is IMO asking for bacteria and odors since the dishes aren't actually being cleaned in full or and sanitized.
A good dishwasher can deal with soils that have dried on for days.
Last edited:
It wasn't a weak point at all back when detergents were highly phosphated with chlorine bleach. Between 2 pre rinses, 2 wash cycles and 3 post rinses, everything came out of them squeaky clean. Remember, these are launching 3 gallons of water around the cabinet per fill using a 1/2 horsepower motor. You'd have to experience one in person to understand.
I've experimented with two. IIRC KDS-18 and a latter Hobart timer dial energy saver version. There is tremendous volume and pressure making up for the short main wash yes, but you also need time to soak and scour away certain food soils away. A spray not matter how powerful or redundant can not hit every single millimeter of surface area. For that you need secondary deflection and run off which will not be as powerful as the direct spray so you need time to compensate for that. A Potscrubber will always out clean a Hobart Kitchen-Aid when it comes to heavily baked on and burned on soils.
Late 90s and onward Whirlpool Power Clean Filter Modules got it right in that they gave time in addition to the powerful sprays.
Depends, there's certain foods my Powerclean couldn't handle that the KDS-18 powered through. I can also stack items 3 tiers high in the 18 and the PC struggled with 2 tiers. Also remember these machines were designed with highly phosphated detergents that were already getting hit by 1977 and kept decreasing as the years passed.
You do have a point, Kitchen-Aids do handle extreme Bob Loads significantly better.
However IMO when it comes to handling and flushing away food soils and food bits Power Clean is simply the best ever created.
However IMO when it comes to handling and flushing away food soils and food bits Power Clean is simply the best ever created.
Another thing I just remembered is the soil sensor would cause the main wash to significantly reduce cycle times if it didn't sense enough food in the water. What it did not sense was the food stuck to the dishes, causing it to under wash at times. That's with hi temp wash selected (always selected). I remember it struggled pretty bad at cleaning avocado residue on spoons due to this. I'm hoping that being on a water softener will fix these problems with the next Powerclean or I may just put the 18 back into regular service again.
I personally like having a dishwasher since I bought our family's first one in 1990 and that was a Whirlpool power clean. One of the last with the enameled tub. DP8700XT. What a powerhouse that machine was and I had it for 30 years. I wish I had taken it with me when I moved. Looking back. I have since had a Frigidaire built in which was very mediocre and good detergent was a must to clean well. Now I have a Chinese built GE portable which I must say. Does the job pretty well, better than the Frigidaire but it does have some quirks that are very annoying to me. Still though I have to weigh that against clean dishes and I put up with it. I would love to find an old power clean portable and I still see them out there.
I agree with the article stating dishwashers are losing popularity, is not proven in any manner, there have always been people who don’t use their dishwashers and have all sorts of excuses why they don’t work for their lifestyle that’s fine.
But I certainly don’t see any evidence of them fading away. Dishwasher sales are an all-time high US populations at an all-time high, I know you can’t rent or sell a house in Washington DC without a dishwasher nobody will buy it or rent it.
Phosphate dishwasher detergent with chlorine in them were very effective with older machines and shorter cycles, but they’re the major reason why dishwasher is often lasted as a list four years in the 5060s and 70s, modern detergent are much easier on the machine and your dishes.
Many people still don’t put their good dishes in the dishwasher because of past experiences with old chlorinated phosphated detergents Reality is now you can put most of your finest dish, dishware in a dishwasher and glassware with no deterioration whatsoever. When did you last hear if somebody complaining about etched glassware?
One of the great things about people who don’t use their dishwasher as we find great vintage machines that haven’t been used that’s why we find so few unused vintage washing machines because everybody uses a washing machine but there’s a significant number of people who don’t use a clothes dryer so we find a lot of nice clothes dryers.
Thursday I had a customer who finally gave up on her 1980 GE dishwasher. It had been used lightly over the years and it had been destroyed by rinsing the dishes.
She said she absolutely wanted another almond colored dishwasher so we found her an unused ISE KitchenAid built dishwasher that I installed She loved it
But I certainly don’t see any evidence of them fading away. Dishwasher sales are an all-time high US populations at an all-time high, I know you can’t rent or sell a house in Washington DC without a dishwasher nobody will buy it or rent it.
Phosphate dishwasher detergent with chlorine in them were very effective with older machines and shorter cycles, but they’re the major reason why dishwasher is often lasted as a list four years in the 5060s and 70s, modern detergent are much easier on the machine and your dishes.
Many people still don’t put their good dishes in the dishwasher because of past experiences with old chlorinated phosphated detergents Reality is now you can put most of your finest dish, dishware in a dishwasher and glassware with no deterioration whatsoever. When did you last hear if somebody complaining about etched glassware?
One of the great things about people who don’t use their dishwasher as we find great vintage machines that haven’t been used that’s why we find so few unused vintage washing machines because everybody uses a washing machine but there’s a significant number of people who don’t use a clothes dryer so we find a lot of nice clothes dryers.
Thursday I had a customer who finally gave up on her 1980 GE dishwasher. It had been used lightly over the years and it had been destroyed by rinsing the dishes.
She said she absolutely wanted another almond colored dishwasher so we found her an unused ISE KitchenAid built dishwasher that I installed She loved it
Attachments
KDI-17a has one prewash (3 mins) and one prerinse (or two prerinses if no detergent in the prewash cup), main wash (whopping 7 minutes IIRC), and two after-rinses.
We/Mom had a KDI-17a from the initial installation circa 1975, through to 2001 when the same model machine in the next house was replaced with a GE (clearance at Lowe's or Home Depot, from whichever dad bought it), which was replaced with a WP in Nov 2024 (nothing wrong with the GE, never any repairs) because sister insisted on updating all the appliances upon moving in w/Mom.
Signed: Goofy Glenn
phillymatt53
Well-known member
Ya know, I never in 20 years since I bought the house, knew what that Rinse-Hold button was for, or what it did.
I always just hit the Normal Wash button and walked away, end of story.
vacerator
Well-known member
Re; married to cellphones. While not untrue, but not a reason for the above really. I also have no desire to access any appliance or other home system via my mobile phone. I can start my car with an app., but I don't. It has a remote start on the fob, which we rarely use because we keep it garaged.
phillymatt53
Well-known member
Since smartphones have been easily gotten, their widespread use, along with the plethora of Apps, has conditioned much of society into a bunch of zombies.
I've often, during a nice summer evening, sat out on my patio enjoying the night air and sometimes brought out a radio to listen to and relax by.
Sometimes with a nice beverage and some munchies.
The main sidewalk is about 30 feet from my patio, and I can watch the evening's strollers out for a walk.
The thing that annoys me these days is observing the illuminated glow on the faces of people, mostly young ones, as they stare at those little screens as they walk by.
Some are talking, chatting with someone on speakerphone or texting.
Others are blasting what they consider music, loudly, like they're hard of hearing.
It's like human fireflies out on a summer night.
To me, that's a sickness, an obsession, a darned addiction, that's taken over society.
It's just not normal for humans to be so wrapped up in a little device that dominates their lives, and must mentally distance them from their surroundngs.
This is what is called "the conditioning" of society that I've sometimes mentioned.
To dominate and make such behavior a believable way to live.
vacerator
Well-known member
Is Skynet here? A.I. can or will have access to everyhting?
