Follow-up on LG FL washer...a year later. SQ it is.

[mrb627]

In My Experience...

Lack of sufficient detergent contributes to more fabric wear.
Also, additional rinsing beyond the scope of what is needed can contribute to fabric wear.

The water stingy FL machines today aren't as gentle as the models offered 25+ years ago. Add to that the cycles have doubled or tripled in length.

Malcolm

 

[rolls_rapide]

"FL machines today aren't as gentle"

I would agree with that - on some programmes. Other programmes (Woollens, for example) are now too gentle, and certainly not a patch on the woollens cycles of yesteryear.

I would also say that I think modern programme lengths are hugely excessive. Totally unnecessary. The maximum time of a cycle should be no more than 90 minutes for heavily soiled cottons. An hour should be more than enough for normally soiled laundry.

 

[washerdude]

While you wait for you new SQ TL...
Enjoy (Don't raise it too high).


I must say, reading this thread made me reconsider getting an LG FL, turbowash does not seem to be all the rage of what it sounded and looked like. I'll probably stick with a WP made FL.

 

[dreamclean]

Turbo wash

Hi Rolls yes I use turbo wash on everything. Hesitant about softener since it has chemicals & can be gunky, (plus I'm sensitive). And thanks for the video washerdude. I wasn't aware you could do that with LG's. MrB I just started using an extra rinse cycle just on two loads...I could try two tbsp but since it doesn't wash out fully as it is and my loads are probably less than normal size, I don't know that will be the solution. At this point I'm not comfortable putting anything of value in it so I probably won't be experimenting with my new things. It's ruined all of my new socks and they weren't cheap. The tumbling is what shrunk them even with cold water.

I guess in my mind, I visualize optimal cleaning in a TL with the clothes suspended in water sloshing around with the detergent creating an emulsion to lift the dirt/oils. Since the fibers can move freely and expand, the water detergent emulsion can enter and leave the fabric at any angle. On the other hand, I feel the FL's tumbling action doesn't allow for a free-flowing system or fabric expansion and release. They are packed on top of each other and friction is the least effective way to clean clothes, which explains the absurdly long cycles. I wonder if it even drives some of the soil deeper into the fabric...I have many thick cotton socks I think that happened with bc the soil looks as if it got locked up in the fabric. I'm not an engineer but that's the only way I know to explain it. My first experience with a FL was a Bosch in Poland. I noticed it was pulverizing my clothes while my Norwegian flatmate walked around wearing shredded and holey clothing, seemingly oblivious.

I also think it would take a whole lot longer for a TL to "shred" the clothes than it does a FL to pill them, when I'm looking at one wash succeeding with that. I'm hoping if i get the TL SQ I'll get by on the delicate cycle like I used previously.
Also, kind of crazy that these things only last 5-7 years isn't it? I've read the landfills are overflowing with HE machines. What a waste of resources. Planned obselescence should probably be a crime at this point in our evolution.
Going to look at SQ's this week, and the Amana sure did have good reviews so that got my interest. There were quite a few bad reviews but they weren't verified, as someone pointed out.

 

[rolls_rapide]

Good luck with your shopping for a new machine. It can be a hellish experience!

Regarding Bosch: My mum has a Bosch and it washes quite well. It dates from 2006 and uses a reasonable amount of water to wash and rinse. It was one of the mid-range "German" models, so reliability was better. I have spoken to sales folk in a few shops, and "Spanish Bosch" was the one to avoid, usually at the cheaper end of the spectrum.

My mum's Bosch - I think - washes, rinses and spins more successfully in a shorter time-frame than my Panasonic which uses a miserly amount of water and dithers about whether the spin is balanced or not.

 

[dreamclean]

Yep

Thanks, I went through it a year ago almost to the date. That was on top of a house reno and moving so I'm in a much better place. I don't see an alternative when I can endure info overload better than ruined clothes. This time I'm going with my gut and I didn't have a good feeling about the LG but someone managed to influence me that has since been wrong about just about everything. He managed to talk me out of the SQ at that time. It's funny how gardenweb laundry forum is almost evangelical about SQ and it seems to be the opposite here (maybe).

 

[rolls_rapide]

I think that between us all on here, we all have had experience of at least one machine that has driven us up the wall - whether it be because of consistently poor performance or dodgy reliability.

Go with your gut feeling, and don't be persuaded by those smooth-talking, 'fly-by-night' salesmen.

 

[mtn1584]

A Speed Queen suggestion....

Buy the electronic model for greater washing flexibility cycle wise and a 5 year warranty as well.
Mike

 

[mrsalvo]

A couple of years ago my TL Kenmore bit-the-dust when it locked up on the spin cycle and nearly caught on fire, pouring smoke out all over the house. Afterwards I looked at all the new washers, front load and top load, took my time, and decided on TL Speed Queen, I knew what I was getting and I have never regretted it once. The only thing you have to be careful about with Speed Queen is NOT to overload it, as stated 2 or 3 times in the owners manual, it can cause excessive wear on the belts. Love, love the fast cycle times and saving on detergents, it doesn't take much, and clothes are well rinsed. Also LOVE the simplicity of the design.

I'm not saying it's all-that-and-a-bag-of-chips too, but for what's out there today its probably the best over-built, BASIC designed washer available on the market. It does have its short comings to be fair but I'm willing to work around them. It's a water hog, but that's okay. The washer works for our situation.

Good luck with your decision. And always follow your gut instincts.

Barry

 

[dreamclean]

Hi Barry, glad to hear that. When I was researching SQ machines before I don't think I ever saw any "I hate this thing" type threads. What stopped me then was our friend-turned-contractor-turned-roommate who was pushing us with the shopping part. At the time I thought SQ was out of our budget so I didn't go with my gut then, but I'm a big believer in buying the best you can afford to save in the long run... And looky now, we've come full circle. I don't care about bells n whistles so the shopping should be pretty straightforward...I do all my research beforehand and it will probably be decided before I hit the showrooms. We got the LG's at Lowe's and it was practically point and click...it was on sale and reviews were better than most. It was kinda like "ok not really feeling the HE thing so this is probably the best we can do".
I wish I could have an overloading problem but I hardly have any clothes :0) Just two people so we don't do that much laundry each week and water won't be an issue.

Mike I will def go with your sound suggestions. Hopefully at my next check-in I'll have some great news that will help others in the same boat. This has been driving me bonkers on so many levels lol. Maybe I should swing by the laundromat with the SQ's for a much-needed morale boost.

 

[jkbff]

So reading this things are starting to make sense.

Watch the video about Mieles being made and listen to what Dr. Zinkann has to say.



It's all about the honeycomb drum and the programming.

 

[rolls_rapide]

Impressive video

I admire the way Miele endeavours to ensure that every machine they produce is on tip-top form.

Based on that video, I want a Miele.

Perhaps one day...

 

[jkbff]

The only thing that I *don't* like about Miele is that their appliances are half the price in Germany compared to buying them in America.

A person shouldn't have to spend 14k to get a decent fridge in the US.

 

[dreamclean]

Sehr gut

Oh man, if only I were rich. My main concern is on the off-chance there was a problem, the repair and parts can exceed the value of the machine. It's the same reason I sold my Saab. I did read that the long-term durability doesn't really measure up to the marketing hype and the parts aren't as quality as they maybe were in the past. But that's across the board for everything. That honeycomb design tho...

 

[foraloysius]

I agree with the point about the prices of Miele appliances. Miele appliances are a bit pricier than other brands overhere in Europe, but they don't cost an arm and a leg. Apart from the high prices, I would be concerned about parts availability in the long run. It's the same with American products on the European market. That's why I would never buy American appliances for every day use.

 

[qualin]

While I'm sure that Miele does make great stuff, they're just not competitive in the North American market. Certainly not in the Canadian one anyway.

If Miele appliances are supposed to be so great, why don't they stand behind their appliances with a decent warranty? A 1 year parts and labour warranty that can be extended to three years for an extra $1000? No thanks.

Briefly looked at a W3048 washer and was quoted $3k. Err, Speed Queen is nearly $2k cheaper with 3x the warranty. They can't compete.

What about that debacle with the W4842? A few members on these forums have already had some issues with them and Miele nearly ran screaming from the large format market, probably because price point wise, they can't compete with Samsung and LG. (Good quality costs more, I know, but $2k more then the competition, really?)

Someone at Miele is certainly smoking something. I'm sure the prices on their products could become competitive if they only manufactured them somewhere in North America or (gasp!) Mexico.

This hits a sore spot with me because Miele appliances look absolutely beautiful and they have wonderful engineering. Alliance beats them hand over fist when it comes for "Bang for the buck". My Huebsch machine might be ugly in comparison to a Miele and it has about as many features as a BOL machine, but it gets the job done. (There's no fancy Jeans or "Sandy Towels" cycle, but who cares, it doesn't care.)

If I was ever going to consider purchasing Miele stuff in the future, They'd have to do these things, which I doubt they would do:
1. Open a manufacturing plant in North America. (Canada, US, Mexico, whatever.)
2. 3 year parts and labour warranty with a 5 year parts warranty. (At no additional cost!)
3. Competitive pricing with Alliance products, or maybe a slight premium.
4. Bring back large capacity machines for the North American market.
5. Make inroads to completely destroy LG and Samsung products on the market.

They do these things and then I'd consider buying Miele...

 

[retro-man]

Back to clothes wearing out

I have been doing my laundry now for over 25 years in front load machines. 1st set was earliest versions of Maytag Neptunes and now Whirlpool tol Duets. My clothes have lasted so long that I am cleaning out a lot of them because I am tired of wearing the same stuff. I have shirts 20 years old that still look great. My underwear never seems to wear out even the elastic bands. I have many pairs of dress and white socks long and short that never wear out nor pill. I buy quality clothing such as Addidas, Nike, Haines etc. I used liquid Tide and sometime powdered Tide. Occasional Downy fabric softener. My wifes clothes are done the same way and she has some pretty delicate items along with business attire along with her night gowns and such. No ripping tearing fading piling etc. All the problems you are facing are non that I have experienced. We have sets of sheets 10 years old that still look like new. Towels are the same, no problems with ripping or shedding. I have no idea what is going on with your clothes, maybe you have acid water going into your washer. Just joking but I am stumped as to your situation.

Jon

 

[foraloysius]

After reading this thread again I think there are a few problems here that should be addressed first before you buy a new machine.

1. Use enough detergent, not just a bit. It looks like you're afraid of using enough.

2. Small loads. A small load in a machine with a big drum, gets a lot of stress. Fill the drum up to capacity and the laundry doesn't get as much as a beating than it gets now. If your washing machine adjusts the length of the cycle by the amount of laundry it is washing, you might get a longer cycle, but that wouldn't harm the laundry less than being beaten around in a large drum with a few items.

3. Higher temperatures. Everything you wear on your body can be washed at 105 degrees Fahrenheit. Otherwise these clothes would already shrink on your body. Temperatures in your dryer might be even higher anyway. The combination of a decent detergent (again powder!) and a high enough temperature will remove odors much better than the method you used in the past.

 

[rolls_rapide]

Regarding the pilling

I was wondering if the pilling/bobbling of cottons was caused by Dreamclean's machine tumbling excessively when trying to get in balance for spinning?

That might explain why small loads still get pilled, because the load can't readily get balanced, thus the machine drops back to tumbling to and fro several times more.

I know my current machine does more tumbling in order to balance, an awful lot more than the previous one.

I've been experimenting with different load sizes in my 8kg frontloader. One lightweight cotton t-shirt CAN get in balance after a few tries. Three cotton t-shirts take much longer to balance, as they get entangled with each other and end up all on the same side of the drum. This sends an even greater 'out-of-balance' signal to the electronics. Five or six t-shirts seem to work a bit better, as they are more evenly distributed around the drum.

 

[dreamclean]

Small loads

Hi Jon, happy you've seen that kind of longevity with your clothes. There was a thread on gardenweb specifically concerning LG FL's pilling clothes along with other brands. I'll attach that link for anyone interested.
I should probably define what a small load is to me, it might be medium to someone else... I have a 23" by 14" (58 cm by 35 cm) mesh basket that is filled about 3/4 or more to the top. The load size vs wear was a valid question raised after I compared my roommate's laundry to mine. It makes a lot of sense that the tumbling action could get thrown off. I wonder if it constantly adjusts the time left like the dryer (I've seen the dryer's numbers go up and down) so that I don't have a real idea of how long it's in there. Next time I'll watch the cycle run.

I used to fill the detergent tray to the line, did that for a long time which was excessive as laundry was really crunchy. That's why we dropped it to 1tbsp based on advice. I'll bump it back up and go with 2tbsp like LG says. Any more than that and I think everything will be stiff again.

My LG FL is pilling my clothes

I have looked up every resource I know to help me with this problem. I'm wondering is anyone has had the same problem. I have an LG wm3360HVAC Front Load washer. Previously I had an agitator washer. I've had clothes for 12 years that have always stayed looking pretty nice. One wash in the new FL...

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