Food Cost/Fuel Cost

[westie2]

Here is a good web site about the use of corn for ethanol rather than going to food.

http://www.foodb4fuel.com/

 

[bleacho]

always political tie in...

lol... when these politicians want to be noticed, they toss something out something very sensitive to all people to get their attention.. this too, tied into the same propaganda...
just amazing.

 

[oldhouseman]

We should

look at the model Brazil has set. They are not dependent on oil imports. Ethanol can be made from other things besides corn. Certain types of grass and sugar cane. But then again we don't want the South to start getting wealthy again from agriculture, -who knows where that might lead.....

And what about solar, wind, etc/diversified systems for energy.

 

[dalangdon]

I suspect that that site may be a front for some energy companies. Anytime they won't list who the members of their "broad based coalition" are, you have to be a little suspicious ;-).

I was reading something the other day that said that this problem should fade away on its own, because they now are using technology that will be using a lot more of the plant waste, rather than the usable crop part.

Of course, in the short term, they could switch livestock to grass instead of corn, which is what they prefer to eat, and would also decrease their "emissions", but that would mean letting them graze, which raises land use issues.

 

[oxydolfan1]

I hope ethanol isn't shelved entirely because of food costs...it's not really an honest answer to the price crunch, and we really only were getting started! There are never snap solutions to these kinds of problems.

I've of the mind that we have to do EVERYTHING (I don't like the "clean coal" idea, much, however)....

What makes me insane is how the right is claiming "tsk, tsk" rights now....wasn't it the Bushies themselves who practically commanded the farmers to grow for ethanol, just last year?

I've noticed steep price hikes in items in the store that would seem to be tied more to petrochemical ingredients than agriculturally based ones....in the case of those items, like gas, why is the futures market, and the oil traders, getting a pass? Drilling is fine by me, but we have to look at all the causes first?

To create a website that offers only one angle to the problem is misleading, and IMHO, the interests behind them bank on the idea that people are simply too dog-tired to sit down and put the pieces together.

 

[rapunzel]

Many western economies have been dumping excess agricultural produce for decades to keep prices stable. Hundreds of millions of milk gallons have been poured down the drain, vegetables left to rot in the fields and nobody ever gave a stuff. Now we plant some crops to fuel our cars and suddenly the world goes into a hunger crisis. What bloody rubbish! The truth is that speculation for profit is driving up food and fuel prices. There are a lot of people getting very rich from all this speculatin' - but this too will pass.

 

[oxydolfan1]

Rapunzel, have food prices been markedly increasing in Australia?

Right now, I'm in a position to absorb the price increases, but they are noticeable, and I've been consciously avoiding certain vegetables, dairy products, etc., not so much because I have to, but because the prices seem outrageous.

It's been particularly noticeable over the course of the past few weeks. I cannot imagine how families on the "margins" are coping, and a volunteer organization I've worked with is reporting record numbers of clients seeking assistance.

 

[rapunzel]

Australian food prices have been on the up for far longer than in many other parts of the developed world, especially the US. The main reason for this is lack of competition, not ethanol. We have what could be called a duopoly in food retail. There are two major players, Woolworths and Coles, who are so big that they are in a position to dictate what they will pay and charge for their products. Independent family-owned grocery businesses have almost disappeared from our towns and cities. Aldi is the only real competition to the other two, but their product range is very limited. Whatever other retail chains there are, they are too small to influence pricing. Our government has been very reluctant to allow more players to enter the market place, for whatever reason.

Much of our best quality meat, fruit and vegies is exported abroad to markets where consumers pay even more or the exchange rate makes export more attractive. Nowadays, unless there is an independent greengrocer or butcher in the area, that still takes pride in their business, we get to pay top $$$ for mediocre quality. However, it wasn't always so. Once upon a time we actually had very affordable top quality produce. Globalization and government policies have put paid to that.

Now to my former post. In many parts of the world governments pay large subsidies to their farming sectors. I believe the US is one of those places? When they hand out taxpayers' money for this purpose, they may exert influence over how many and what crops farmers plant. Sometimes they even pay farmers not to plant anything at all. For this reason I am reluctant to accept this peculiar idea that crops for fuel are suddenly the primary cause for what is happening at the moment.

Now, if any other Australians want to add, correct or qualfy what I have said here, please feel free.

 

[brisnat81]

Hi Rapunzel,

I agree that our food prices have been high for quite a while now. I havent noticed a recent surge in prices, and because we're used to them, to a point now, we've changed how we shop.

We rarely eat lamb or beef these days, and mainly stick to Chicken and Pork due to cost. We purchase Fruit and vegetables when they're in season, and most in season stuff can still be had for $1-2 per kg. I now freeze lots of vegetables and some fruits, so we have them all season, and if we had the space for my grandmothers Fowlers Vaccola Preserving kit, I'd switch doing the fruits to it.

On the quality of Fruit and Veg, I agree that particularily with meat, the good stuff is exported and we're left with the leftovers. I think that the quality of produce in the supermarket various from store to store, rathan than saying its all bad. The Fruit and Veg is sometimes acceptable, but our Woolworths has an internal butcher on site, and the quality of their meat is great, and on average its $5-7/kg per cut cheaper than the butcher. That being said, we've started buying sides of Pork and more rarely Lamb Quarters from the butcher, which get the price of each down to about $6 and $9/kg respectively.

We now use a family run fruit and veg market on the sunshine coast for most of our stuff, and only top up at the supermarket with the stuff that doesnt last between the visits to Michaels mum. Most things there are all under $4/kg and are local produce where possible.

We were amazed in the US. I went up to a deli counter in a supermarket and was trying to convert lbs to kgs so I could visualise how much the Leg ham off the bone cost. Michael came along, and pointed out that at $4/lb or $8/kg it was about $10/kg cheaper than what we'd pay in AU, so just buy 2 lbs.

We were amazed at how perfect the fresh foods part of the supermarket was. I realise the flavour mightn't be there, but over here, it looks like we get all the stuff that by camparison has been rejected. Not a blemish or a mark to be seen. I'd like to know what happens to the stuff the US supernmarkets reject.

 

[rapunzel]

Hi Brisnat,

Our price rises have been very surreptitous. A cent or two here or there every other week. Often they'll turn an 850g can of something into 800g and still charge the same. It isn't always immediately apparent, but we all know that something is going on. Once upon a time visiting Europeans used to marvel at our prices and the quality of our fresh produce. Now they say that Australia is as, if not more expensive, than Europe.

Price fluctuations are ususally most noticable with fresh fruits and vegetables. It is interesting how they change from week to week, especially with Coles, Woolies and BiLow. When I'm in Sydney I live in the Hills and have noticed that supermarkets and other businesses charge as much as 30% more for their goods and services to people in that area. Petrol and food are noticably cheaper in the south-western and western suburbs. Sometimes I go to Parramatta, Epping or Carlingford. Though, with time spent in traffic and petrol costs it all evens itself out in the end.

Anyway, enough bitching and moaning - we'll just have to blow up parliament I guess (oops I think I hear a knock on my door). Like you, I try to buy moneywise.

 

[oxydolfan1]

"Often they'll turn an 850g can of something into 800g and still charge the same."

This happens here CONSTANTLY.

There is a brand of anti-perspirant that always came in a 75ml and 150ml size.

The 75ml size disappeared without warning.

Weeks later, the 150ml bottle was marked "New! Lower Price!"

I looked at the bottle, and in TEEENY little writing there was printed, "Please note that this is 75ml of product, now packaged in our popular 150ml size bottle....."