Came across this article, wondered what the cooks here thought about the subject. I've read a bit about sous vide over the years, have never tried it. Reading this got me thinking about trying this with my induction plate. It is quite accurate in holding a constant temp, not sure about 126 degrees. It might be worth a try. I do have my Mapp gas torch available to brown up the steak...
Hmm. Cook a steak sous vide and finish it off with a a torch?
- Thread starter mattl
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I'd want to sample a steak cooked this way before I invested in the required sous vide equipment.
If you decide to try the induction plate method, let us know your impressions.
If you decide to try the induction plate method, let us know your impressions.
vacerator
Well-known member
re souse vide';
An 800f. degree lava rock also works.
An 800f. degree lava rock also works.
There are three culinary phrases I hope I never hear again as long as I live: sous vide, farm to table, and Meyer lemon. In reverse order, allow me to gripe and moan. Spoiler alert: I’m a bitter, middle-aged man teetering on the edge of a mid-life crisis, so feel free to skip this post.
1. Who wants a lemon that doesn’t actually taste like a lemon? I want to meet that person, and have them tell me to my face that they want to buy a lemon but never actually taste one. What exactly is the purpose of that nonsense? If Meyer lemons were sweet enough to eat raw, then I might understand. But they are not that sweet. All they are is somewhat less sour—and of course, incredibly less flavorful. So basically, they are a not-very-good lemon that costs a lot of money. Save me, hosts of heaven.
2. “Farm to table” is an explanation of food distribution, not a culinary technique. After all, is there any other way to handle food? Drainage ditch to table? Nuclear waste facility to table? But here’s why I despise this term. It is an excuse, pure and simple, for not actually cooking, and for not actually running a restaurant. What the purveyors of this BS are trying to emphasize is freshness; but what they’re really doing is running a glorified roadside produce stand where the owners boil the food for you, instead of selling it raw for you to cook at home. There’s no creativity, nothing interesting, just boiled vegetables. SO FRESH, they scream. SO DELICIOUS, they scream louder. GREAT, I scream back. You’ve reminded me why I’m cooking more meals at home.
3. And then we have sous vide. It’s trendy, it’s fabulous, it’s fun. And it’s easy. Never mind that it simply isn’t as good as properly sautéed, or pan-fried, or grilled, or broiled, or roasted meat and vegetables. It isn’t even as good as plain boiled vegetables. But the great virtue of the technique is that it is consistent in the hands of restaurant staff who aren’t really up to handling the more difficult techniques. Closely allied to this technique is the recent trend of roasting joints at insanely low temperatures. But the simple reality is that no blow torch on earth can make up for the missing Maillard reaction that is so obviously lost in these techniques. I’ve tried sous vide over and over, I’ve roasted at low temperatures, and when it was all done, I have been furious with myself for giving up so much of my life (because these are long, long, long processes) for such a profound sense of disappointment. I’ve had enough of that for one lifetime.
1. Who wants a lemon that doesn’t actually taste like a lemon? I want to meet that person, and have them tell me to my face that they want to buy a lemon but never actually taste one. What exactly is the purpose of that nonsense? If Meyer lemons were sweet enough to eat raw, then I might understand. But they are not that sweet. All they are is somewhat less sour—and of course, incredibly less flavorful. So basically, they are a not-very-good lemon that costs a lot of money. Save me, hosts of heaven.
2. “Farm to table” is an explanation of food distribution, not a culinary technique. After all, is there any other way to handle food? Drainage ditch to table? Nuclear waste facility to table? But here’s why I despise this term. It is an excuse, pure and simple, for not actually cooking, and for not actually running a restaurant. What the purveyors of this BS are trying to emphasize is freshness; but what they’re really doing is running a glorified roadside produce stand where the owners boil the food for you, instead of selling it raw for you to cook at home. There’s no creativity, nothing interesting, just boiled vegetables. SO FRESH, they scream. SO DELICIOUS, they scream louder. GREAT, I scream back. You’ve reminded me why I’m cooking more meals at home.
3. And then we have sous vide. It’s trendy, it’s fabulous, it’s fun. And it’s easy. Never mind that it simply isn’t as good as properly sautéed, or pan-fried, or grilled, or broiled, or roasted meat and vegetables. It isn’t even as good as plain boiled vegetables. But the great virtue of the technique is that it is consistent in the hands of restaurant staff who aren’t really up to handling the more difficult techniques. Closely allied to this technique is the recent trend of roasting joints at insanely low temperatures. But the simple reality is that no blow torch on earth can make up for the missing Maillard reaction that is so obviously lost in these techniques. I’ve tried sous vide over and over, I’ve roasted at low temperatures, and when it was all done, I have been furious with myself for giving up so much of my life (because these are long, long, long processes) for such a profound sense of disappointment. I’ve had enough of that for one lifetime.
Meyer lemon: agree 100%. My favorite sour citrus is Bearrs, Persian, or Tahiti Lime. Just the right amount of acid and plenty flavor.
"Farm to table" doesn't bug me much, maybe because I'm an avid gardener and in the summer most of the produce I eat is from the "farm" in back. "Farm to table" sounds like a catchy marketing term that signifies little. It could be a factory farm, for example.
As for sous vide, never tried it, I understand the principle, but really a careful chef should be able to regulate the cooking temps to provide both proper searing/browning and a much lower heat to finish. I almost bought a steam table/water bath some time back to give it a try, but figured I'd rather poach an egg instead.
I do enjoy cooking half or so of a pork shoulder/butt in the slow cooker. Comes out tender and tasty, and the broth makes a killer gravy.
"Farm to table" doesn't bug me much, maybe because I'm an avid gardener and in the summer most of the produce I eat is from the "farm" in back. "Farm to table" sounds like a catchy marketing term that signifies little. It could be a factory farm, for example.
As for sous vide, never tried it, I understand the principle, but really a careful chef should be able to regulate the cooking temps to provide both proper searing/browning and a much lower heat to finish. I almost bought a steam table/water bath some time back to give it a try, but figured I'd rather poach an egg instead.
I do enjoy cooking half or so of a pork shoulder/butt in the slow cooker. Comes out tender and tasty, and the broth makes a killer gravy.
4?
John, you left out molecular gastronomy.
I just planted a Meyer lemon last year. It will replace a Lisbon that has to come out. I'm hoping conditions will favor a Meyer that's sweet enough to eat off the tree. Years ago I picked a few off of a very old tree, perhaps old enough to be the pre-improved variety, and they were sweet enough to taste the Mandarin cross. I decided I wanted a tree. Other types of lemons, like Lisbon and Eureka, are common in the landscape around here and are prolific producers, so they are easy to come by. Neighbors on either side of me have more than they can possibly use, year 'round, so I'm set.
I don't disagree that if you want the best lemon flavor, such as for a lemon meringue pie, Meyer is absolutely not the type to use. Lemon meringue is probably my favorite of all pies. One made with Meyers would be really disappointing.
I don't get why Meyers have become trendy. They're nothing new. I blame it on Food Network and other such satellite TV channels. To wit: I came across a recipe on line for lentil soup that sounded good. Alton Brown was credited. All ingredients were items you'd likely have on hand, except for one. He called for the seasoning, "Grains of Paradise" in a ridiculously small quantity. I had to look it up. I've yet to come across it, even in specialty stores. I'm not motivated to buy it on line. I did find a substitution using more common seasonings, and the soup was, of course, fine.
Dollars to doughnuts, that's just AB fcuking with us and giving us a research project. I'm betting I'll never come across another recipe that requires Grains of Paradise as long as I live.
John, you left out molecular gastronomy.
I just planted a Meyer lemon last year. It will replace a Lisbon that has to come out. I'm hoping conditions will favor a Meyer that's sweet enough to eat off the tree. Years ago I picked a few off of a very old tree, perhaps old enough to be the pre-improved variety, and they were sweet enough to taste the Mandarin cross. I decided I wanted a tree. Other types of lemons, like Lisbon and Eureka, are common in the landscape around here and are prolific producers, so they are easy to come by. Neighbors on either side of me have more than they can possibly use, year 'round, so I'm set.
I don't disagree that if you want the best lemon flavor, such as for a lemon meringue pie, Meyer is absolutely not the type to use. Lemon meringue is probably my favorite of all pies. One made with Meyers would be really disappointing.
I don't get why Meyers have become trendy. They're nothing new. I blame it on Food Network and other such satellite TV channels. To wit: I came across a recipe on line for lentil soup that sounded good. Alton Brown was credited. All ingredients were items you'd likely have on hand, except for one. He called for the seasoning, "Grains of Paradise" in a ridiculously small quantity. I had to look it up. I've yet to come across it, even in specialty stores. I'm not motivated to buy it on line. I did find a substitution using more common seasonings, and the soup was, of course, fine.
Dollars to doughnuts, that's just AB fcuking with us and giving us a research project. I'm betting I'll never come across another recipe that requires Grains of Paradise as long as I live.
Sooo.... what the hell are "Grains of Paradise"???
When I planted my lemon trees, I listened to rave reviews of Meyer and planted a dwarf version in a big pot. But I also read the books and planted a Eureka lemon, which was described as an improved version of the Lisbon (more productive and less thorny, as I recall). But I also planted a standard Bearrs (Tahiti/Persian) lime tree.
As it turns out, I dislike the taste of the Meyer lemon. It's not sweet enough to eat off the tree, and has an unpleasant, to me, off flavor. The Eureka lemons are fine, for lemons, but the sour citrus I really prefer for just about anything are the Bearrs limes. Only problem for me, is the lime tree got huge and bore so prolifically it would break branches from the weight of the fruit every fall. Plus it was in a spot where I wanted to plant veggies instead. So I bought a dwarf version and chopped down the standard lime tree. Been without a stock of limes ever since. Sooner of later I'm gonna have to plant the dwarf in the ground (it bears a few limes each year but really needs to be planted in real dirt). Only problem is that I have since put a Pink Lady dwarf apple tree in about the same spot where the lime tree was... so I'll have to find some other location for the dwarf lime.
Meanwhile the potted Meyer has been shunted off to an undesirable location. It doesn't seem to care. It keeps on putting out pseudo lemons that I rarely use.
When I planted my lemon trees, I listened to rave reviews of Meyer and planted a dwarf version in a big pot. But I also read the books and planted a Eureka lemon, which was described as an improved version of the Lisbon (more productive and less thorny, as I recall). But I also planted a standard Bearrs (Tahiti/Persian) lime tree.
As it turns out, I dislike the taste of the Meyer lemon. It's not sweet enough to eat off the tree, and has an unpleasant, to me, off flavor. The Eureka lemons are fine, for lemons, but the sour citrus I really prefer for just about anything are the Bearrs limes. Only problem for me, is the lime tree got huge and bore so prolifically it would break branches from the weight of the fruit every fall. Plus it was in a spot where I wanted to plant veggies instead. So I bought a dwarf version and chopped down the standard lime tree. Been without a stock of limes ever since. Sooner of later I'm gonna have to plant the dwarf in the ground (it bears a few limes each year but really needs to be planted in real dirt). Only problem is that I have since put a Pink Lady dwarf apple tree in about the same spot where the lime tree was... so I'll have to find some other location for the dwarf lime.
Meanwhile the potted Meyer has been shunted off to an undesirable location. It doesn't seem to care. It keeps on putting out pseudo lemons that I rarely use.
centenialguy
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 11, 2016
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re; molecuar cuisine, key limes, etc.
A native of Armada Michigan, chef Achatz in Chicago is a master of domestic molecular cuisine. One piece of specialized equipment costed him thousands of dollars. I forget his restaurant's name. It may not even ne open anymore.
He has survived neck cancer. It almost beat him. He's a fighter both for his health and his career passion.
I have enjoyed a lemon merangue pie made with meyer leomons. It's like key lime pie made with real key limes. Just better!
A native of Armada Michigan, chef Achatz in Chicago is a master of domestic molecular cuisine. One piece of specialized equipment costed him thousands of dollars. I forget his restaurant's name. It may not even ne open anymore.
He has survived neck cancer. It almost beat him. He's a fighter both for his health and his career passion.
I have enjoyed a lemon merangue pie made with meyer leomons. It's like key lime pie made with real key limes. Just better!
‘Grains of paradise’ are the seeds of the African plant Aframomum melegueta. The plant is related to ginger and cardamom, and it is spicy-hot like they are, but it doesn’t taste like either one. It’s supposed to taste gingery, but to me, it tastes like black pepper, but in a slightly different sort of way.<!-- [if gte mso 9]><xml>
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This is one of those medieval spices that sounds terribly exotic, but in fact it’s fairly common in west and north African cuisine. My own experience of it comes from medieval cuisine; cooks of that period used the grains as a substitute for much pricier black pepper. There’s a good article in Wikipedia that covers some of this.
I like grains of paradise, but I don’t understand why they seem to have caught the attention of so many foodies. As a small ingredient in a dish, it really isn’t all that different from round pepper. Even on its own, it isn’t all that dramatic.
A much more interesting ingredient from the past is long pepper, which has a really distinctive flavor. It is NOT a substitute for regular round pepper, but I like to use a bit in sausages and things like that. It works particularly well with lamb sausages.
It’s strange to me how a truly unique spice like long pepper gets no attention at all, while halfway-lemons and not-quite pepper steal the show.
[this post was last edited: 3/13/2016-17:58]
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This is one of those medieval spices that sounds terribly exotic, but in fact it’s fairly common in west and north African cuisine. My own experience of it comes from medieval cuisine; cooks of that period used the grains as a substitute for much pricier black pepper. There’s a good article in Wikipedia that covers some of this.
I like grains of paradise, but I don’t understand why they seem to have caught the attention of so many foodies. As a small ingredient in a dish, it really isn’t all that different from round pepper. Even on its own, it isn’t all that dramatic.
A much more interesting ingredient from the past is long pepper, which has a really distinctive flavor. It is NOT a substitute for regular round pepper, but I like to use a bit in sausages and things like that. It works particularly well with lamb sausages.
It’s strange to me how a truly unique spice like long pepper gets no attention at all, while halfway-lemons and not-quite pepper steal the show.
[this post was last edited: 3/13/2016-17:58]
Well I tried it today. Had a nice T bone steak in the freezer so I thawed it. I vac sealed and cooked it for a little over an hour at about 128 degrees. The induction plate really maintained the temp well, I was surprised. It was a little off the 120 setting was closer to 135, so I used the 110 setting and got it about where I wanted it. I kept a thermometer in the pot the whole time to monitor the temp.
The result? Fair to good. I like my steaks medium rare and this was. I used my Mapp Gas torch to brown it up, didn't take long. Will I do it again? No. too much time to accomplish what can be done in a few minutes on a grill or in the broiler and in a pinch the George Foreman Grill.
The result? Fair to good. I like my steaks medium rare and this was. I used my Mapp Gas torch to brown it up, didn't take long. Will I do it again? No. too much time to accomplish what can be done in a few minutes on a grill or in the broiler and in a pinch the George Foreman Grill.
toploader55
Well-known member
Been a Chef for over 40 years.
I'm over all this Trendy Crap.
I also would like to see all these As---les on these Food Shows thrown in Jail or Water Boarded for creating the most disgusting obnoxious entitled D--che Bags that now call themselves Customers.
It is getting to be a rare moment when someone comes in for any meal whether it be Breakfast, Lunch, or Dinner and doesn't have a comment, complaint or will tell the Server to tell the Chef/Cooks how they want their meal prepared and with what specific ingredients.
EAT AT HOME IF YOU'RE THAT DAMN FUSSY. TURN ON THAT STOVE IN YOUR $60,000 KITCHEN AND USE THE LOWER RACK OF YOUR DISHWASHER FOR A CHANGE.
I rarely go out anymore because as of the past 6-8 years, I have been continually disappointed to pay $28-$50+ for a entree only to come home and open the refrigerator to look for something to eat. Or be so pissed off that I spent that much money when I could have bought enough food to feed my self for 3,4 or 5 days.
And let's get into "Farmer's Markets".
The Farmer's Market to me is an Illusion created for the Bed Room Community Ranger Rover Driving Suburbanite for a weekend of making themselves feel they have not lost their roots. These are the Bermuda Short, Starched Oxford Shirt, Shiny Black Loafers with no socks people that buy "Stuff" that is not in a Package and think they are actually buying something local. C'mon...Farm Fresh Cantelopes in Maine ???
On a recent trip to Florida, I was with my Dad's Wife and stopped at a Road Side Stand. I sat in the Car. She returned with a bag in which I just had to point out that the Melons had PLU stickers on them and were Products of Guatamala. The Peppers were from Mexico, the Oranges (Yes) were from California BUT... the Strawberries were from another part of Florida. Not even remotely close.
This is also the Breed of Human that brings their Litter of Unruly, Illmanored, Misbehaving Offspring into Whole Foods and let them run amok while they read every f__king label on every product in the store and then buy a bag of Coffee after the kids have wrecked and disrupted the place and then complain about the price while checking other stores for the price on the same item on their iphones in the Check Out line and then make a commotion during the transaction.
Sous Vide ... Really ??? Hmmm... Sounds delicious to me. Put meat in a Plastic Bag and simmer it in water. Ever think about the Toxins in the Plastic that are slowly imparted into that $50.00 Grass fed Steak you are about to ruin ?
All this stuff is a big WTF ??? to me.
Mikael... I guess we should get together and have dinner. We both seem to feel the same way.
Meyer Lemons indeed. Who the hell is Meyer anyway ?
I Love to Cook. I Love to Cook Food. Real Food. Yes, there are some Fascinating Ingredients out there.
But for the Love of Pete... Give me a Plate of food I can Eat when and if I go out. 1.5 ounces of Lamb Chops with a 1/2 of a Roasted Potato, a Single Baby Carrot with a green top, and then spatter and drizzles of God knows what Foam or Trendy reduction this week all over the COLD plate for $42.00 ???
And we'll save GMOs for another Thread.
Thank You Very Much and Have a Nice Day.
I'm over all this Trendy Crap.
I also would like to see all these As---les on these Food Shows thrown in Jail or Water Boarded for creating the most disgusting obnoxious entitled D--che Bags that now call themselves Customers.
It is getting to be a rare moment when someone comes in for any meal whether it be Breakfast, Lunch, or Dinner and doesn't have a comment, complaint or will tell the Server to tell the Chef/Cooks how they want their meal prepared and with what specific ingredients.
EAT AT HOME IF YOU'RE THAT DAMN FUSSY. TURN ON THAT STOVE IN YOUR $60,000 KITCHEN AND USE THE LOWER RACK OF YOUR DISHWASHER FOR A CHANGE.
I rarely go out anymore because as of the past 6-8 years, I have been continually disappointed to pay $28-$50+ for a entree only to come home and open the refrigerator to look for something to eat. Or be so pissed off that I spent that much money when I could have bought enough food to feed my self for 3,4 or 5 days.
And let's get into "Farmer's Markets".
The Farmer's Market to me is an Illusion created for the Bed Room Community Ranger Rover Driving Suburbanite for a weekend of making themselves feel they have not lost their roots. These are the Bermuda Short, Starched Oxford Shirt, Shiny Black Loafers with no socks people that buy "Stuff" that is not in a Package and think they are actually buying something local. C'mon...Farm Fresh Cantelopes in Maine ???
On a recent trip to Florida, I was with my Dad's Wife and stopped at a Road Side Stand. I sat in the Car. She returned with a bag in which I just had to point out that the Melons had PLU stickers on them and were Products of Guatamala. The Peppers were from Mexico, the Oranges (Yes) were from California BUT... the Strawberries were from another part of Florida. Not even remotely close.
This is also the Breed of Human that brings their Litter of Unruly, Illmanored, Misbehaving Offspring into Whole Foods and let them run amok while they read every f__king label on every product in the store and then buy a bag of Coffee after the kids have wrecked and disrupted the place and then complain about the price while checking other stores for the price on the same item on their iphones in the Check Out line and then make a commotion during the transaction.
Sous Vide ... Really ??? Hmmm... Sounds delicious to me. Put meat in a Plastic Bag and simmer it in water. Ever think about the Toxins in the Plastic that are slowly imparted into that $50.00 Grass fed Steak you are about to ruin ?
All this stuff is a big WTF ??? to me.
Mikael... I guess we should get together and have dinner. We both seem to feel the same way.
Meyer Lemons indeed. Who the hell is Meyer anyway ?
I Love to Cook. I Love to Cook Food. Real Food. Yes, there are some Fascinating Ingredients out there.
But for the Love of Pete... Give me a Plate of food I can Eat when and if I go out. 1.5 ounces of Lamb Chops with a 1/2 of a Roasted Potato, a Single Baby Carrot with a green top, and then spatter and drizzles of God knows what Foam or Trendy reduction this week all over the COLD plate for $42.00 ???
And we'll save GMOs for another Thread.
Thank You Very Much and Have a Nice Day.
centenialguy
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 11, 2016
- Messages
- 82
Thank You Eddie!
Why pay good money to leave hungry?
One Manhattan restaurant is only open two nights per week. They charge $300 per person. Only a dozen or so are at each seating.
It's a tasting feast (says the chef) with over 30 courses of tiny nouvelle cuisine type dishes. One bite each.
How does he even make money?
Why pay good money to leave hungry?
One Manhattan restaurant is only open two nights per week. They charge $300 per person. Only a dozen or so are at each seating.
It's a tasting feast (says the chef) with over 30 courses of tiny nouvelle cuisine type dishes. One bite each.
How does he even make money?
toploader55
Well-known member
You're Welcome Michael.
The Tasting thing is a bunch of Crap especially if you're crazy enough to pay for it.
And then there is the "Small Plates" and the "Large Plates". Most of the time it's the same portion as the Small Plate only on a Large Plate and twice the price. Oh, all right... You get a extra squirt of drizzle or a big dollop of whatever.
OOOooooooo.... too much caffeine this morning ??? LOL
The Tasting thing is a bunch of Crap especially if you're crazy enough to pay for it.
And then there is the "Small Plates" and the "Large Plates". Most of the time it's the same portion as the Small Plate only on a Large Plate and twice the price. Oh, all right... You get a extra squirt of drizzle or a big dollop of whatever.
OOOooooooo.... too much caffeine this morning ??? LOL
#5?
Thanks Eddie. I forgot foam. Eeeeew.
Thanks Eddie. I forgot foam. Eeeeew.
Eddie, you're a riot, and I couldn't agree with you more.
My idea of going out to eat is to go to a good no-nonsense diner.
Ken D.
My idea of going out to eat is to go to a good no-nonsense diner.
Ken D.
MattL, I’m sorry the sous vide went so poorly, but honestly, that’s been my experience more than once. The technique works no better in restaurants, by the way; and I continue to cringe when I read about it or see it on a menu. Have the chefs and critics ever actually compared sous vide to the alternative cooking methods? Do they care? Do clients love it only because their last meal was a frozen, skinless, boneless chicken breast microwaved on high for 15 minutes?
I just took it as an experiment in cooking. We all stagnate if we don't try new things. Now, if I paid $199 for the tool that would be a much different story. I would not exactly say it went poorly, my take is the effort involved did not produce anything that I could not have done in another manner with less work.
Over that last few years I've come across a number of mentions of this method of cooking, felt curious enough to try it.
Over that last few years I've come across a number of mentions of this method of cooking, felt curious enough to try it.
Gee Eddie, why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel! LOL
Matt, thank you for sharing your experience with us!
Like probably everyone out there, I enjoy food. I enjoy simple food as much as I enjoy a nice meal in a nice restaurant, as long as it doesn't get too prissy and pretentious. I've posted over 700 reviews on Yelp about my experiences at restaurants and other establishments, but does this make me an expert, not even close.
Foam? What's the point? You can leave that crap in the kitchen, thank you.
Sous vide? Sounds like a lot of work (and time). But do I want a good steak cooked this way? Oh hell no! Throw that slab O beast on the grill for a few minutes, then onto my plate, thank you very much.
I have heard this process is a good way to perfectly cook fish, but again, so much time, why bother.
Kevin
