Is this a bad location for a dishwasher? -PICS-

[alr2903]

Stephenk,  take a look at that cabinet base to right of the stove.  It looks like it may have been reworked at one time to change from a 40 or 36 inch stove, if its been altered, its the one to sacrifice, especially if there is a basement under the house to facilitate the plumbing and electric work.  Just playing house buyer here no offense intended the stove is not level and there has been some searing of the cabinet top at the front right burner of the stove, the edge of the stove should be at the same height as the top of the counter to prevent a fire, discoloration of the counter top plus if you bake a cake, the stove is not level.  I would hate for you to spoil the line of your custom built cabinets, especially in the line of sight of the kitchen door.  Just something to consider. We semi restored a 1950 house,  sacrificed a single cabinet and drawer section,  these choices are never easy.  If its been altered before thats the place to start.  We seem to have the same stove hood ours yellowed as well,  yours may have been almond.  with that gray tile a stainless hood  would "pop",  a new hood is my next project.  arthur

[this post was last edited: 11/11/2012-14:57]

 

[Iowegian]

You have a beautiful home.

Back in the late 1950s/1960s, roll-around dishwashers were popular. You would cook, eat, and then roll the dishwasher into the kitchen so you could connect it to the kitchen faucet.

Built-in dishwashers didn't become popular until the 1970s.

If you don't want to give up cabinet space, and if you have a parking place for a roll-around dishwasher, that's still a valid option. Whirlpool still makes a portable dishwasher.

Something to think about, anyway.

 

[alr2903]

If his kitchen schematic is correct a portable with door open is not the greatest of options. A built in is a good investment at resale time. alr

 

[combo52]

Dishwasher Location

I see nothing wrong with placing the DW in the corner, it is actually a better location because when the door is open it is not right in the middle of the kitchen.

 

As an Appliance sales and repair person for almost 40 years I would not buy the Bosch DW unless you are prepared for a much smaller capacity machine that does a poor job drying dishes and one that you will be so frustrated with when it breaks you will likely replace it rather than try to fix it.

 

I would buy a Kitchenaid DW with the disposer or any MT DW as they all have the disposer or if you like any KM DW with the disposer that is built by Whirlpool, the WP built KMs will have an actuall model # that begins 665.  .

 

[foraloysius]

Ofcourse John's opinion is biased, he is a Whirlpool tech, not a Bosch one. I would take his advice with a grain of salt.

 

[combo52]

New DW Selection

Yes we all have are opinions or even  biases and mine have come from working on over 10.000 residential dishwashers over the last 40 years, including many Bosch DWs. I have hundreds of customers that have Bosch DWs and most are very happy with them [ when they are working ]. I have found that when replacement time comes few will buy another however.

 

All that said, it is a fact that they are MUCH smaller inside, take a measuring tape with you when you shop.

 

The loading is much more restricted as a result and it is much harder to random load large items in them.

 

And if you ever need to get the main pump and motor, heater assembly or have to fix even normally simple things like door springs and hinges you mush remove the entire machine to do so, Expensive, LOL

 

They do not have a heated dry cycle so drying performance is more iffy, you will likely have to purchase and use wetting agent to get best results costing you an extra hundred dollars or more over the life of the DW.

 

Lastly I am an independent Appliance Sales and Service dealer, we sell and service almost all makes and models.  It is often a good idea if someone wants a particular brand appliance that is not completely mainstream to call a few independent dealers [ with great reputations ]in the area you live in and ask them if they would recommend the appliance you are considering purchasing and are happy about working on it in the future.

 

 

 

[glenfieldmathk1]

I know that I would position the dishwasher in that Position It looks like there would be plenty of space to unload/load it without you reversing into cupboards etc when bending down.
That dishwasher also looks very nice indeed. After having a Neff for quite a long time now, which still works as good and as quiet as day 1 with no repairs, just general maintance (finish dishwasher cleaner, remove spray arms and clean filter every now and then) here and there its very solid and pretty good. I would certainly choose Neff/Bosch again.

Whirlpool products are very hit and miss - avoid I say. My grans Whirlpool washer for instance isn't the only Whirlpool that cant tumble during the rinses due to the amount of water used and how aw-full the motor is. The pump rattles on it too, and also on one of my uncles Whirlpool dishwashers, which is very small (supposedly still 12 place settings though), and very cheap to compared to our Neff.

I know what foraloysius is saying regarding retailer promoting various brands and trying to push sales of them because they are accredited retailer for instance. We Recently Purchased a new oven (Being delivered on Tuesday - a week today) we chose a Bosch after doing research, however most retailer we went into (first a Neff retailer, same company as Bosch, just weird knobs) - they were definatly trying to push the Neff, which we didn't want. second retailer we went into was trying to sell us a Beko (they said Beko was better made, yeah right) made Oven, which I wasn't having. I told them that if they want us to buy something, then you let us choose and not yourself. We did go for Bosch in the end at our trusted local retailer. But just be aware, shop around, and don't be fooled by retailers trying to sell their on show/in stock appliances because they need a sale take your time and choose wisely.

 

[ovrphil]

great ideas, built in dw will be a value-added, but...just a couple comments

1) That chosen area is valuable storage space, period, but you have made a decision to do a built-in. But just remember, and I base this on 10 years living in a 450ft2 flat, you will want space if you plan on living there for any length of time. So think about that chosen area - the large cupboard is perfect for one of those double pull out drawers(steel or wood, if you prefer) to house pots, pans, lids, cooking ware, or to create a nice augmented pantry area. To the right, I don't know what those are, but the tall long cupboard beneath the small drawer would make for a nice can/spice rack pull out(or additional items).

2)A portable would be great, if you had a nook where you could use the extra counter space that comes with a portable ... I don't see any space for that(?).

3)Your stove (which is not positioned at the right height, agree with ar2903)has space to the right of it. If you can utilize that space with a tall pull-out, and maybe a small drawer, you can regain some of what's lost if you put your dishwasher in where planned.

not easy, is it?

 

[stephenk]

Thanks for the opinions, everyone.

A close second in my dishwasher choice were the Whirlpool-made Kenmores, since Sears runs pretty good deals on them sometimes. The main reason I leaned towards the Bosch was because the Kenmores are louder. The Bosch also has a mostly stainless interior, which I like.

As far as the claimed poor drying on the Bosch, I have read that complaint. But, I would guess some of those people need to read the manual, which tells you how to change a setting to turn on the extra dry heat mode. I don’t think we really even use the heated dry on our current dishwasher. I know I turn it off to save energy when I run it. Overall, drying performance isn’t a huge priority for me.

But, on the side of the Kenmore units, they are a little cheaper. There's a local place selling the Bosch Ascenta series DW for $449, which is a pretty good deal. But for that same price at Sears I could get a unit with hidden controls, but without the stainless interior of the Bosch.

After the talk about sizes, I went to Sears during my lunch break and measured the racks on the Bosch and Kenmore 13289.

Kenmore 13289 - 896 sq in total
Top rack - 435 sq in
20.75" deep
21" wide

Bottom rack - 461 sq in
22.5" deep
20.5 wide

Bosch SHE3AR56UC - 790 sq in total
Top rack - 370 sq in
18.5” deep
20" wide

Bottom rack - 420 sq in
20.25" deep
20.75" wide

So, if my math is correct, the rack space on the Bosch is about 88% of the rack space on the Kenmore.

That is a decent difference, but I don’t know if it’s enough to make me switch to the Kenmores. I’ll be watching them over the Black Friday weekend, and if I see a deal on a Kenmore I can’t pass up, I may just bite. We will see. I’ve looked through the Black Friday Sears ads, and I don’t see any of the models I’ve been eyeballing as one of the super deals, but I’ll check them online during the big sales.

 

[appnut]

Do you realize the Ascenta is not 100% SS interior?  It's only 3 sides.  The bottom of the tub is not SS interior.  That is why the Ascenta line is less expensive than the regular Bosch line.

 

[appnut]

MDB7749SA Maytag

Can be had a Seasrs for $569.  SS interior.  Quieter than the Kenore you're looking at but not quite as qujiet as the Bosch.  also, the Bosch has what's referred to as a hybrid tub.  the Maytag also has  a soft food disposer and not the filter. 

 

[stephenk]

Yes, I know the bottom of the tub is plastic.

 

[Iowegian]

I will echo combo52's comments.

We have been thinking about a kitchen remodel and have been looking at new dishwashers among other kitchen appliances.

I don't understand why Consumer Reports is so enamored of the Bosch machines. They are tiny inside and don't really dry the dishes. I think CR is completely stuck on low water consumption, since that's an easy thing to measure.

Seriously, trying to claim that by using hot rinse water and rinse aid, that there's no need for a heating element to dry the dishes is absurd.

The Bosch machines claim to hold 14 or 15 place settings, but go ahead and download one of their user manuals. They hold a whole bunch of teeny tiny dishes - as evidenced by the loading pictures in their manuals. And zero pots or pans or cooking utensils. In the real world, they are not very useful - IMO. But if you want to wash your collection of Barbie Doll ware, ok.

 

[foraloysius]

IIRC Bosch doesn't claim 15 place settings for their dishwashers. And 14 is only claimed for their dishwasher with a cutlery rack.

Yes, they are somewhat smaller, but a less deep dishwasher might be great for renovating an older kitchen with a less deep counter top.

 

[mattl]

As to heated drying, I use HOT water, tank is set as high as it will go I'd say out of the faucet it's 150, and I have not used heated drying for decades.  Withing a minute of opening the door at the end of the cycle the dishes are dry.  Plus I've never wasted my money on a stainless interior, I feel that plastic tubs do a better job of holding in the heat.  At least that has been my experience.

 

[stephenk]

I bought a Bosch SHE3ARL6UC last weekend. I paid $449 + tax.

It's waiting in my garage right now. We close on our new house later this week.

 

[petek]

The Miele we had for a number of years was like Bosch measurably smaller by the numbers than a traditional machine. However we never found that it's useful loading capacity was any smaller at all.

 

[jetcone]

I would move the

4 draws over ,since they are wood, cutting and fitting them should be no problem, think how many times you will be reaching over the dishwasher to load say 30 items ? Thats a lot of bending and stretching for nothing.

Keny nice to see you post! Its been awhile for sure!

jon

 

[stephenk]

UPDATE

This has turned out to be quite a project. These are older built-in cabinets, not the modern modular style. Moving the part with 4 drawers over would have been a very involved process. It would be much more than just shifting that section of cabinet over.

Here's a look part of the way through cutting out the old cabinets.

 

[stephenk]

Here's a closer look. At this point I was starting to rebuild the opening to the correct size. I reused some of the wood for the filler panel hoping it would match. It's not a perfect match, but it's closer than if I tried to stain some new wood to match the old cabinets.

I'm a big DIY'er, with most of my experience working on autos and bikes. Since I haven't owned a home before, I'm not experienced in these types of projects. That should be clear by the fact that this job doesn't look so great. Definitely not a professional job.