KA bites the dust again: A shoppping I will go

[petek]

Happily my new KA was delivered today and I set about removing the old to make room for the new. It's only the second time I've ever installed a dishwasher and overall it went quite smoothly. For one thing I was able to use the old drain hose. Not too much cursing, mainly when I disconnected the drain hose from the old machine and way more water came pouring out than I expected. As well trying to tighten up the tiny tiny screws underneath the door handle with the supplied tiny thin allen key.. Allen Keys are the work of the devil. I was sweating by that time because I'd turned the power off including thhe a/c and it was warm and humid in the house..
Ran a small load on the Pro Wash with the Pro Scrub feature activated. That's those 4 jets on the backwall like on the Sears Elite or Pro..to see how well they scrubbed my baking pans. I won't know till the morning when I get back to the house because I had to head over to moms to momsit her for the night.

It's pretty darned quiet though it is not silent as our old Miele which was dead silent. I don't think it's actually any quieter than the 6 year old KA it's replacing with the hydrosweep 4 arms. This one has a two arm spray. The only insulation difference I noticed is that they have attached some sort of rubber matting on the sides and backwall then the very same white fiber blanket just rests over the top and sides. This rubber stuff doesn't even cover all of the sides or the back, maybe 2 square feet on each panel.
Oh one other thing.. I had to go buy a new L connector that doesn't come with the machine, to hook up the water line,,why they changed to needing that I wonder.

I took some pics but there back at the house.. I'll post em tomorrowl

 

[petek]

The old KA removed

 

[petek]

The new one getting ready to be wired up

 

[petek]

in place

 

[petek]

Inside

 

[petek]

the lights
I didn't realize when I bought this one that it lacked a Rinse & Hold feature.. which is kind of annoying especially at this price point. 95% of the time we just use the normal wash cycle on a dw but I did use the Rinse & Hold occasionally.

It has a One Hour wash cycle button which according to the instrx book uses more power and about twice the amount of water. One hour doesn't include an optional dry setting though, just wash and rinse.

 

[lebron]

I see this Kitchen aid comes w/out the 4 way washarm and has a removable filter. Does anyone know how this mechanism compares to the older Whirlpool it replaced?

 

[countryguy]

Pete,

How about a pic of the control panel?

Gary

 

[passatdoc]

@Louis and Petek

Bosch in USA are made in a plant in either Georgia or South Carolina. One would think that the pump and other mechanicals are the same on both sides of the Atlantic. The features and design of the controls differs, however, as I've seen Bosch in European stores that do not resemble what they sell here in terms of controls (but racks appear similar). I should add that Bosch is by far the most common European DW brand sold here. Some large stores like Lowes (which are everywhere) sell them, which means that even people in smaller towns and rural America can buy them (as opposed to only large cities like Atlanta or Chicago or Grand Rapids*). It's also easier to find service and parts for Bosch versus what to us are more exotic brands like Asko or Miele. Miele is not uncommon, but there are more service companies here that repair Bosch than Miele. I think one of the selling points for Bosch is that you supposedly get European design and quality, but a brand that is widespread enough that it is easy to find servicing and parts (I don't know about rural America, however).

My middle-of-the-line model is from 2001 and has never needed a repair or adjustment. One of my patients owns the local appliance store in town (no, I do not enjoy special discounts....) and he advised keeping my old machine going for as long as possible, by that he meant if it needs a $150-200 repair, then repair it and avoid having to buy a new one for as long as possible, because the newer Bosch models that he sells do not seem to have the same durability as the older models. In addition, he said that final rinse temps have been dumbed down so that at end of cycle, dishes/glasses are still not fully dry, and his customers with new machines find they have to open the door and air dry the contents for an hour or so before they are ready to be put away. In my Bosch, as soon as the cycle is over, the dishes are dry, though of course the steel interior sides are wet. He said the cleaning ability is about the same, though cycles take even longer now to accomplish the same task (because they are using even less water than models a decade old).

*Louis, that is a joke for you. There ARE people in Netherlands who consider Grand Rapids, Michigan to be a "major" city of the USA. And let's not forget Hope College (Dutch Reformed Church college) in Holland, Michigan, which is not surprisingly a center for tulip bulb production in USA. In the 1980s, I remember that a friend of yours (Trixi) visited Los Angeles and urged Californians to buy and plant more imported flower bulbs. Apparently the Princess of Orange did not know much about California gardening: tulip bulbs must be kept in the refrigerator for eight weeks to simulate winter, then you plant in December, and you get them only one year. They don't come back a second year, unless you dig them up and store them in sawdust over the summer. Sounds like fun, no? I'd like to see her do that at Soestdijk or Huis ten Bosch. Ha! However, narcissus and freesia will survive year after year here, and freesia for us is an OUTDOOR plant. Not something in a pot on a Dutch coffee table in February that you look at while stirring your coffee and complaining about the weather. (the national sport).

For the uninitiated, the women in the photo below are:

Left: then-Crown Princess Beatrix, today Queen of the Netherlands and owner of what has to be the largest hat collection in the country

Right: her mother, Queen Juliana, now deceased. Compared to her somewhat-regal (but popular) daughter, she had a very informal style in spite of being (at the time) the wealthiest woman in the world (Shell Oil and all that stuff). Unlike Queen Elizabeth, most of whose "wealth" is held in trust for the nation and cannot be sold (and is not her personal property), the Dutch royal family has very large stock and real estate portfolios which are "private" and "can" be sold or liquidated

 

[william637]

Steam Vent Discharge

As you use this machine, you will want to keep an eye on the finish of your cabinets. I have two of these newer model kitchenaids in my kitchen and they are screwing up my cabinet finish. During the wash cycle (I generally do the 1 hour wash), they pour so much steam out of these vents that my cabinet fronts have copius amounts condensate collected on them. I have thought about pulling the dishwasher forward to stop this, but that would mean that I would see the side of the unit (the insulation) sticking out in front of the face frame of my cabinets.

You would think with all the steam they putout during the wash that they might dry the dishes, but I am going to tell you oh nay-nay. Unless I open the door at least once (if not twice) during the dry cycle to let all the steam out, the dishes are not dry.

I will say though, that the units do clean somewhat decently.

 

[petek]

Here's the control panel

 

[westie2]

Pete

 

We like our 7 year old kenmore Elite with the power wash in the back it does a great job.  Never a problem with it.  It replaced a 1986 Whirlpool that got so loud you could hear it outside the house.

 

 Bob/appnut has one and really like his too.

 

 

 

[petek]

And the potscrubber jets on the back. They did a good job on my loaf pans which had that sticky PAM residue, like glue. Haven't had a chance yet to try them with the burnt on remains from scalloped potatoes in the Corningware etc. While it was running you could hear the metal pans getting sprayed intermittently, not continually, so not sure whether they run continually or sort of cycle during the wash.
On the front to the right of the handle is a tiny light which is blue when washing and rinsing, then goes red for drying and I think it goes green if you're using the sanitizing cycle.

 

[countryguy]

Thanks for the control panel pic. My KA has the rinse/hold but not the 1 hr wash...otherwise all the cycles/options are the same. I believe the pro scrub jets alternate with the lower wash arm - it's as if there is not enough power to the pump to supply water to both.

Gary

 

[tgm8000]

Rinse & Hold

all you have to do is start a cycle after it fills and washes a few times , hit the cancel drain button. Now you can rinse & hold!

 

[petek]

Yikes, I just did a full load of dishes that to be truthful were not very dirty, the dirtiest dish is the one in the picture above with some leftover spaghetti sauce on it. The rest were not much at all thanks to Pip always doing a little prewash, as well some "new" old Corningware I'd bought I wanted to wash.
On the ProWash cycle, the one they recommend, it took 2 hours and 10 minutes to get to the dry cycle.. yikes. That's way too long. I'd like to try it with a load of real dirty dishes and see if it takes the same amount of time,, in which case the whole "sensor thing" about adjusting time etc.. would be a bunch of..

we'll see.

 

[jerrod6]

Does the prowash cycle use the soil sensor?  I ask because on my USA configured  2006 Miele DW the cycle labeled NORMAL...the one you would expect to use all the time.... does not use the soil sensor.  No soil sensor, no load size sensor...So even if you wash one clean plate the machine will go through an almost 2 hr cycle using a maximum water fill level, with a water temperature no higher than 120F.  That was 2006...don't know how NORMAL works in 2012.

 

On the other hand the cycles that use the soil sensor will adjust the wash time, the wash temperature and the number of water changes to the size of the load and the amount of soiling.   The cycle time for these can be 2 hrs 10 minutes  for very heavily soiled dishes especially if the load contains  many dishes covered with starch or oil, but the cycle times can be as short at 1 hour 25 minutes for lightly soiled loads. Consequently the Normal cycle is one I NEVER use.  

 

So just because they recommend a cycle may not mean it is the best  for your conditions.

 

[jerrod6]

Another Thought

I think I read somewhere that Whrilpool/KA DW calibrate the soil sensor on the first few washes, so if the Prowash cycle is using the sensor perhaps it was doing the calibration during this first run and following cycles will be shorter.

 

I don't know what is going on during this calibration but I think I read that you are NOT supposed to open the door or interrupt the cycle.  Not sure if this applies to your model and I can't really tell you where I read this info but I know I read it..No way I could have dreamed this up. 

 

[jerrod6]

Country guy said:

"I believe the pro scrub jets alternate with the lower wash arm - it's as if there is not enough power to the pump to supply water to both."

Did you have the plate with pasta sauce placed in the back of the machine so that the jets would hit it?

 

[petek]

It's somewhat confusing, so I've scanned the charts,, although the Pro Wash cycle is the only one that shows it adjusts for time, soil level etc and the chart shows different times for soil levels etc.. so does the normal wash..
And if you look at the times for the Pro Wash it says for "light to medium" 110-150 minutes.. I would figure that what I had in there was very lightly soiled
There's really not much difference at all between it and the Normal cycle.

Unless I'm missing something