NYY Article on Using Cold Water For Laundry

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My mother said MANY years ago, You cant wash your hands clean in cold water, so how can clothes get clean in cold water. She got a free sample of Cold Power powder and would only use it to wash rugs or the dogs blanket. I still and will always wash in hot or warm but will rinse in cold now. So I guess I am doing my little part.
 
Sorry, I will NOT wash most anything in cold water, with VERY rare exceptions and even then the water would be cool or lukewarm. Cold water takes forever to fill up the washer also. I use warm on most of my loads! I don't want sludge building up in the outer basket from solidified soils!
 
Tim I'm glad you brought up hand washing! Ok they want us to start washing our clothes in cold water, when our clothes touch more filthy surfaces throughout the day than our hands do. Yet, with the germ free, hand washing craze the last few years, they say to wash them in hot water with a soap designed to kill germs. And the last time I checked, I have yet to see an antibacterial laundry detergent (other than bleach of course) and we're expected to wash clothes in cold water. I REALLY don't get the logic behind that. Oh and before anyone reminds me of how using the dryer can kill germs, don't forget, they want us to hang dry our clothes more often instead of using the dryer all the time ;) No thanks, the coldest water I use to wash my clothes is warm. It's bad enough not having a warm rinse readily available anymore like there used to be.
 
"Although some of these detergents have been available for several years, customers cling to mom’s age-old advice that hot water washes best — squandering energy and contributing to greenhouse gas emissions."

No bias there!
/sarc off
 
I just go by the care label

of the item, with some common sense.

I would never wash cotton underwear in anything less than hot (I only wear white).

I never wash kitchen or bath towels in anything less than near-boiling (I add boiling water). At least 175F.

The few "cold water wash" items I have, get cold water wash, but I have so few of them I usually wash them by hand.

I do almost always rinse in cold water, however.

Giving a hoot about the planet shouldn't obviate common sense. If I need items, and don't have a full load, I have a handy little "water level" switch.

Lawrence/Maytagbear
 
Though my whites, and towels still get hot or warm washes; I do wash some of my clothes in cold. I have tried and like Tide Cold water, however, the original is too perfumey--ok it stinks. I was happy when I found Tide Cold Water Free & Clear, but now I can't find it in the stores.

It is still listed on the Tide website, but I am not having any luck finding it locally.
 
I personally think that anything touching against my skin, such as underwear, pants and shirts, should be washed in water which as hot as possible.

Where I live, boilwashing is a very rare thing to do. We use bleach as much as the Americans do.

When I wash my denim and unmentionables, I always wash them on the hot setting, which is usually 60 C water. I feel that gets the smell out of them.

I have washed them on the warm water setting, which I believe is around 30 C here in winter. I feel that they still get clean, but they also get dirtier (And smellier) faster.

When winter is here, the water gets down to about 5 C. I don't see how that can kill germs, but rather just make them sleepy.

The only time we ever wash anything in cold water is when the label on the clothing demands it.
 
Well There's Cold And There's

*Cold*

My Miele can use either tap cold water or one can set the thermostat to 85F. The latter feels rather warm to my hand when draining so isn't exactly the frigid water you have say during a North Eastern winter.

I use machine cold setting for certain items such as linens with heavy embroidery where hot or even warm water causes so much constricting of fabric as to make ironing day more of a hassle than it already is. Also use this setting for badly stained items that are delicate as well. In both instances always use a detergent from my Euro stash such as Ariel Excell Gel or Persil (Henkel) megaperls. To both will often add sodium percarbonate (the cold water oxygen bleach), just to kick things up a notch.

L.
 
It's funny

How things change. Growing up I swear my mom's washer was permanently set on "hot/cold". When I started doing my own laundry she gave me a lecture on how "cold water will not break down the body oil in your clothes. Use at least warm water". Today (and this totally grosses me out) my Mom washes everything in cold water !!!. When I asked her about that she said "soap and water kills germs, period. And I usually ad oxi clean to the load". Sorry, not buying the oxi clean story. I will agree with here that soap and water kills germs, but all cold water washing--EEWWWWWWWWWWW.
 
I wash at 30*c

Wash Woollens/Handwash items on cold cycle, to keep them in shape and stop them from being damaged.

I wash Black clothes at 30*c to keep them dark - using a colour powder/tablet

Also wash lightly soiled stuff at 30 too, if I need it in a hurry
-
I wash colours at 40*c - including my underwear - using a biological powder/tablet with oxygen bleach in, as the oxygen bleach will sanitise them and helps remove any stains..these are all mixed colours light and dark, and they dont bleed into eachother

Whites get 40*c also - I dont see any reason to wash them at 60 unless they are heavily stained.

Towels/Sheets/White Socks - get washed at 60*c for hygiene reasons

I use the long cycles for Towels/Sheets wash, and for whites.

but I press the quick wash button for darks/colours so they get a shorter cycle.
 
Popularity of Cold Water Washing

Makes me think of the term, "The Great Unwashed Hordes." If it were not for the intensely perfumed fabric softeners, their clothes would soon smell like their washing machines and people venturing into crowds of Palinites will resume the old practice of carrying a perfumed cloth to hold against the nose.

The other hole in this argument, besides the A** Holes pushing this is that with the new HE machines using so little water to wash a load, the water heating costs cannot be what they were when machines filled with 16 to 25 gallons of hot water. This is the sort of bull crap that makes the best argument for shutting down the Department of Energy. It is nothing but a source of misinformation and a way to funnel our tax dollars to corporations while supporting a huge bureaucracy to do it. It was formed by Carter to reduce our dependence on oil and we can see what a roaring success that has been.

In the cold water months, 80-85F is the "cold" water temperature I use for dark items and those are the only things I wash in cold water.
 
DaveAMKrayoGuy's "Cold" Philosophy:

Eh, somehow I don't feel any pressure to change my Water Temperature knob...!

Everything is washed & rinsed in "Cold", except for the baby's clothes which I'll wash in "Warm", but still rinse in "Cold" (although there are exceptions where I DO use "Warm" (Wash) / "Warm" (Rinse)...)

But, if anything such as rags or towels are subject to any unsanitary conditions, then I'll use "Hot" for my wash, and still rinse in "Cold"...!

Otherwise, my clothes are clean, smell right, and are germ-free! "Cold" for my wash & rise, it is!

Otherwise bring back those "Germicidal Lamps" (maybe make 'em SAFER!) for my dryer!

-- Dave
 
Completely off subject NYT link

The P&G tech is handsome

Why is he wearing eye protection ? Humm..... OSHA ? Fumes from the detergent chemicals? Makes me wonder about what is REALLY in Tide cold water!

Being a P&G laundry product technician/researcher would be my ultimate dream job !!!
 
Great picture illustrating their solution to the temp / chemical / action equation. They definitely have the scale weighted on the mechanical action side.

Habits don't, and won't change until the cost does. Proven repeatedly through the years with motor vehicle fuels, consumption is directly related to the wallet. If the costs of energy remain low, all the advertising in the world won't change set ideas and habits.

With the advent of cheaper natural gas from shale fracking, not only will the gas get cheaper to heat the water, it may come with the chemicals already in it saving a step at the dispenser drawer. Yay! /sarc ON :-)
 
I think one of the most important things to take into consideration here is how "cold" is the cold water we are using?

As was mentioned in a thread here a few months back, the municipal water supply here in Minneapolis varies greatly in temperature depending on the time of year. This time of the year it can be as cold as 40 degrees. By the middle of August, it can get as high as 65 or even 70 degrees.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that most detergents require water of 60 degrees to wash and rinse out properly. How cold are the "cold" water detergents designed for?

I know that there are places in the south where "cold" water in the summertime is upwards of 80 degrees. Well water here in MN is typically about 50 - 55 degrees.
 
Something NOT Stated In The Article

Nothing was mentioned as to whether Tide Coldwater powder or liquid gave better results in cold water. If I were to buy that formula of Tide, it would be the powder (but I do use liquid on an occasion or two or for treating some stains).

(Did anyone else notice the techs shirt color went along well with the Tide logo?)
 
We like our laundry even better when it has been washed warm/warm or hot/warm.
The only way to get us to stop is to put some kind of additive in the laundry detergent that will dye your clothes red if it encounters hot water.

I see it coming now!

As Will Rodgers said "Thank god we are not getting all the government we are paying for!".
 
I am all for doing my bit for the environment and have tried cold water washing with detergents specifically designed for the purpose. I have no idea what our cold water temperature is in Scotland, all I know is it hurts your teeth in the depths of winter! I realise that these detergents have formulations to mimic hotter temperatures and on the release of Ariel Excel Gel washed at 30 deg for a few months. I found the results to be ok, stains gone, clothes smelled clean, washer was always fresh but after a while I thought all clothing looked "dull" which I found worrying, especially as the detergent in question was loaded with OBA's. I have since gone back to my old habits. Sturdy white cotton gets washed at 75 deg c or 60deg c, Less sturdy whited get washed at 50 deg c, Light colours get 40deg c and darks get 40 deg c ( sorry I have no idea what these temps are on F ). I find I get better results using a short option wash cycle with a higher temp than I did with extended wash times and a 30 deg wash.

I am well aware that many countries wash in cold water and if there were a detergent but their "cold" is more like our 30deg washes here. I would be quite happy to wash in cold if I got great results. I know many people say that body oils etc cannot be got rid of in cold water, but that's what the surfucants in cold water detergents do. As for germ killing...yes in some circumstances it is true but as mentioned by an Australian fellow on here, no one has ever died from bacteria on clothing.
 
Paul here they are converted to F

 

75C = 16F

60C = 140F

50C - 127F

40C - 104F

30C = 86F

 

The wash temps you use are like what I use.

Had to lots of conversions when programming for oil exploration in the North Sea.

 

Here is a conversion table link.

http://www.celsius-fahrenheit.com/
 
Talk about a bacteria obsessed population....

Provided the actual soiling is removed - dirt, oils, deodourants etc, don't be worried about the germs or bacteria. Afterall, our mouths are full of bacteria and our bodies breeding grounds for them - most of them useful to us.

 

Plus, just think about some of the things we've put in our mouths or the places we've put them before getting all worked up about germs!
 
My Mom would use hot and warm washes so much that she would sometimes have to wait for the water heater to catch up. The only thing she would wash in cold were dark colors and even then that wasn't often, usually it was with new stuff so they wouldn't bleed into our old clothes. The Whirlpool she had, had hot/warm hot/cold warm/cold and cold/cold. She would usually switch to hot/warm for a rinse cycle when she used a warm wash.
 
Hot Water & *Killing* Germs

Just as an aside, and not picking on anyone in particular but we've been down that path before...

Of all the most common household "germs" the easiest to kill via thermal methods would be E Coli which requires water temps of about 165F held for ten minutes. Everything else goes up and can require temps >180F for twenty minutes to get shot of. That is simply not going to happen with domestic hot water supplies of today.

Back in the days when water heaters/boilers routinely were set at 180F in American households one *might* have gotten somewhere close to 160F, but not today. Of course washing machines with internal heaters (mainly European models) used to and or still can reach boil wash temps but those are rare on this side of the pond.

Even with internal heaters in order to "kill" germs the wash bath must rise very quickly to the desired temperature. Otherwise bacteria and what not simply begin adapting to the changes in "climate" and launch various defenses. Some will be killed off true, but the rest will simply wait for things on the ground to improve and come back to life. Even better for them is that the field has been cleared of weaker *germs* and they now have the place to themselves to live on.

The best most can hope for is that the mechanical action of washing laundry coupled with soaps/detergents will remove germs and flush them down the drain. True they will still be alive but none the less the laundry is sanitised enough for all normal purposes. It is the shifting of biofilm one wants, that is where *germs* live and find their food.

Alkaline substances such as all true soaps and many powdered detergents also go along way in deactivating germs. Like humans most bacteria/viruses prefer a neutral to slightly acidic pH range. Once you start going up that scale conditions for living become more difficult and things die off.
 
Perhaps I am too casual, but germs aren't a huge worry for most of my laundry. If the item comes out clean and smelling fresh, that is usually good enough. I use at least some heated water--I never go below about 80 F.

I do worry about kitchen linens (where I've been known to regularly use bleach) and hand towels. Hand towels are the biggest pain--I want them reasonably clean, since I'm using them to dry my hands, often before eating. But I can't do much beyond wash in the hottest water (low 100 F. range) and dry either in the sun or in the dryer...and hope for the best.

I think I've said this before, but can't recall exactly what I said, and don't have access to the archives. But I have some concerns about Tide Cold Water, the big name in cold water detergent in the US:
1. It is not cheap. A lot of the cost savings of washing in cold could be wiped out...or at least diminished.
2. I have concerns about it possibly causing problems with skin issues. A lot of people have problems with Tide, and I wonder if Cold Water Tide wouldn't possibly cause even more problems since everything presumably gets stronger to compensate the cold water.
3. And with cold water washing in general, there can be a real problem with "build up" in hidden parts of the washer.
 
Back to my question from earlier today:
Has P & G stated anyplace what temperature they consider "cold" water to be?
Is there a temperature that is "too cold" for even Cold Water Tide? (i.e. 40 degrees Farenheit?)

I, like our illustrious webmaster, have switched to using warm RINSES in the winter here in Minneapolis because our incoming water is so cold. When the incoming water reaches 60 degrees in May or June I will switch back to rinsing in cold water.

As aside, I love playing with old US toploading machines with actual thermostatic water valves that give you 100 degree water whenever you select warm.

I've even considered the idea of installing a tempering valve on the COLD water line to my washing mashines to make sure that the cold water is always 65 - 70 degrees in the winter.
 
The question I have is...

...what is the environmental impact of these detergents?

Is there more impact from the brighteners, the enzymes, and the proprietary other items, than my Calben pure soap detergent ( which I think is soap and asking soda) that gets clothes really clean if you wash darks at 60C and whites at 70 or 90, and woolens at 40c?

I buy my detergent by the 25 pound box and use one tablespoon per load. The enviro impact of that I'd low per load, but what about this tide ? Does it biodegrade or is it toxic? How much petroleum does it take to make and to distribute these relatively small containers?

Just curious. Few feel good environmental things seem to take the whole picture into consideration.
 

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