Speed Queen the Only "Sane" Modern Washer Left?

[coreyare]

The title is my humble opinion for the time being, depending on how my stubbornness wants to play out xD.

My family bought a speed queen washer, thanks in part to Youtube user DanManTN showing how this washer takes after older machines being simplified enough for old farts, while tending to fabrics with care with a more classical method of agitation.

This machine replaced the Whirlpool washer we had since we tossed our Kenmore BD after the motor went up in smoke a year after moving into our home. I still recall my brother having difficulty with his "Th"'s saying, "it has a squirter sing, to squirt!" However mom got aggravated with the machine stinking up the clothes with mildew and mold as the machine would neutral drain leaving a ring of scum at the top of the machine. So here came the Speed Queen to save us some grief.

To put it shortly, mom digs the new rig, and it hasn't let us down yet....Now if I could recall when we got it...

The only personal two downsides I have to this machine is the center seal that is destined to go bad, and the factory maximum water level setting. The washer only fills about 3/4 full on the maximum setting, and if you were to adjust this, you would have to turn a bolt on the water level switch located inside the control panel. To give folks a harder time adjusting this, thread locking goop has been placed on the switch to hinder folks from adjusting the water level switch. Pure aggravation if you ask me...I adjusted it tho, carefully.

The reason for this title, is because I feel that other brands have totally abandoned a sense of "simplicity" and added complications that hinder the cleaning of clothes, and make it more difficult for some folk to use.

Whirlpool/Kenmore totally abandoned their DD model only keeping the top end portion of the machine, and introduced a new motor/drive-train mechanism which is a great idea in terms of updating their older design. However, this is hindered by the suspension design where you can give this machine whiplash with the touch of a finger. Tuber's have complained at the machine taking far longer to complete a cycle as a load goes out of balance much easier than it did with the direct drive model (To compare, our Speed Queen barely went out of balance upon washing two heavy machine washable pillows). You also cannot let these machines fill with the lid open, as they must remain closed, and the automatic water level sensors have been problematic for some YouTubers clothing too.

GE has had its fair amount of issues with its electronic control boards causing malfunctions with their machines. One tuber I am subscribed too has an issue with a mode shifter causing the spin basket to turn during agitation - a flaw in the electronic control board.

Speed queen seems to be the only modern washer (correct me if im wrong) to have mechanical timers, switches, etc. As other modern washers are fraught with proprietary control boards which are expensive to replace and are unrepairable upon failure. Although a front loader - I recall repairing a friends Maytag Neptune with an irreplaceable blown fuse on an electronic control board, which required DE-soldering the bad fuse, or replacement of the entire control board.

So after this two hundred page ramble session, would you say that Speed Queen is the only "Sane" washer left?

These are just my opinions, I am an old man stuck in a young guys body, so I can be pretty grumpy at some modern devices at times

 

[arbilab]

I'm a young man stuck in an old guy's body and I dislike the 'newfangledness for no dawlgone dagflabbed good reason' too. This retirement ghetto doesn't allow personal laundry equipment but I still own a 'basic' mechanical timer frontloader I bought in 1998 and in the 14 years it ran nothing went wrong and it didn't even stink. It's even simpler than a SQ. Motor, belt, standalone pump.

 

[mtn1584]

You are not alone

I love my SQ as well, I understand Alliance laundry the manufacturer of SQ washers has changed the seal from it's previous owner's design (Amana, Raytheon.) The Raytheon Amana machines which are identical to the Alliance Speed Queen machines had many premature seal failure issues. Alliance / SQ changed the seal design, and addressed this issue, so I do not think we will have seal issues..(fingers crossed) even if I did, I would go back out and buy another SQ...there really is no other choice....The last best Kenmore washer was made by Whirlpool around the year 2000.
Mike

 

[washman]

I concur

I looked long and far and SQ is the only machine that does what it needs to do without a ton of useless unreliable features that do nothing buy jack up repair bills.

Hopefully Alliance can continue to make these machines for some time to come.

 

[jeffg]

Don't know if it's the only sane washer left, but it was the only one we could find when we needed one several years ago.

Glad to see SQ/Alliance getting the respect they deserve, but I'd kill for a neutral drain on these machines. Much less hair/dirt/gunk in a load of wash water gets redeposited on clothes during a neutral drain, which is why Lady K's and other higher-end washers used them for so many years.

 

[mayfan69]

Neutral drain

Hi Jeff

Speed Queens for export to Australia actually have neutral drains with electric pumps and have been this way for many years, specifically to counteract any linting issues.

I'm sure there could be a way of retro-fitting a US Speed Queen, but not sure how.

Cheers
Leon

 

[jeffg]

Leon, thanks for the info. I wonder if it's just a matter of swapping out the timers to get a neutral drain?

 

[mayfan69]

Timer swapping

Hi Jeff

I think it probably would be about swapping timers. I'll have to have a look at what information i have and see if i have any wiring diagrams which show this.

I do know there was a 'kit' available to repairmen here in Australia to retro-fit the early Speed Queen/Kleenmaid machines from spin-drain to neutral drain, whatever i find i can email you.

Cheers
Leon

 

[combo52]

Current SQ Top Load Washers

Hi Coreyere, I am glad you and your family are enjoying your SQ TL washer, they are refreshingly simple to use and understand, which is why we sell so many of them.

SQ put the thread lock on the water level adjustment screw NOT so you could not change it, but so the adjustment would not move on its own, and, if you readjusted the water level you would be wise to put a little thread locking material or even nail polish on the screw threads.

The center main seal has been greatly improved , BUT all washers with a moving water seal at the bottom of a tub full of water could eventually have a serious problem, this was also true GE FF, MT Helical Dr washers, Norge, current GE TL washers and now WP built belt drive and higher end direct drive Cabro style washers. The seal design of the old WP BD and the WP DD washers did not have this kind of troublesome main water seal which is a main reason that these washers often lasted so long under adverse usage conditions.

I to wish that SQ would go to a neutral drain system and while ND is not a perfect way to get the dirty water out of the washer it is FAR BETTER than trying to spin the load while draining. When the tub starts spinning and draining at the same time any scum on top of the water is immediately sent down into the center of the load and strained and forced through the clothing. Any sediment and much of the lint still in the load is also forced to the side with the clothing and held there by the spinning force and the clothing, if the tub was not spinning at this point more of this sediment and lint would just drain away with the exiting water through the holes in the bottom of the tub. This action is VERY WELL PROVEN.

WP went to a lot of extra expense when designing and building their BD washers to make them ND and EVERY WP built BD washer through 1987 NDed. WP tried to cut cost when they introduced the DD washer in 1981, but the poor results quickly caught up with them [ we were actually taking back DD washers and giving the customer BD washers in the mid 1980s beaus of linting complaints ] and therefore they devised a clever way to make the new DD system ND.

Every TL washer in the world uses ND now and if SQ keeps making TL washers much longer you will also see it on new SQs.

John L.

 

[washman]

Many maytags, GM Frigidaires were spin dran also

And I don't remember reading any complaints about lint or excess dirt remaining in the clothes. Even looking through many CR back issues I don't see any notation of excessive lint or dirt.

FWIW, the GE profile I had was a neutral drain. The SQ is a spin drain and I cannot see any difference at all in the end results after a spin.

From a manufacturing perspective, with SQ having a spin drain, that eliminates another electrical connection. The pump can remain on the motor or in the case of the old models, be driven by a separate belt. I would assume that a reversing motor is a tad bit cheaper than 4 ft of wiring plus an electro-mechanical pump.

 

[yogitunes]

considering the pump out height of a SQ is not all that high.....an electrical pump may be more helpful for many installs, running high speed all the time versus the slower motor speeds....

and sometimes helpful should the main motor give out, at least you can still drain the machine for service.....

not everyone has the perfect station for washer installations...

the Neutral drain, if anything, takes the heavy load off the machine before the spin....and lowering the load of clothing gives it more of a center a gravity for balancing....

there are pros and cons in every situation....

 

[ddbeltdrive]

New Whirlpool Belt Drive

I have model number wtw4800xq and its isn't a bad washer in my opinion. These washers have to be loaded correctly. I separate my loads according to whether their pants, shirts, hoodies, or sheets and get perfect results every time. The casual cycle takes about 33 minutes and is good enough for whatever I wash. If i have really dirty greasy clothes from work, they go in on the super wash cycle which is a looonngg cycle however i like it because of the long agitation stroke that produces great turn over with excellent results every time. The washer will fill with the lid open and has the older style water level pressure switch. The tub fills to the very top on the super water level setting, large, medium and even small settings produce enough water in the tub for excellent turnover no matter what size load i wash. I also like the fast spin. Clothes come out with less water and dry faster in my old GE dryer.

Now the Bad

I hate the lid lock! The first day i got the washer home, even before I ran the first load, I disabled it by taking the mechanism out of the lid and sticking it in the lock. I like to be able to lift the lid and see whats going on. I dislike how long it takes to fill the washer. I believe there are restrictors in the water supply valve. I contemplated removing them but i didnt want to risk screwing up a brand new washer lol. If its possible to do that someone please let me know It cant handle my comforter. Its too heavy and the machine cannot balance the load. I repaired my old model 70 and use it for my really heavy stuff.

 

[thefixer]

So, the control board doesn't care if lid switch is never cycled? Some washers with electronic control will disable the washer if it doesn't detect opening/closing of the lid within a certain number of wash cycles.

 

[yogitunes]

yes, you have to pull the lid switch actuator out after every load to reset the machine.....odd, but it has to be done....not the best bypass of a switch, but it gets us thru....

I took the restrictors out of mine, take off the hoses, pull out the plastic screens, reach in with needlenose pliers and pull out that little black circular washer inside, push the screens back in, and re-attach the hoses......made a world of difference during fill time...otherwise it seemed to take forever...they can be put back in place just as easy...

 

[Chetlaham]

 

[Chetlaham]

Ok I just typed 2 paragraphs apparently adding any faces deletes it all...GRRRR

 

Any way,

 

After using a speed queen as a daily driver for nearly a month Im monster happy with it, and its way better over any machine sold in the last 10 years by a long shot. Built like a machine from the early 80s. It is the only sane washer out there and as would be their front loaders. The newer whirlpools are way to slow, they fill slow, pump out slow, spin takes sometime to ramp up plus the machine pauses for long periods during the cycle all in the name of energy. I regret to say but outside of speed queen the new top loads are gone. The newer Whirlpools also no loner seem to have an adjustable pressure switch but rather the control board decides that even on the models with a fill water level selector nob.

 

In my experience spin draining is something I prefer. Lint and dirt  seems to be centrifugally pulled away from the clothes rather than just being strained through the clothes then being folded into the ridges during the spin.  Spin draining also brings the clothes up higher which pulls more water out in the end, plus less wrinkling since the clothes don't clump up at the bottom.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[washman]

chetlaham I dig the spin drain

Back when CR actually did half way decent reviews and they used charts to rate washers, SQ along with Maytag and pre WCI Frigidaire were never knocked for their spin drain process.

I notice no more lint than I did with my neutral drain GE.

 

[ken]

After following

and learning what I have from this thread even though I dont need a new machine at the present Im giving some serious consideration to buying a new SQ (before even they go the way of electronic controls) and keep in storage for future use. Or at the least buy a few used SQ.

 

[Chetlaham]

BUY a Speed Queen!

I don't think you will regret it. When they do finally turn the top loaders into high efficiency machines (Im sure as I type they are testing prototypes) the certainly will not be the same. The commercial models are already pilot testing a cool down as a full rinse where half the water is drained out then refilled. I would definitely keep in storage for future use it will be like buying a normal machine brand spakin new while no one else can... priceless! 

 

[jeffg]

If they plan on not being litigated out of business they better include an option to not use this water-saving "feature". The last thing I want my clothes rinsed in is e.g. poison oak or ivy oil residues.

 

[washman]

A good path to take would be

to see what, if any, changes can be made to the unelected DOE?

I can live with, while not agreeing to, the majority rule. In other words, if the marketplace demanded these machines, then so be it.

What I have a philosophical issue with is an unelected body of pencil pushing bureaucrats dictating how much water (which is not in short supply by the way) I use to:
1. Shower.
2. Flush my toilet
3. Do my laundry

Pop quiz time again (I like to use these to see if anyone is paying attention)

Q. What do you call a form of government that issues policy without voter input?

A. A dictatorship.

And that folks is what we have now. It is not a democracy. Far from it. In the real world, far removed from the offices of the DOE, no sane consumer would accept HE TL machines or even HE FL machines. Why? Simple, they do not clean as well as an old school top loader. Period. End of sentence. Full stop. I don't care if you have GM era Frigidaire or a homely Kelvinator from Pre-WCI days, fact is, those old school machines were made that way for decades for one reason. They worked. Not a difficult concept to figure out. No matter what the DOE or some other eco-nazi group wants us to believe, those piles of junk foisted upon a reluctant public are useless. Talk to me about time, will ya? Over an hour to do a friggin load? I thought we were all stressed out from lack of "time" to do the things we want to do. How in god's name does that make sense? When I can do a similar load in an old school SQ, have it in the dryer, and be home in time for corn flakes?

I could live with consumer demand telling Whirltag, GE et al hey, we want more efficient machines. While I may not agree, when the marketplace demands it, I can go along much better than when an unelected bunch of dolts "dictates" policy to me.

I'm a very proud owner of a Speed Queen. I have no affinity to them other than the fact they still produce a washer that leaves me in control of things. Like how much water I use. How long the cycle is. Whether or not I want to use the second rinse option. For the life of me, I cannot figure out how I can have clean clothes with a paltry 15 minutes of agitation whereas a new fangled TL or FL takes over an hour to do the same thing? Then there's the mold issues. The piss poor quality and reliability. The special "cleaning" cycle (an oxymoron if there ever was one).

And this is "progress"? Not hardly. Rather, it is special interest groups bullying their way into the system and forcing the rest of us to comply with their half baked concepts of conservation.

Even if the SQ cleaned half assed, which it doesn't by the way, I would STILL own it just to stick my middle finger in the air in the direction of Washington DC.

Finally, here's one for story time. In 2002 my dear parents retired to sunny Florida. They bought a used home that had some rather strange remodeling done. One thing that was junk from the get go was the toilet in dad's bathroom. It developed a crack from the rim to the floor. It needed to be replaced. Dad already had experience with the eco-nazi approved 1.6 gallon water savers (here we go again) and was dead set against getting another one. So he literally ordered me to get on the internet and find him a *#*#&$& toilet that used plenty of water to move feces and toilet paper into the sewer.

Well I found some...........in Canada of all places. Seems the Canucks at the time had a sensible approach to toilet design and still sold 3.5 gallon units. Hooray! Only problem is there were located in Windsor, Ontario and did not ship to USA.

What to do?

I tell you what I did.

I called them up, ordered it, gave them my CC. 2 weeks later, they said come get it. It was an American Standard with elongated bowl and an insulated tank. Sort of an off white color, bone perhaps, but dad was not concerned at all about the color. I took a Friday off, drove from W Pa in my Suzuki Vitara SUV, crossed over the Windsor bridge, arrived at Windsor Plumbing supply. While I waited for the toilet to be loaded, the two managers laughed and said they sell more toilets to USA residents than Canadian subjects. Well jolly nice. I headed back through USA customs on the Detroit side. The customs agent asked if I had a water closet in the back. Sure did, was my reply, then I added, My mother is into alternative landscaping. He laughed and told me to get the hell out of here!

How did it get from PA to FL? Well dear old dad wanted to visit so he gassed up his 2000 Dodge Intrepid and drove up. We spend a few days going out, shooting, and watching the tube. Then he headed back to sunny FL had the toilet installed and never looked back. It is still there, dutifully removing human waste and toilet paper. And it has yet to see Korky the plunger provide "assistance".

Moral of the story is this: When I say screw the government, I am serious. Which is why I have a Speed Queen in the first place!

 

[imperial70]

Politics and automatic washers don't mix

IMHO.
Your opinion is greatly appreciated ( I hear you loud and clear on many points for what that is worth) However, I don't think Speed Queen wishes to get mixed up in a political campaign. They just want to sell products.

I also don't think it is fair to the webmaster either for many reasons.

Let's have fun and enjoy what we know and what we know are appliances.

nuff sed.

 

[washman]

I went downstairs just now

Stood in front of the SQ for a few. Had a cig. Feel better now.

The only unfair aspect is what is forced on consumers. Nothing is unfair to the webmaster on this thread. Nothing at all.

Will do another load tomorrow, I know I will feel 100% back on track afterwards.

Now let's see......do I use Tide, A&H, or Sears Powder? Decisions, decisions, decisions.

 

[Unimatic1140]

Nothing is unfair to the webmaster on this thread. -- Then it looks like we need to check the rules. Let's go over the Forum Topics as are printed into the rules:

Deluxe Forum:
The Deluxe Discussion Forum for topics relating to modern/current automatic washers, dryers and dishwashers made less than 20 years ago, thru today and beyond.

Dirty Laundry:
A donating member only forum for discussion around any off-topic subject that might be controversial such as Politics, Religion, Sexual Overtones, etc.

Ben while I agree with a few of your points, your post is clearly a political rant and it does not belong in the Deluxe forum. If you want to discuss politics then you are going to have to upgrade and post them in Dirty Laundry. This is it now, no more heavy duty political talk in the public forums please. A small mention of is fine once in a while, but this is way overboard.

Thank you.

 

[coreyare]

Re:

Never thought to use threadlocker in that sense, but I may have to consider putting some on mext time as it wont self-adjust. xD

That would be interesting to attempt to try a physics simulation of the spin-draining action on a washer and compare it to a neutral draining machine.

I've considered in theory that the concept of a spin drain would be as you said a method of reducing production costs, but also an attempt to flush any scum that has accumulated near the top, but this has been disproven by a youtuber opening up his maytag and having all kindsa gunge built up near the top of the machine. So in turn a neutral drain may be a good posibility, but thats an extra module and accessories to add to the production line. Some washers from youtube videos I have seen, actually spray rinse just as the water comes towards the top upon spin draining I guess to attempt to flush and dispurse the floating soap scum and soil.

The new DD actually did introduce a spin drain and some folk said it was to avoid scum build up in the tub, as it was a mere spin pawl thingus that would engage the spingear upon the motor turning clockwise, however WP cheesed out on this machine as they made the spin gear out of nylon or some plastic stuff, and the extra stress on the spin gear would eventually lead to it shearing and not allowing hte machine to spin, so then WP rigged in a buncha doohickies to make it ND upon the washer agitating for several minutes to "reset" the neutral drain pak, This works great although there does exist the problem of the ND pak wearing and spin draining upon draining even after agitation. Then there also exists the occasional bad agitate cam which lead to agitation and spinning at the same time.

Oh yes, that is a posibility that I have theroized on as well, simply drain half the wash water, and then refill and not even spin for the "rinse" cycle, its a good idea in my mind as it would save energy and water, but im not sure how it would perform in the real world. :O

All in all, its gonna be a chore chainging that main seal when it goes bad :O!

 

[combo52]

Nylon Spin Gear In WP DD Washers

This was done to make the gear case quieter during spin, WP built over 100 MILLION DD washers and is actually still building two popular 24" and 27" stack machines with the cast iron DD transmission.

I have NEVER seen a single failure of this nylon gear.

Maytag also used a plastic pinion gear in EVERY automatic washer they ever built going back to their first automatic in 1949 and AGAIN I have never seen one of these gears fail.

Plastic is one of the best things that ever happened to Automatic Washer Production and in most cases when a part was changed from metal to a plastic material the durability of the machine became better.

John L.

 

[mayfan69]

Plastic pinion gear

I have to agree with John on the plastic pinion gear: I've stripped down gearboxes for various Simpson's and Wilkins Servis's (which use the Maytag gearbox) here in Australia and have seen a metal pinion gear in a Simpson transmission completely worn down, but NEVER in either transmission's where they have the plastic pinion gear.

 

Cheers

Leon

 

[coreyare]

Ah, I stand corrected, but I have seen a few tubers have videos of worn spin gears :O

 

[kb0nes]

Don't believe everything you see/read on the Internet. A large percentage of it is just the CB on TV...

 

[coreyare]

Ah then yes I definitely have become schoooled, its just I had this thought of the metal gears transferring the heat load more effeiecently than the plastic, and simply being overall more durable.

Certainly I would have to make some kinda experiment...

But plastics have certainly improved despite the evolution of metalurgy