Take a look at my KD-12

[dishwashercrazy]

Neil:

I parted out a KD-12P, and as a last resort, if you are unable to find a drain valve for your KD-12, you might have luck adapting your gravity drain with this KD-12P valve.

Here is photo 1 of 2.

Mike

 

[dishwashercrazy]

Photo 2 of 2:

Obviously, it would need to be de-rusted. The bottom of the valve casting is different for the 12P, which has a pipe outlet that fits directly into the top of the water sump. The bottom of the valve casting for the 12 is fitted for a drain pipe connection. But I belive that the sump could be removed, and with some creative plumbing, adapted for gravity drain use.

Mike

 

[dishwashercrazy]

I also have a fan and heater assembly, which works - I just connected it up and it runs fine.

 

[swestoyz]

some creative plumbing

For years now I've often thought of different ways to eliminate the need for the original style 10-14 series drain valve, as well as the original 10-11 series auxiliary pump, or 12/14 series integrated pump.

Sure, you would not get the reassuring sound of a full-size slide solenoid operating, but you'd still have a functioning dishwasher. Moving forward this will be key to keeping these machines running (on top of finding wash pump seals).

Use a flange from a B&G circulator pump on the outlet side of the tub, convert it to a 90 degree elbow and drop the size down to 5/8, use a drain valve from a 16-17 series machine, then use an auxiliary pump if needed. Unfortunately I got rid of a parts 12 machine before I could test this theory. It all hinges on getting a flange to work with the original tub.

The auxiliary pump could then be activated by the solenoid contact on the timer, as well as the new coil for the drain valve, or some creative TTL programing for those adventurous types who like custom cycles

Ben

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[stevet]

Water pump maybe?

Mike, when you parted out your machine, did you save the water pump which was mounted on the motor as well as the pressure(water level) switch? If you did, then the 12 in question can be convered to a pump drain which makes it much more versatile.

Also, if you cannot find any door gaskets for the 10/12/14/ series, you can use the ones from the 15-16-17 series as they are the same just longer and can be trimmed as needed.
As a last resort, you can use the WM series commercial gasket from your Hobart dealer. Part number is 121030-2 and are available for 19.70 and get some new gasket clips, part number 24677 which are 2.00 each and usually came 6 to a bag.

Hope this helps

 

[combo52]

OLD 10-14 KA DWs DRAIN VALVES

As Ben and Mike and others suggested there are many to fix these simple rugged DWs. If you want to gravity drain one of these machines you could use a dump valve from a commercial FL washer. If you want a pump drain installion there are any number of newer style drain pumps that could be adapted. You wouldn't generally need to add a drain valve and a pump . One other thing to keep in mind is that a relay may have to be added as the timer contact for draining only supplies power when the machine is NOT draining. That way the timer will activate the relay coil and the relay will open the contact to the drain valve or drain pump.

 

[toploader55]

OMG...The Dreaded Bakelite Trap

When I rebuilt my KD2-P...If it takes 2 weeks to loosen that trap, be careful. I sprayed WD40 and gently tried to work it loose off the Cast Iron Valve. Be Careful.

 

[henry200]

So, John, if I understand correctly what you're saying, and after looking at my machine and the pic of the drain assembly that Mike posted, the solenoid is energized to keep the valve closed until drain periods when the spring pulls the valve open?  Then the water drains either by gravity or the presence of water in the drain sump activates a pressure switch to start a drain pump?

 

Using a pump for draining would definitely be more convenient plumbing-wise.  Configuring a gravity drain under the machine in the basement would take a lot more work but it's not impossible.  I suppose I could jury-rig a quick and dirty arrangement and run some tubing the 15 feet or so to empty into the laundry tub! 

 

The first thing I need to do is figure out a way to temporarily seal the outlet so the tub will hold water, then I can check for leaks and try running the machine to see if everything works.

 

[stevet]

Pump ready!

These dishwashers came pump ready and as long as you can get a punp from one of the members it is an easy deal to set up. The bottom of the motor has a removable plate and the motor shaft was designed to accept the shaft from the drain pump. The drain pump was secured to the motor with 2 screws, Then it mated to the trap and when the drain solenoid de-energizes during the drain periods, the pump pumps out the water.

Since the wash pump motor runs continuously the drain pump would also pump out any excess water that went down the overflow hose and emptied in to the trap.
If you somehow manage to jury rig something that gravity drains it into your slop sink in the basement, make sure that you also adapt the overflow to drain there as well as you won't have the pressure switch to shut the water valve off in case the machine overfills.
None of this is impossible to live with, but having the correct original aprts will make it much easier.

If you should manage to locate the correct parts and use the pump drain, make sure that you loop the drain hose up the back of the machine to create a siphon trap.

A look at the parts manual will show you what I am talking about. It was a copper tubing affair that was bolted to the rear of the machine.

 

[henry200]

First test run

Here's what I did and what I've learned so far.  Using a laundry tub drain stopper I plugged the dishwasher drain then poured in 2 gallons of hot water.  I let that sit for about 30 minutes and then started her up.  I'm working out in the garage and couldn't lay my hands on the bits and pieces I'd need to connect the garden hose to the fill valve.

 

The timer works fine, as does the drain valve solenoid.  

 

The fill valve buzzes during fill phases, definitely more than the little hum I expected.  Can these be worked on or should a new one be on the list of parts to look for?

 

There two spots in the seal between the motor and tub where a few drops of water leaked.  A small bit of water escaped from the bottom corner of the door when it first started up but no leaks during the rest of the cycle.  The biggest leak is at the back around the air duct.  A new gasket there is definitely necessary.

 

The fan and heater work fine.  I'm amazed at how much heat that thing puts out.  The duct at the back gets too hot to touch within seconds!

 

Keep the advice coming.  I appreciate every bit of it!

[this post was last edited: 8/9/2011-20:11]

 

[dishwashercrazy]

Steve,

The KD-12P that I parted out was missing the motor (and pump as you describe), which explains why I can not find the pump in my box of parts. I do have the pressure switch and hose that leads back to the sump.


Neil,

If you decide to go with a conversion and need any of the parts I have mentioned, just let me know.

Mike

 

[henry200]

Mike, I sent you a message via your aol email from "fonds8"

 

[henry200]

After leaving water in the tub for 24 hours it appears that the small leak in the gasket between motor and tub has closed up.  The spot where it was leaking is completely dry.  Perhaps the gasket just needed more time to soften up after being dry for a long time?  I'm going to run the machine through another cycle again to be sure.  I'm sure the likelihood of finding a replacement gasket is somewhere between lightening strike and lottery winning.  Has anyone ever "made" a gasket to fit?  Is there such a thing as "blank stock" gasket material from which to cut a new one?  Would re-seating the motor to the tub using a high quality silicone sealant/caulk work or is that inviting disaster?

 

[Unimatic1140]

Perhaps the gasket just needed more time to soften up after being dry for a long time?

Absolutely, the gasket shrinks over time and hot water makes it expand and seal again. It usually takes 24 hours for the the gasket to repair itself if it is going to (which doesn't always happen).

I never look for new-old-stock gaskets, I always cut new ones from fresh roll-cork or sheet neoprene. New-old-stock cork gaskets dry-out and degrade many times simply by sitting on the shelf. Sometimes even new gaskets wont work if the cut area in the metal has rusted or deformed from moisture, in that case I use Permatex Ultra-blue non-toxic silicone which has never once not stopped a leak.