The LIghtbulb Conspiracy aka Planned Obsolesence

[qualin]

If I could afford it, I would gladly stock up on LED light bulbs with the expectation that they would last at least 25 years without being changed.

The problem is, the technology is still too new and problematic. (Which amazes me because LED's have been around since the late 60's.)

Some friends of mine purchased some LED light bulbs and found that they're nearly useless. Poor light output, poor colour temperature and short longevity, worse than a normal light bulb.

I've already replaced most of the light bulbs in the house with CFL's, but I'm finding that they have a very comparable lifespan to a normal light bulb, so if anything the idea was that we could save money on our power bill. It's not much.

Then our friends gave us all of their old CFL's because the colour temperature is way too hot. (9300 K vs 6500 K) .. so we'll keep those until they all burn out.

I actually completely ruined the inventory at the local Home Depot because all 20 of my Phillips CFL's burned out before the end of their 3 year warranty. Amazing.

 

[neptunebob]

Kenmore 71,

For a stage light, I thought the color output "temperature" was variable, depending on how far the dimmer was adjusted.  Or are there some dimmers that keep the color the same (though I dont know of any).  Is it possible to use smaller bulbs to keep the light "white"?

 

[kenmore71]

Neptunebob,

The color temp. is variable depending on the dimmer setting. The color temps that I listed above are at full rated voltage. The color temp. goes down as the lamp is dimmed. I have never seen any actual data that outlines the actual drop in color temp in degrees Kelvin related to voltage reduction. I don;t know if the curve would be linear or exponential in nature. I do know from experience that stage and studio lamps tend to go "red" as the voltage is reduced.

 

[neptunebob]

Kenmore 71,

For a stage light, I thought the color output "temperature" was variable, depending on how far the dimmer was adjusted.  Or are there some dimmers that keep the color the same (though I dont know of any).  Is it possible to use smaller bulbs to keep the light "white"?

 

[sudsmaster]

A word about the supposed higher quality of older goods.

What I think happens is that the older stuff we see still usable today is the cream of the crop, so to speak. The higher quality stuff that was bought by families or individuals who took care of it, had it properly maintained, etc., so that it hasn't wound up a lump of rust in a dump.

And there have been, over the past few hundred years, a LOT of manufactured products that were cheap, shoddy, or just not built to last, and have wound up part of the rust stream. We just aren't as aware of them because of the very reason that they didn't last to our day.

Look at a Walmart, a Kmart, or a Target store. It's packed with shoddy goods that probably won't last more than 30 years, if that. Why? Because stuff made to the lowest common denominator cuts corners, is cheaper to make, and cheaper to buy, and that's what the public generally wants. And that hasn't changed over the centuries.

This makes vintage appliances and other goods all that more valuable from a social perspective: for every vintage washer that we might enjoy finding, restoring, and using, there are likely hundreds of others that had much shorter service lives and wound up as scrap somewhere. It's not to say they were bad products, they were just built to a price point and an economic decision was made when they gave out to replace rather than repair.

I happen to own a number of older cars, and I've gone through at least one of them mechanically thoroughly, bringing it back to good running and cosmetic condition. It's an interesting challenge and the ease of working on the older stuff is offset by the scarcity of parts and in some cases knowledge of how older technology was supposed to work. But when I compare these old rides with cars made today, it's unquestionable that the newer cars are far better designed. They are more efficient, require far less maintenance, and last many more miles at higher speeds than the cars of the 50's and earlier.

Periodically I'll hear someone say, in reference to a vintage car, "They don't make them like that any more". To which I sometimes reply, fully mindful of the softer alloys, the more maintenance intensive technology, and the lack of many safety features, "Thank God!". I'll get a puzzled look, and then I'll have to explain that the "good old car" wouldn't do today as a daily driver for most anyone with a commute. It just isn't built to take the higher speeds, longer distances, and longer intervals between servicing. And, when something breaks, it often is a treasure hunt to find a replacement, and finding someone to work on an older car can be nearly impossible unless you're going to do it yourself.

Don't get me wrong, I love old washers and cars and stuff, but I also think it's important not to get an overly rosy view of what it was really like in the day to purchase, use, repair, and replace products. There was just as much crap on the shelf and the car lot back then as there is today, if not more.

 

[arbilab]

shoddy goods that probably won't last more than 30 years
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Typo, right? You meant THREE years. Dell targets the center of their failure bellcurve at 3 years. Some don't last 3 MONTHS. Some NEVER work. NOBODY in the "old days" designed stuff like that.

Can't well compare cars, washers, and mostly-non-mechanical electronics. Washers don't undergo 1/10th the thermal cycling and tolerance clashes a car engine does.

Car mechanics are much better than they were 50 years ago. Because the machines that make them are much closer tolerances. But marketing and bookkeeping have worked against engineering the whole time. Marketing = more complicated, more to go wrong like electronic washer control modules. Bookkeeping, more corners cut, like computer and washer materials.

Result, 10 years ago stuff might last 10 years, like my washer and puter did. My car still works fine after 26 years. But NONE of those things bought today will last that long. And that's not because we CAN'T, it's because we deliberately decided NOT TO.

 

[tolivac]

Keep in mind todays cars contain more ELECTRONIC devices in them than cars built years ago.So that will affect their life.

 

[sudsmaster]

It depends of course on the product genre.

Of course electronics etc have planned obsolescence. They might still work fine in 10 years but you won't be able to get any new software/apps/jollies to run on them. Even TV's are changing fast. We've seen it go from CRT to Plasma to LCD to LED and now 3D is the hottest ticket.

I have one 42" LCD set, and three CRT's, two still hooked up to digital broadcast converters. The CRT sets still work fine, just low resolution etc.

 

[launderess]

Cheaper To Make - Cheaper To Buy

When it comes to appliances at least we've been down that road here in the group so many times it's worn a groove. *LOL*

Long ago appliance makers had a decision to make, build rock solid things (for the most part) like they were and depend only on new home/remodel sales, or simply let things die a natural death and *have* to be replaced.

Once you go the second route it opens the door to all sorts of cost cutting measures that may or may not lower the quality, but affect the bottom line none the less.

Frigidare and other *greats* saw what was coming down the pike and decided (for many other reasons as well) to get shot of the appliance business. After the post war housing boom began to fade, and the inflation of the 1970's took hold it was clear to some that the "major appliance* market was starting to mature. Once that happens you have to think long and hard about how to compete, if you want to at all.

Maytag,Whirlpool,General Electric and WCI between them hold patents and trademarks to nearly 80% or more of the major appliance market and could have resurrected any of the old designs and built them "they way they used to", but obviously that never happened.

The other side of the coin is consumers probably would balk at paying (adjusted for inflation) what the "old built like a tank" appliances would cost today. There is a reason why white goods are called "major appliances", and at one time it was a serious purchase expected to give decades long service.

 

[combo52]

Appliance Life Spans

Rich your thoughts on new vs older products were right on the money.

 

There have always been junky major appliances, I have been in this industry long enough to say that overall [ like new cars ] Major Appliances today are better and will last longer [ with far fewer repairs ] than ANYTIME in the history of major appliances over the last 50 years.

 

But as always if you want LONG Life look for brands and products that have a proven track record and have good parts and service available. If you are picking appliances like most of us select Cell Phones you will get similar life spans out of them.

 

[sudsmaster]

It's been mentioned here before, but if you look at the costs of the first decade of the residential automatic washing machine, these were MAJOR purchases for families in the 50's.

We're talking $200 to $300 for a decent machine, at a time when the average house might have cost $10,000 and the average annual family income might ranged between $4,000 and $6,000 between 1950 and 1960.

Today an average decent washer might cost $500, while the average family income is more like $40,000/yr. Clearly a major appliance purchase is no longer the huge hit to the family's fortunes that it was in the 50's. Along with this, that washer back then represented jobs for more Americans, and more human labor (and touch) was involved in their manufacture. With a decent design and quality materials, this could mean a superior appliance with a long working life. It could also mean, since the machines were assembled by hand, that they were more repairable by hand as well, as opposed to modern machines with monolithic components assembled by robotic welders etc. - which components have to be replaced entire rather than disassembled and fixed. There used to be people who could rebuild mechanical timers - but I don't know anyone who can fix a blown modern washer control board (oh, well, I take that back. I fixed a loose buzzer connection on the control board on my Neptune dryer a few months back, lol). But those monolithic components ARE easier to install in the factory, and because they are often sealed and plastic they actually might be more reliable than their older equivalent assemblies.

 

[qualin]

I agree.. It's really hard to fathom that a Maytag top loader ran about $2500 in the equivalent of today's dollars, but they were built to last.

I for one, would welcome paying more for things knowing that I would get quality engineering and that corners weren't cut to keep the price "Within the market."

That's why, for example, I'll buy Breville and Calphalon small appliances instead of anything made by Black & Decker and Procter-Silex. The quality difference is just downright amazing.

Even still though, I've noticed that Breville has cheapened out on their K-Cup machine, using a plastic handle instead of the metal handle they used to use. It makes me wonder how many other "Cost cutting" measures they have taken in the last few years.

Toyota is a perfect example of people willing to pay more to get a higher quality product. Now, their products are just as reliable as everyone else, but they still command a stupid premium. Case in point, back in 2003, I was looking at buying a new car and considered the Toyota Celica GT-R. A new one was $40k! Hyundai and Ford were both selling a coupe which outperformed the Celica, for nearly $10k less! IMHO, there is a time to charge more for quality and there isn't.

When I was citing the HP Laserjet 3/4/4+ series previously, one thing a lot of people forget is that it was a different climate back then. Laser printers were supposed to be expensive while everyone else had to suffer with cheap Dot Matrix printers. (How ironic that it is Dot Matrix printers which are now expensive and laser printers are cheap!)

Regardless, Sudsmaster is correct in saying that it does irk me that modern appliances today seem to be designed so that they're not repairable, whereas the old ones were. (Like how the front of a Maytag comes off with two screws.) That really bothers me.

I think the biggest thing which is going to force the hand of manufacturers to abandon planned obsolescence is going to be the drive to be much more environmentally friendly. The only way that is going to happen is if laws are put into place to ensure that appliances can last a certain number of cycles without problems.. The only way to do that is to mandate and regulate Quality Assurance testing.

Of course, considering how US politicians are in bed with the corporate infrastructure in the states, that most likely won't happen until we are facing a serious materials and energy shortage. (Sorry, but this aspect of my post really does belong in Dirty Laundry.)

 

[launderess]

Sixteen Years

That is the mimimum time major appliances were supposed to last at least in the 1950's. Small goods such as toasters, irons, etc were expected to last much longer. This accounts for the hundreds of the latter you see on fleaPay, estate sales, etc.