deedub
Active member
Choice
do some strange things sometimes. They claim they test on the "standard" wash, but obviously they don't.
do some strange things sometimes. They claim they test on the "standard" wash, but obviously they don't.
V-Zug washer arrived
- Thread starter deedub
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deedub
Active member
V-Zug difference
Perhaps one of the reasons the V-Zug had an unusual result in the Choice test would be that their products are built to different criteria than anything else.
Until 3 or 4 years ago V-Zug only built products for the Swiss market and didn't really pay much attention to what the rest of the world was doing. Whereas all the other brands were competing worldwide against each other and as such were competing on similar criteria.
The Swiss pride themselves, on precision, ease of use and environmental concerns, and the products reflect this. Specifically in washing machines they introduced the steam anti crease function in 2004 (I must be Swiss as I also hate ironing) and the Anti Vibration System and Wetclean in 2008 (due to high levels of apartment living and perhaps not enough dry cleaners!).
Even the control system is completely different to anything else. You first select the temperature you wish to wash at and then the fabric type which is the reverse of every other brand.
I also have the Combi Steam which follows similar principles and is completely different to the Miele/Gaggenau/Neff models. Although the new Miele has "adopted" a very similar steam generation system to that of the V-Zug.
I like the fact that the products are different, but it is really hard to compare them as they weren't built with competitors in mind. They were just built to be the best at what they wanted to achieve, rather than beat the competition. Probably why they have over 50% market share in Switzerland! They only reason they started an export program was because there sales growth was declining. No wonder with a population of 7.5 million, massive market share and reliable and long lasting product!
Perhaps one of the reasons the V-Zug had an unusual result in the Choice test would be that their products are built to different criteria than anything else.
Until 3 or 4 years ago V-Zug only built products for the Swiss market and didn't really pay much attention to what the rest of the world was doing. Whereas all the other brands were competing worldwide against each other and as such were competing on similar criteria.
The Swiss pride themselves, on precision, ease of use and environmental concerns, and the products reflect this. Specifically in washing machines they introduced the steam anti crease function in 2004 (I must be Swiss as I also hate ironing) and the Anti Vibration System and Wetclean in 2008 (due to high levels of apartment living and perhaps not enough dry cleaners!).
Even the control system is completely different to anything else. You first select the temperature you wish to wash at and then the fabric type which is the reverse of every other brand.
I also have the Combi Steam which follows similar principles and is completely different to the Miele/Gaggenau/Neff models. Although the new Miele has "adopted" a very similar steam generation system to that of the V-Zug.
I like the fact that the products are different, but it is really hard to compare them as they weren't built with competitors in mind. They were just built to be the best at what they wanted to achieve, rather than beat the competition. Probably why they have over 50% market share in Switzerland! They only reason they started an export program was because there sales growth was declining. No wonder with a population of 7.5 million, massive market share and reliable and long lasting product!
Zug Holy Grail Drum
Hi David, Do you have a pressurized water system, Combi Boiler etc, Any chance of posting the "Choice" reports and results please??
Ingemar, yes built like a Rolls Royce and with Rolex Swiss Precision & Quality...
Hass, I like them because they are "Different", you will never see them in the high street, they are the domain of Kitchen Specialists and Designers - And Harrods - niche market...
Hi David, Do you have a pressurized water system, Combi Boiler etc, Any chance of posting the "Choice" reports and results please??
Ingemar, yes built like a Rolls Royce and with Rolex Swiss Precision & Quality...
Hass, I like them because they are "Different", you will never see them in the high street, they are the domain of Kitchen Specialists and Designers - And Harrods - niche market...
Excellent Rinsing I find...
The 14,000 holes makes for a great transference of water, and very quick, the other advantage is the large drum baffle which acts like a tsunami moving the water and clothes in one swoop...
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
The 14,000 holes makes for a great transference of water, and very quick, the other advantage is the large drum baffle which acts like a tsunami moving the water and clothes in one swoop...
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Vibration Absorbing System
The Zug Adora certainly makes light work of an unbalanced loads....incredible how it jets the water into the baffles at the right time....here you can see the three injector pipes
The Zug Adora certainly makes light work of an unbalanced loads....incredible how it jets the water into the baffles at the right time....here you can see the three injector pipes
VAS System In Action
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
From what I know in Switzerland the water is very soft, so I assume that this washer should have a good rince cycle since it is made primary for the Switzerlan market.
I like it very much the connector for the dryer drain. That's cool, so the soft condensed water from the dryer can be reused in the washer. (or am I wrong?)
Ingemar
I like it very much the connector for the dryer drain. That's cool, so the soft condensed water from the dryer can be reused in the washer. (or am I wrong?)
Ingemar
Washer Dryer Drain
The water from the dryer can be connected to the drain on the washer, (T-Connection) two in one, its not used for wash water...that could be a great feature!!
The Swiss have the total extreames of water from soft to hard, the Zug Ador has programmes to suit this and also for using soap or synthetic detergents, also for Laundry Additives like pre-washers etc..
The water from the dryer can be connected to the drain on the washer, (T-Connection) two in one, its not used for wash water...that could be a great feature!!
The Swiss have the total extreames of water from soft to hard, the Zug Ador has programmes to suit this and also for using soap or synthetic detergents, also for Laundry Additives like pre-washers etc..
Wow! Thanks, I didn't know that about the ability to use it in soft conditions (and with soap if wanted) and in hard conditions.
Thank you for the explanation. It's really a pity that the water from the dryer is not used for the next wash. The condensed water is very soft and it would have at least a room temperature so it would be an adittional save.
Ingemar
Thank you for the explanation. It's really a pity that the water from the dryer is not used for the next wash. The condensed water is very soft and it would have at least a room temperature so it would be an adittional save.
Ingemar
These are the Choice results. I agree that VZug went for short standard cotton washes as required by the Swiss market, and (rightly so) didn't worry about consumer associations' testing criteria. I don't understand why Which? wouldn't test the Adora as it's recently tested a TOL Miele dishwasher...
Test results AskoW6903 LGwd1403 mielew5835 VZug
Overall Score 77 75 73 70
Dirt Removal Score (%) 76 75 73 59
Rinse Score (%) 89 74 61 74
Gentleness Score (%) 73 74 73 79
Spin Score (%) 80 83 81 79
Water Effic, Score (%) 68 84 85 81
Water Used (L) 96 68 56 77
Energy used (kWh) 0.229 0.746 0.235 0.207
Cycle Time (min) 148 190 143 84
Noise (dBA) 62 63 63 58
Program Tested Auto, cold, 1600rpm Cotton, Normal rinse, Cold, 1400 rpm Cottons, Cold, 1600 rpm, 2:23 to go 10°C Coloureds, 1600 rpm
Coldest wash for normal program Cold Cold Cold Cold
http://
Test results AskoW6903 LGwd1403 mielew5835 VZug
Overall Score 77 75 73 70
Dirt Removal Score (%) 76 75 73 59
Rinse Score (%) 89 74 61 74
Gentleness Score (%) 73 74 73 79
Spin Score (%) 80 83 81 79
Water Effic, Score (%) 68 84 85 81
Water Used (L) 96 68 56 77
Energy used (kWh) 0.229 0.746 0.235 0.207
Cycle Time (min) 148 190 143 84
Noise (dBA) 62 63 63 58
Program Tested Auto, cold, 1600rpm Cotton, Normal rinse, Cold, 1400 rpm Cottons, Cold, 1600 rpm, 2:23 to go 10°C Coloureds, 1600 rpm
Coldest wash for normal program Cold Cold Cold Cold
http://
Already in the 60's I learned to be suspicious of the tests consumer organisations perform. Back then the Dutch consumer orginasition tested washing machines. They turned the machines off after one minute into the spin cycle. They stated that most of the water had been spun out and there was no use in letting the machines spin longer. The tested Miele spun at 800rpm in that first minute, didn't get a chance to spin the last three minutes at 1000rpm!
In this test the time the cycles took speaks for itself, they used cycles you can't compare. 190 minutes for the LG and 84 minutes for the Zug! No wonder the Zug performed worse!
BTW, there was a time that washers were tested using programmes with higher temperatures!
In this test the time the cycles took speaks for itself, they used cycles you can't compare. 190 minutes for the LG and 84 minutes for the Zug! No wonder the Zug performed worse!
BTW, there was a time that washers were tested using programmes with higher temperatures!
V-Zug
I must say that this is AWESOME machine!
I'd deffinatley like to have one, and on the vids on YouTube it looks AWESOME TOO! Like it very much, it is very original washing machine! And personally, I think this is THE BEST drum I've ever seen, really really good!
I would love to see more videos of it on YouTube if that's possible (from all the owners
)
I totally agree with Foralyosious on consumer reports.. especially mentioning the time of the cycle they chosen.. recently the same thing happened on general test of washers in Which? where Basic Hoover's (with temperature-knob, that has already pre-set higher/normal time) were rated 4* for wash (because it lasts 2hours) and, those advanced (with Time manager), where they are automaticly pre-set to lowest possible time (and clearly says LIGHT SOIL), so wash lasted 1:30 and got 2*, almost exact case like LG 190mins and V-zug 84 (just time difference on VZug is bigger
).. and there is like million of other cases through history that proove nothing more than their inconvenience
But what I could see in V-zug history, this is a first decent outer-look washing machine, because older ones had very wired colour combinations (like gray-blue, or Brown), and the shape wasn't quite tasty (like one in the link), but still, they were technicly amazing. That's just about my personal taste of outer design, however this one is true beauty!
Dex
I must say that this is AWESOME machine!
I'd deffinatley like to have one, and on the vids on YouTube it looks AWESOME TOO! Like it very much, it is very original washing machine! And personally, I think this is THE BEST drum I've ever seen, really really good!
I would love to see more videos of it on YouTube if that's possible (from all the owners
)I totally agree with Foralyosious on consumer reports.. especially mentioning the time of the cycle they chosen.. recently the same thing happened on general test of washers in Which? where Basic Hoover's (with temperature-knob, that has already pre-set higher/normal time) were rated 4* for wash (because it lasts 2hours) and, those advanced (with Time manager), where they are automaticly pre-set to lowest possible time (and clearly says LIGHT SOIL), so wash lasted 1:30 and got 2*, almost exact case like LG 190mins and V-zug 84 (just time difference on VZug is bigger
).. and there is like million of other cases through history that proove nothing more than their inconvenienceBut what I could see in V-zug history, this is a first decent outer-look washing machine, because older ones had very wired colour combinations (like gray-blue, or Brown), and the shape wasn't quite tasty (like one in the link), but still, they were technicly amazing. That's just about my personal taste of outer design, however this one is true beauty!
Dex
brisnat81
Well-known member
Choice test the machines on whatever cycle was used to get the energy rating. So whatever the manual details as the "Standard" test cycle that is what they use when testing the machines. Choice also load the machine to the rated capacity for the test, so if any of the others has a larger drum than the Vzug and is rated at the same weight, it stands that it'll wash better. Is a 60L drum the biggest so far in a standard cabinet?
They marked Miele down for years, purely because you couldnt do a cold Cottons cycle, the minimum temp was 30degC.
The rinse on the Miele adjusts itself best when there is a temperature drop, so that it can analyse the absorbancy of the clothes. If the wash water is the same temp as the rinse, I dont see how the active rinse function of the Miele can work.
I dropped my Choice subscription last year when it got up around $22 a quarter and the detail in the reviews started to drop off, I'd rather do the research myself.
They marked Miele down for years, purely because you couldnt do a cold Cottons cycle, the minimum temp was 30degC.
The rinse on the Miele adjusts itself best when there is a temperature drop, so that it can analyse the absorbancy of the clothes. If the wash water is the same temp as the rinse, I dont see how the active rinse function of the Miele can work.
I dropped my Choice subscription last year when it got up around $22 a quarter and the detail in the reviews started to drop off, I'd rather do the research myself.
test cycles
Well, thats what differs between that Australian consumer report and European.. I know that British "Which", and Italian "Altroconsumo" both put 80% of labeled capacity, on Cottons 40 (which with pre-set lowest time doesn't end up as good
If we say standard size cabinet is 60x60 footprint, I know Candy/Hoover have a 66L drum in that size cabinet, however I'm not sure if it's biggest
Dex
Well, thats what differs between that Australian consumer report and European.. I know that British "Which", and Italian "Altroconsumo" both put 80% of labeled capacity, on Cottons 40 (which with pre-set lowest time doesn't end up as good
If we say standard size cabinet is 60x60 footprint, I know Candy/Hoover have a 66L drum in that size cabinet, however I'm not sure if it's biggest
Dex
deedub
Active member
V-Zug
I'm running a denim wash as we speak, at least I think I am cos I can't hear the thing running! I'm sure they will come out clean, same as they did in the Miele.
I saw a really interesting interview with the UK distributor and the Export Manager of V-Zug, it explains what they are on about. Personally I'd be happy with Miele or V-Zug anything, had both and love them. I sell them for a living, I let the customer decide, but V-Zug is definitely becoming more popular in the kitchen, in black it looks stunning. Miele still only bring out the stainless models to Aus.
Ps. the V-Zg spin is silent from the machine but the floor moves a bit! Not their fault but you wouldn't want it on a wooden floor in an old house. Might pull the whole thing down.
I'm running a denim wash as we speak, at least I think I am cos I can't hear the thing running! I'm sure they will come out clean, same as they did in the Miele.
I saw a really interesting interview with the UK distributor and the Export Manager of V-Zug, it explains what they are on about. Personally I'd be happy with Miele or V-Zug anything, had both and love them. I sell them for a living, I let the customer decide, but V-Zug is definitely becoming more popular in the kitchen, in black it looks stunning. Miele still only bring out the stainless models to Aus.
Ps. the V-Zg spin is silent from the machine but the floor moves a bit! Not their fault but you wouldn't want it on a wooden floor in an old house. Might pull the whole thing down.
deedub
Active member
deedub
Active member
It does adjust the cycle based on load size.
Choice...
Interesting results, the Choice reports set alarm bells ringing straight away as the Asko`s have shallower rinses and use less water, and this test model has the highest water usage....
Louis, yes you would have thought that a max temp would have been used, have you used the Zug Unimatic Top loaders??,
David, still interested in knowing what type of plumbing system you are using it with? is it linked into a pressurized hot water system??, is yours on a suspended wooden floor then??
Dex, yes technically amazing, aesthetics - well as you say thats all down to personal choice..
Interesting results, the Choice reports set alarm bells ringing straight away as the Asko`s have shallower rinses and use less water, and this test model has the highest water usage....
Louis, yes you would have thought that a max temp would have been used, have you used the Zug Unimatic Top loaders??,
David, still interested in knowing what type of plumbing system you are using it with? is it linked into a pressurized hot water system??, is yours on a suspended wooden floor then??
Dex, yes technically amazing, aesthetics - well as you say thats all down to personal choice..
"Why do you think VZug has not provided a fuzzy logic sy
Why ever would you want that term " Logic" linked with the word "Fuzzy" and have it on your machine has always been the biggest misnomer for me...LOl, so all it does is what?? monitors the "Processes" and adjusts the "Variables" - well thats exactly what the Zugs do - but using their own "Swiss Precision" technology, and not some other term loosely banded about and used as the most over-rated sales tool ever...
When you study the Zug Adora washing you will observe the "Variables" in motion, and when you see the motor control on the wet clean and delicate programmes, its an art in itself in getting the drum to hold the cradle motion on the quarter turns...
And if you want "Precision Control" you only need to look at the "Black Box" speed controller and the computer controls on the top to see the quality...and its the "Hidden Programming" thats the art....which Zug appear to have perfected over many years...
Why ever would you want that term " Logic" linked with the word "Fuzzy" and have it on your machine has always been the biggest misnomer for me...LOl, so all it does is what?? monitors the "Processes" and adjusts the "Variables" - well thats exactly what the Zugs do - but using their own "Swiss Precision" technology, and not some other term loosely banded about and used as the most over-rated sales tool ever...
When you study the Zug Adora washing you will observe the "Variables" in motion, and when you see the motor control on the wet clean and delicate programmes, its an art in itself in getting the drum to hold the cradle motion on the quarter turns...
And if you want "Precision Control" you only need to look at the "Black Box" speed controller and the computer controls on the top to see the quality...and its the "Hidden Programming" thats the art....which Zug appear to have perfected over many years...
Pride Of Place - Zug
Good Article -
http://www.vzug.com/medias/sys_master/8806783254558/2011_09_monocle.pdf
Good Article -
http://www.vzug.com/medias/sys_master/8806783254558/2011_09_monocle.pdf
Mike
No, I have never used a Zug Unimatic toploader.
Thanks for the link to the article.
No, I have never used a Zug Unimatic toploader.
Thanks for the link to the article.
mielerod69
Well-known member
Choice, Steam, Soft water, Fuzzy Logic.....
Hi All,
Some of the topics I would like to comment on: Let's start with Choice. Brisnat said they test to the energy label, actually they don't and this is why there is such a discrepancy in results. All front loaders are usually tested using the Cottons 40 degree wash. Miele using their default Cottons 40 programme with no options, The VZug programme is the 40 degree programme with normal soiling option selected, and 1400 rpm spin for the label programme. Choice does all their testing with cold water, as 70% of their subscribers wash in cold water, go figure. This does have an impact on the overall score of the machines.
When it comes to the steam function of the Miele vs the VZug these also differ. The Miele uses a twin injection system in the wash drum. The steam is produced in an external steam generator and injected from the top of the drum and in between the inner and outer drum. The VZug produces steam in the bottom of the outer drum with the heating element submerged in water. The advantage of the Miele system is that it can tailor the steam delivery in the drum depending on the type of fabric being steamed.
When it comes to soft water and rinsing, Miele offers Water plus option as well as extra rinse option, which I use here in Melbourne as the water is very soft, 3 German degrees. The VZug has an option that can be enabled for soft water areas, as well as being able to add up to 2 additional rinses as well as increasing the water level.
Fuzzy logic, a term which was invented in the 80s and used by many Asian brands. Miele has 2 electronic control modules, one which is on the control panel and the other is the control electronic which looks very much like the VZug machine and that is the brain which controls all the processes of the wash cycle.
Hi All,
Some of the topics I would like to comment on: Let's start with Choice. Brisnat said they test to the energy label, actually they don't and this is why there is such a discrepancy in results. All front loaders are usually tested using the Cottons 40 degree wash. Miele using their default Cottons 40 programme with no options, The VZug programme is the 40 degree programme with normal soiling option selected, and 1400 rpm spin for the label programme. Choice does all their testing with cold water, as 70% of their subscribers wash in cold water, go figure. This does have an impact on the overall score of the machines.
When it comes to the steam function of the Miele vs the VZug these also differ. The Miele uses a twin injection system in the wash drum. The steam is produced in an external steam generator and injected from the top of the drum and in between the inner and outer drum. The VZug produces steam in the bottom of the outer drum with the heating element submerged in water. The advantage of the Miele system is that it can tailor the steam delivery in the drum depending on the type of fabric being steamed.
When it comes to soft water and rinsing, Miele offers Water plus option as well as extra rinse option, which I use here in Melbourne as the water is very soft, 3 German degrees. The VZug has an option that can be enabled for soft water areas, as well as being able to add up to 2 additional rinses as well as increasing the water level.
Fuzzy logic, a term which was invented in the 80s and used by many Asian brands. Miele has 2 electronic control modules, one which is on the control panel and the other is the control electronic which looks very much like the VZug machine and that is the brain which controls all the processes of the wash cycle.
deedub
Active member
Miele vs Zug
Gee Rod, if their is ever a product manager position at Miele you would be perfectly qualified! lol.
David
Gee Rod, if their is ever a product manager position at Miele you would be perfectly qualified! lol.
David
deedub
Active member
Plumbing
Chestermike,
I have no idea about my plumbing - the water comes out that's the extent of my knowledge!! I'm on a concrete floor third story. I originally had the Miele on a timber floor and it never caused any problems, was well impressed!
Chestermike,
I have no idea about my plumbing - the water comes out that's the extent of my knowledge!! I'm on a concrete floor third story. I originally had the Miele on a timber floor and it never caused any problems, was well impressed!
mielerod69
Well-known member
VZug energy and water ratings
I noticed that the machines have had their energy and water ratings improved. It seems that VZug are planning to compete on the Australian market. The updated SLQ has a 4 star energy efficiency and 4.5 star WELS water efficiency rating. The first ones had 3.5 star energy and 4 star water. There goes the rinse efficiency! Also the test programme time has jumped from 134 minutes to 174 minutes for the normal soil level! Water consumption has dropped 10 litres to 66 compared to 76.
I noticed that the machines have had their energy and water ratings improved. It seems that VZug are planning to compete on the Australian market. The updated SLQ has a 4 star energy efficiency and 4.5 star WELS water efficiency rating. The first ones had 3.5 star energy and 4 star water. There goes the rinse efficiency! Also the test programme time has jumped from 134 minutes to 174 minutes for the normal soil level! Water consumption has dropped 10 litres to 66 compared to 76.
Test Results
Hi Rod, "All front loaders are usually tested using the Cottons 40 degree wash" are you meaning the Choice test programmes or the EU EN60456 directive??
BTW, I thought you did work for Miele??
Hi David, I was asking if your hot water comes from a pressurized gas combi boiler or sealed electric system?
Hi Rod, "All front loaders are usually tested using the Cottons 40 degree wash" are you meaning the Choice test programmes or the EU EN60456 directive??
BTW, I thought you did work for Miele??
Hi David, I was asking if your hot water comes from a pressurized gas combi boiler or sealed electric system?
V-Zug Adora washing machines
I have used V-Zug appliances most of my life, living in Switzerland for more than 40 years. During that time I never ever had to call an Engineer. V-Zug washing machines and dryers are perfect, low energy efficicient and reliable. For the last 9 years I had a Neff washer/dryer since the V-Zug were not available in the UK. I needed the Neff Engineer at least once a year. We will be moving soon and I am looking forward to replace the Neff with a V-Zug washer and dryer because this is the only make I know from experience I can trust. I am sure Miele is reliable too, but with V-Zug I know what I have!
I have used V-Zug appliances most of my life, living in Switzerland for more than 40 years. During that time I never ever had to call an Engineer. V-Zug washing machines and dryers are perfect, low energy efficicient and reliable. For the last 9 years I had a Neff washer/dryer since the V-Zug were not available in the UK. I needed the Neff Engineer at least once a year. We will be moving soon and I am looking forward to replace the Neff with a V-Zug washer and dryer because this is the only make I know from experience I can trust. I am sure Miele is reliable too, but with V-Zug I know what I have!
Zug
Hello Eva and welcome to the appliances club, can you tell us what Zug washing machines you and you family have had and used please??
Are you staying in the UK or moving back to Switzerland??
What where the problems with your Neff washer dryer??
Hello Eva and welcome to the appliances club, can you tell us what Zug washing machines you and you family have had and used please??
Are you staying in the UK or moving back to Switzerland??
What where the problems with your Neff washer dryer??
mielerod69
Well-known member
Australian Standards
Hi Mike,
Washing machines whether top or front loading are tested to AS/NZS 2040.2. The programme used is a Normal or Cottons programme with a minimum temperature of 40 degrees. Some manufacturers also use up to 60 degrees to achieve the pass required for the label. This of course would lower the energy star rating. Therefore the programme is optimised to obtain the best energy and water rating. The standard also tests for rinse efficiency. There was a point where machines were using very little water but were not rinsing properly to obtain a high water efficiency rating. They put a marker in the wash water and see what is left behind after the cycle finishes. The less that is left the better the rinse performance. The problem with the marker is that it dissolves and rinses out easily when using higher temperatures. When Choice test, they only test to part of the standard. That is they use the standard wash load and marker for rinse efficiency, but test using the cold setting rather than what's stated on the energy label. This therefore affects the overall performance scores for dirt removal and rinse efficiency as the marker doesn't rinse out as easily when using cold water in the wash cycle.
Shhh!!! don't tell anyone!
Hi Mike,
Washing machines whether top or front loading are tested to AS/NZS 2040.2. The programme used is a Normal or Cottons programme with a minimum temperature of 40 degrees. Some manufacturers also use up to 60 degrees to achieve the pass required for the label. This of course would lower the energy star rating. Therefore the programme is optimised to obtain the best energy and water rating. The standard also tests for rinse efficiency. There was a point where machines were using very little water but were not rinsing properly to obtain a high water efficiency rating. They put a marker in the wash water and see what is left behind after the cycle finishes. The less that is left the better the rinse performance. The problem with the marker is that it dissolves and rinses out easily when using higher temperatures. When Choice test, they only test to part of the standard. That is they use the standard wash load and marker for rinse efficiency, but test using the cold setting rather than what's stated on the energy label. This therefore affects the overall performance scores for dirt removal and rinse efficiency as the marker doesn't rinse out as easily when using cold water in the wash cycle.
Shhh!!! don't tell anyone!
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