AI in laundry...

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gelaundry4ever

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Hey guys, what do you think of AI in laundry? I think that's stupid for so many reasons. First of all, I already know how to sort my clothes. Second, I know what cottons feel like, and third, I know what temperature they should be on. I don't need AI to do my laundry since I'm the one doing it.[this post was last edited: 6/26/2024-19:42]

https://lifehacker.com/tech/lg-smart-washer-dryer-review
 
Jerome you're not the only one who has an opinion, although you seem to think YOUR opion is all that matters. MY LG washer and dryer offer some sort of AI funtion on each machine. My washer doesn't have a light shing on the tub so I cannot observe what or if any impact is made by the AI feature. But my LG front loader is the best cleaning and most flexible modern washer I've ever had. And by the way, I despise top lload washers. The last one I really liked was our Kenmore 800 bought February 1970.
 
front loaders

I love front loaders too, but I don't need excessive technology. It has to be reasonable to get the job done. I've had good luck with Speed Queen top and front loader alike. Same with other brands I've been exposed to like Dexter. That being said, excessive technology is just plain stupid. I don't need a trillion settings just to get the machine to do what I need it to do, nor do I need it to figure out what laundry is made of.
 
“And by the way, I despise top load washers”

I share the same sentiment, that is for top loading machines that don’t have a spray rinse on the first spin, poorly programmed in general.

Crazy as this sounds, may be one of the few people in the Gen Z demographic who has more experience with the older Whirlpool belt drive washers as opposed to the direct drive washers. So far, my experience has been quite good with them in terms of washing and rinsing, though you you have to be mindful with the amount of detergent you use or else it’ll result in a suds lock, same with Maytags as well.
 
But is it really Artificial Intelligence?

I have some doubts, because Artificial Intelligence needs lots of processing resource (powerful computers, I mean) and I do not see such extensive processing resources placed in a washing machine made on the cheap.

I strongly suspect that it is just marketing: before there was "fuzzy logic", now we have Artificial Intelligence, but we still have the cheapest processors
 
I don't need AI

Exactly!

In watching the videos about the Fisher and Paykel top loader machine programming, I could not believe what I saw!

When all I want to do is to wash a load of bath towels, the last thing I want to do is to stand there and to push buttons endlessly.

With my soon to be reassembled Speed Queen top loader, I select the wash water temperature, opt for an additional rinse if desired, turn the timer knob to the appropriate cycle and pull the knob out, simple!

What next? Will an AI machine deny you from using it because of your recent Facebook post which was found to be offensive and violated guidelines?
 
^^

Not to take this off the tracks, but a Sunbeam radiant control toaster will achieve the same results, and this is with late 1940’s technology. Everything comes out perfectly toasted wether the bread has been frozen or not. A simple thermostat really is more accurate, no need for complex circuitry and computers just to toast some bread.
 
no need for complex circuitry

My sentiments exactly, especially when it comes to a machine as ubiquitous as a washing machine.

When I wash a load of laundry, I already know the fabric composition of the articles and their soil level and will select the proper wash water temperature and cycle based on that knowledge.

I certainly do not need to enter such ridiculous information into an AI based machine.
 
No fear of me having, I just don't have any app for my washer or dryer...

 

However the app for my car has failed me, in it recently just suddenly not being easy to use and even wanting me to send a request for a text message to be sent to me in order for me to remote start it with my phone...

 

Whereas when I got it, it was completely set up by the dealer for me to start. lock, unlock and even set the climate control...

 

And yesterday I sure enough left my remote fob and my phone in my new car and sure enough both were locked in... Usually my horn sounds every time I'm about to leave my remote there but it didn't so to me I thought it would be impossible for my car to lock with it there as with the three cars I'd had before which surely wouldn't let me or allow... 

 

I was totally aching for my wife to get home from a short outing to finally let me have her remote for me to finally open/unlock my car to get both of those things out...

 

So down with anything that's remote by use of your phone or totally AI...

 

 

 

-- Dave
 
If you are going to make a washing machine with an automatic bulk detergent dispenser in it which is increasingly popular, it makes sense to make it detect how bigger load is in it and have a sensor to monitor the dirt in the water so that it can adjust the amount of detergent and water used.

I wouldn't want one myself because I don't like using liquid detergents, powder causes less problems. If I did have one though, I would want it to be able to still function if the sensor and or dispenser are broken, so you can still use it with a manual dose. Would be really annoying if a gimmick can't be bypassed and stops you using the machine if it plays up.
 
I saw an item on a TV programme some years ago where they were working on an idea for a "smart" washing machine. They were predicting that due to high levels of theft from clothing stores, most clothing would eventually have rfid tags sewn into the hem and were trying to come up with a system where the washing machine would read all the tags as you load it.

That would allow it to determine the washing instructions for each item and select the correct wash, or even advise you to remove items because the dye might run or they'd be better washed separately.

Presumably, it would also be collecting and monetising lots of personal information on what items you likely wear together and how many times you've worn them etc for marketing purposes.

Of course what actually happened is internet shopping took off so there was no need for RFID tags.
 
I don’t show anger with anyone that isn’t purposely trying to ruin something. I might be angry, but yelling at someone that wasn’t taught how to do something isn’t the right thing to do in my view. As much as I love my machines I look at it as my fault if things aren’t explained to the person beforehand. If there are set and known rules/procedures and they aren’t followed due to laziness, dissent, or contempt…that’s a different story.
 
excessive technology

Today's generation including gen z and millennials are too obsessed with technology in everything. I don't need gazillion buttons. For the umpteenth time... Too many things to break. Even when used properly.[this post was last edited: 6/28/2024-11:31]
 
9 out of 10 times I find myself bypassing the fuzzy logic of my 20 years old Miele by simply switching it off and on again after the initial fill.
This way I get the full wash, rinse and spin times and full water levels no matter how much or what fabric is washed.
I like to know exactly what I get or what to expect before I get it and there are still plenty of options to modify the cycle to my liking when needed.
Will have a very hard time when it`s time for a new washer but also have been known to adopt well to worse things in life than a new washer, LOL
 
"Stupid" Miele

I have been pleasantly surprised that my new Miele washing machine does not even try to be smarter than me: apart from the "Automatic Plus" programme, there is no load detection, programme adaptation, or anything like that, just an additional rinse in case of excessive foam.

Each programme is executed each time exactly the same way.

I have to admit that I am very pleased
 
They do. Barely so though. On Cottons 60 or higher they don't, on anything lower they can cut of a bit, like 10min or so.

Really depends on what options you use etc.
But they can.
A lot isn't in the main wash though. They mainwash without options is about 90-100min regardless. More in spins, rinses etc.
 
Oh joy, another rant thread...

My take on it. The "AI" is pure marketing. all this is is programming that dynamically adapts wash time & other stuff to the programmed cycle and sensed clothing weight/type. I doubt it is much different than the earlier washers LG has made with the auto-sensing function, though given I haven't used one it's possible they have added some functionality to it to give the "AI" some meaning. I am surprised we haven't seen the same marketing to refer to dishwashers with turbidity sensors, it seems that the ability for them to "see" dirt in the water would render some sort of AI marketing but I haven't seen any yet. Heck, turbidity sensors have been around for decades now, I believe the first were on some whirlpool powerclean models though its possible other manufacturers introduced them first. I know that whirlpool also messed around with some sort of pressure based sensing on the point voyager, but I know our old kitchenaid point voyager still had what appeared to be a turbidity sensor. And of course, the new kitchenaid we have does too. The new BOL frigidaire at the house I rent over in my college town still lacks one, but being BOL that doesn't surprise me. If anything at all, this "AI" is no more intelligent than the "smart" features that have been around for a decade or more at this point.
 
It seems as though it’s getting to the point where everything is becoming a gimmick, putting technology in stuff just for the sake of putting it in and nothing else.

May be apart of the Gen Z demographic, but I honestly don’t find some tech useful these days. People can tout on how electronic controls offer “flexibility”, but for example, can’t do a gentle wash action with fast spin on modern machines. As soon as the cycle is done, you’ll have to run it through another spin and may take time to redistribute the load before it enters into spin to make sure everything is properly balanced. With my Maytag A806? Can do a gentle wash with fast spin easily without having start things over so to speak.

You can only push technology so far to the point you end up with something that’s a piece of junk.
 
to maytag85

My sentaments exactly! Today's machines you need to do a normal wash with fast spin. If I want a normal wash and fast spin, my Speed Queen Commercial allows me to do that. Our generation is so lazy when it comes to laundry. All they care about is just cramming everything into a single heap of laundry. And yet they wonder why they have filthy laundry clothes.
How will AI EVER detect color or soil?
 
color or soil detection is pretty easy? We've had soil figured out on the dishwashing side of things for the better part of 2 decades now (turbidity sensors). color sensing of course I dont believe they've even attempted, but honestly I find separating stuff by color doesn't matter all that much, at least with modern fabrics + detergents. Gone are the days of bleeding dyes, minus some circumstances.
GE, I struggle to comprehend your ranting sometimes. Normal wash with fast spin is normal? as far as I understand? no one is taking that away... and I assure you, my clothes get plenty clean with my modern "lazy" washing habits that might make some members shrivel haha...
 
Soil detection in a washer is bit more complicated due to one main factor - detergent.
Powdered detergent always contains some amount of insoluble material - usually zeolite as water softner. If you manually dose that, it will immediately show up as heavy soil on optical sensing.

Thus most soil sensing on washers relies on automatic liquid detergent dosing - and even then it's significantly less accurate, mainly because the amount of soil in laundry is just so much less usually than on dishes.
You might have the amount of soil by weight on one plate that might be in an entire wash load.

I am somewhat surprised though nobody has made a camera based sensing system on washers yet.
We have ovens now that can recognise what food you put in and how dark it is through a camera.
Making the washer actually "see" how much laundry there is as a percentage of drum volume plus color detection combined with weight and water absorption sensing should really easily allow one to narrow down what was loaded.

But a lot of smart technology - like rinse optimization by checking how heavy the laundry is after an interim spin compared to before the cycle - have been successfully done before, were cheap measures and worked brilliantly - yet have been thrown out anyway.
 
We`ve had turbidity sensors in dishwashers for more than 20 years at least and they still don`t work reliable in lots of cases.

A single baked on casserole dish in an otherwise very lightly soiled load? It won`t come clean because there`s not enough turbidity to trigger a heavy soil cycle.

Or on the other side I once used an Eco detergent which apparently left a chalky residue on the sensor so I was stuck on the heaviest automatic cycle for weeks until I descaled the DW.
Also an ageing scratched or etched plastic or glass sensor cover may have a similar outcome in that it is reading more turbidity than there actually is. But Hey we need more planed obsolescence anyway to keep our economies growing, and to be fair most of the time it works and saves valuable resources for those who can`t or don`t want to pick an adequate cycle for themselves.

So it`s no big deal for me as long as there are still enough other cycles to chose from that don`t use a "smart" sensor of any kind, but a washer or DW that wouldn`t give you at least the option to pick the correct cycle yourself is not a pleasant thought, is it?
 
And don`t get me started on flow through meters in appliances.
Considering that at least here in my area the water meters (in your home) have to be changed after 6 years of service because they might become unreliable, what`s the point of having one in a washer that might give false readings depending on water quality after only a short period of use and turn a large appliance into trash.

Or what about weight detection in a washer? Certainly nice to have it as long as it works correctly but the springs and dampers of a washer will wear out sooner than later. In a simple no frills washer no big deal for a long time but as soon as it interferes with cycle programming it will be a problem. Thank God I can still bypass the cycle to a full load if the old Miele decides to act up.
Progress is basically a good thing, couldn`t imagine to go back to a low spin speed, a resistant heat dryer or a 100% flood proof washer or dishwasher. But some developments just won`t do it for me.
 
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