Just for the record. The dishwasher in the video is not a Bosch and doesn't even look like a Bosch compact.
Appliance Simplicity
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swedesapplserv
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@thomasortega
Fascinating difference that culture and location makes. Thanks for sharing that in-depth information.
Fascinating difference that culture and location makes. Thanks for sharing that in-depth information.
I dont remember for which country electrolux Brazil makes for Bosch.
Also, not exactly sure if its the 8-service model or the 6-service model (the later has only 1 rack).
Electrolux also made it for Whirlpool (Consul) in Brazil.
Also, not exactly sure if its the 8-service model or the 6-service model (the later has only 1 rack).
Electrolux also made it for Whirlpool (Consul) in Brazil.
iheartmaytag
Well-known member
The simplicity
Actually reminded me of GE potscrubber. So did the wash action. Then Again , it's a dishwasher, it sprays water
Actually reminded me of GE potscrubber. So did the wash action. Then Again , it's a dishwasher, it sprays water
@Thomoas: isn't the world wash mechanism almost identical to the VMW?
I love reading and learning about stuff like this, especially culture norms and views on the same concept. FWIW, I know many people in my family (and outside of it) who refuse to load dishes in to any DW without first being rinsed on the account that their first BOL machine left particles behind.
Which makes me want to rant how much I despise low end GE, D&M, Whirlpool, Maytag and other DWs that never had a fine filter inside of them. The fall out is still continuing to this day.
I never understood why they couldn't just stick a damn removable filter in the sump.
I love reading and learning about stuff like this, especially culture norms and views on the same concept. FWIW, I know many people in my family (and outside of it) who refuse to load dishes in to any DW without first being rinsed on the account that their first BOL machine left particles behind.
Which makes me want to rant how much I despise low end GE, D&M, Whirlpool, Maytag and other DWs that never had a fine filter inside of them. The fall out is still continuing to this day.
I never understood why they couldn't just stick a damn removable filter in the sump.
Ge PotScrubber
Beautiful machine for those that had a filter in the back. The rest are a perfect example of hubris, insanity, causal indifference and a deliberate insult to the human species. Just thinking about them makes my blood boil, despite their simplicity.
Why so?
The design is fundamentally flawed. The use or a rubber vs molded sump means the machine has to retain half a gallon of water inside it at all times. Made worse by a wide pump designed for volume vs pressure. That half a gallon then increases the water needed to dilute the carry over. Because the heater runs continuously in the wash, I've seen the sump literally turn to mush over the years but not the permatuff tub and door liner.
The shredder was literally a single steal wire that would break off after a few years of use. This would then allow debris to clog up the impeller grate, while letting things like small seeds through which would sometimes result in the drain gate not closing all the way gradually letting all the water or the spray arm getting stuck from a seed mid cycle... nothing like a 45 minute main wash where the water leaves letting the dishes bake.
Which takes me to the drain flapper, because draining involved blocking the exit, it resulted in high pump pressure where over time the drain valve would start to leak. Also I have seen the flapper itself deform.
While the mid 80s potscrubbers often lasted 30-40 years, the BOL-MOL models were awful performers and used tons of energy while leaving detergent residue behind.
The above 2 pump system would have solved all these problems.
Beautiful machine for those that had a filter in the back. The rest are a perfect example of hubris, insanity, causal indifference and a deliberate insult to the human species. Just thinking about them makes my blood boil, despite their simplicity.
Why so?
The design is fundamentally flawed. The use or a rubber vs molded sump means the machine has to retain half a gallon of water inside it at all times. Made worse by a wide pump designed for volume vs pressure. That half a gallon then increases the water needed to dilute the carry over. Because the heater runs continuously in the wash, I've seen the sump literally turn to mush over the years but not the permatuff tub and door liner.
The shredder was literally a single steal wire that would break off after a few years of use. This would then allow debris to clog up the impeller grate, while letting things like small seeds through which would sometimes result in the drain gate not closing all the way gradually letting all the water or the spray arm getting stuck from a seed mid cycle... nothing like a 45 minute main wash where the water leaves letting the dishes bake.
Which takes me to the drain flapper, because draining involved blocking the exit, it resulted in high pump pressure where over time the drain valve would start to leak. Also I have seen the flapper itself deform.
While the mid 80s potscrubbers often lasted 30-40 years, the BOL-MOL models were awful performers and used tons of energy while leaving detergent residue behind.
The above 2 pump system would have solved all these problems.
DWs With Filters
Whirlpool Never Built A DW Without A Filter,
Neither did Kitchenaid Or Maytag for that matter.
And I have no idea what continuing fallout this is causing, LOL
John
Whirlpool Never Built A DW Without A Filter,
Neither did Kitchenaid Or Maytag for that matter.
And I have no idea what continuing fallout this is causing, LOL
John
The Duro-wash mechanism lacks a filter, which is why Whirlpool latter came out with the "soil settler" mechanism which really didn't do much. The free ball that comes from inside it is fun to play with however.
Maytag produced many budget machines, one which even tried to mimic GE, all of which had sub par filtration.
The fall out is people pre-washing dishes having dealt with such awful devices.
Maytag produced many budget machines, one which even tried to mimic GE, all of which had sub par filtration.
The fall out is people pre-washing dishes having dealt with such awful devices.
Dws With Filters
WPs Dura-Wash DWs had a grinder and the soil settling are was extremely effective, try putting a few glasses up right next time you run your DW and see what you catch.
MTs basic design had both a filter and a grinder.
The real reason so many people pre-rinse their dishes is because they don't want to clean the stinking filter and they don't like having their DW stink to high heaven if they don't clean the filter almost ever use of the DW.
I have had hundreds of customers over the years tell me they would rather rinse the dishes than clean the filter, and if you just put in a simple screen all the food stays behind and continues dissolving even iron the final rinse water, Yuck,
Don't quit your day job,
John
WPs Dura-Wash DWs had a grinder and the soil settling are was extremely effective, try putting a few glasses up right next time you run your DW and see what you catch.
MTs basic design had both a filter and a grinder.
The real reason so many people pre-rinse their dishes is because they don't want to clean the stinking filter and they don't like having their DW stink to high heaven if they don't clean the filter almost ever use of the DW.
I have had hundreds of customers over the years tell me they would rather rinse the dishes than clean the filter, and if you just put in a simple screen all the food stays behind and continues dissolving even iron the final rinse water, Yuck,
Don't quit your day job,
John
There is no grinder in the Dura-wash wash system. Take a look at the pump and parts list. The impeller has a metal cap on it which is pressed down by the threaded plastic hold down piece. No macerator exits what so ever.
I've tried the Dura-wash system, it doesn't work. It leave particles behind unlike the Powerclean.
I'm glad you can admit that customers in part are part the energy problem- the same one you claim to care about. The way I figure it is if you do not want an auto clean filter, there should be a manual clean filter. There is no point in having a DW if you have to rinse the dishes because 1) there is no filter to catch anything 2) people don't want to clean a simple filter as with a dryer.
Ew is filling a cup of water only to find a piece of melted foot stuck to it.
I've tried the Dura-wash system, it doesn't work. It leave particles behind unlike the Powerclean.
I'm glad you can admit that customers in part are part the energy problem- the same one you claim to care about. The way I figure it is if you do not want an auto clean filter, there should be a manual clean filter. There is no point in having a DW if you have to rinse the dishes because 1) there is no filter to catch anything 2) people don't want to clean a simple filter as with a dryer.
Ew is filling a cup of water only to find a piece of melted foot stuck to it.
I'd love to see that dishwasher with a Bosch label on it.
As for filters in dishwashers, it's actually the same as with washers. Filters in European dishwashers are self cleaning. If there is dirt left behind, there wasn't enough detergent used. I have come to the conclusion that tabs don't contain enough detergent for a full scraped and unrinsed load. Therefor I add some powder to the tab. My filter is always clean. Dirty filters are a user error, not a design flaw.
As for filters in dishwashers, it's actually the same as with washers. Filters in European dishwashers are self cleaning. If there is dirt left behind, there wasn't enough detergent used. I have come to the conclusion that tabs don't contain enough detergent for a full scraped and unrinsed load. Therefor I add some powder to the tab. My filter is always clean. Dirty filters are a user error, not a design flaw.
Oopps... not Bosch, but I knew it was somewhat related...
And they actually had BOTH sizes.
And they actually had BOTH sizes.
Dirty Filters
Even better! GE and the rest had no excuse.
Even better! GE and the rest had no excuse.
Those Siemens have nothing in common with the dishwasher in the video in the initial post. Totally different products.
Louis
They're exactly the same product, the only difference is the cosmetics
The Brazilian market requires a clear door (consumer preference).
Overall, they're EXACTLY the same dishwashers.
They're exactly the same product, the only difference is the cosmetics
The Brazilian market requires a clear door (consumer preference).
Overall, they're EXACTLY the same dishwashers.
Built-In Grinder
The WP Dura Wash DWs have a very tough and sharp main wash impeller hat grinds food very well, Try reading the manual.
Self-Cleaning DW Filters, Agreed Louis nearly all better DWs today do a good job of keeping their filters clean if you use a proper combination of detergents for local water conditions etc.
Chester is talking about just having a screen in the bottom that catches nearly everything and has to be cleaned every load, Yuck.
John L.
The WP Dura Wash DWs have a very tough and sharp main wash impeller hat grinds food very well, Try reading the manual.
Self-Cleaning DW Filters, Agreed Louis nearly all better DWs today do a good job of keeping their filters clean if you use a proper combination of detergents for local water conditions etc.
Chester is talking about just having a screen in the bottom that catches nearly everything and has to be cleaned every load, Yuck.
John L.
Thomas,
I fail to see any resemblance between the much smaller dishwasher in the video and the Siemens you showed me. The one in the video is not only a glass one without a dispenser but layout, sizes etc. are all different too. I don't know where you got the idea that those are the same while they don't even look alike a tiny bit.
And then there is the fact that the recent designed Siemens and Bosch compact built-in dishwashers is much more recent than the much older dishwasher in the video.
Bosch and Siemens compact dishwashers are built in Zaragoza in Spain, not in South America.
Bosch doesn't even sell compact dishwashers nowadays in South America.
There is a Electrolux compact dishwasher that looks more like a Bosch than the one in the video, but that one too is not similar to Bosch and Siemens products. Different racks, dispensers and other innards.
BTW, we discussed Bosch compact dishwashers before, you were wrong about them back then too.
https://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?72563
I fail to see any resemblance between the much smaller dishwasher in the video and the Siemens you showed me. The one in the video is not only a glass one without a dispenser but layout, sizes etc. are all different too. I don't know where you got the idea that those are the same while they don't even look alike a tiny bit.
And then there is the fact that the recent designed Siemens and Bosch compact built-in dishwashers is much more recent than the much older dishwasher in the video.
Bosch and Siemens compact dishwashers are built in Zaragoza in Spain, not in South America.
Bosch doesn't even sell compact dishwashers nowadays in South America.
There is a Electrolux compact dishwasher that looks more like a Bosch than the one in the video, but that one too is not similar to Bosch and Siemens products. Different racks, dispensers and other innards.
BTW, we discussed Bosch compact dishwashers before, you were wrong about them back then too.
https://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?72563
If that first thing and the BSH compact dishwashers are the same product, then Donald Trump is the ambassador of Mexico.
iheartmaytag
Well-known member
We had over the years four different variants of the GE PotScrubber. Though it had design flaws by todays standards with water usage. They were very good cleaning machines. Good enough, that the GSD 1200 was the top rated machine by Consumer Reports during the 80s.
We never pre washed, but did scrape, and it was rare, very rarely that we ever took a dirty dish out of the machine. It used good hot water, and with a good detergent had very satisfactory results.
The GEs were simple machines, as I mentioned in a previous post. Single motor one direction motor which ran continuously during the wash cycle and then basically two solenoids (fill valve, drain valve) and a heater. The ones we owned had mechanical timers and only repair was due to it eating a screw that fell of a pan lid and got stuck in the disposer. A soft food disposer that were actually two spinning blades where one pivoted at the center, processing near a screen.
[this post was last edited: 6/22/2021-10:23]
We never pre washed, but did scrape, and it was rare, very rarely that we ever took a dirty dish out of the machine. It used good hot water, and with a good detergent had very satisfactory results.
The GEs were simple machines, as I mentioned in a previous post. Single motor one direction motor which ran continuously during the wash cycle and then basically two solenoids (fill valve, drain valve) and a heater. The ones we owned had mechanical timers and only repair was due to it eating a screw that fell of a pan lid and got stuck in the disposer. A soft food disposer that were actually two spinning blades where one pivoted at the center, processing near a screen.
[this post was last edited: 6/22/2021-10:23]
What limited grinding the durawash impeller does by coincidence ends up redepositing all over the inside of the machine. The manual can say or claim anything, marketing hubris is one heck of a drug.
I don't see a dura wash mechanism over the powerclean your Kitchen, both us know it leaves particles behind.
Self cleaning or not, a fine filter in BOL machines would have saved water and electricity. Don't like having to clean it? Buy a more expensive machine.
I don't see a dura wash mechanism over the powerclean your Kitchen, both us know it leaves particles behind.
Self cleaning or not, a fine filter in BOL machines would have saved water and electricity. Don't like having to clean it? Buy a more expensive machine.
