Does this motor sound like it’s failing?

[maytaga806]

There was some sudsing going on which is why you can’t hear the spraying so much, had a cascade platinum pod in while doing some more testing runs and I’m really concerned about the sound of this motor. Makes this strange sound constantly, wash and drain. Any thoughts? Also adding more water didn’t help the upper arm not receiving full pressure it only helped a little bit to where it would shoot streams up about three inches high. Added an additional gallons worth. Seems like she needs a new motor.

 

[maytaga806]

…

 

[qsd-dan]

Tear into unit before getting worked up about motor noises and water pressure issues. Both problems will most likely rear their heads in that area.

 

[combo52]

Whirlpool power, clean dishwasher

The center wash dishwashers should never have trouble with upper wash arm performance, that rubber cap in the center never fails unless it is split. I haven't seen a bad one in 20 years so it's not likley that.

It does sound like there's obviously a pump or motor problem tear it apart and see what's in there. Something might be caught in the grinder, you may have a bad separator housing to as this can cause the pumping performance to go way down.

Interestingly, Jason and I at the shop yesterday we just rebuilt three of these machine machines for resale a stainless one, a black one and a white one they were all the last of the Kenmore or whirlpool machines built around 2011

Hi Dan, the cycle times etc are on the wiring chart under the machine, you shouldn't start a second thread for the same problem in as many days you won't get as many responses as things just get lost that way.

John

 

[maytaga806]

I’ll be looking into that I’m stuck on the impeller the screw won’t come off and the wrench just busts off when I add pressure to bust off the bolt and the wrench is denting the impeller. My other machine was so easy to remove the impeller but not this one.

I posted a new thread because it’s a new issue I’m asking about that wasn’t in much relation to the manual question that had been answered so it’s no big deal. I can find threads I post easily by entering the title into Google and it pops right up if I ever needed to come back months from now.

If I don’t find an issue I’m probably just going to use this machine for parts for my portable. Lots and lots of good parts if I ever need any and will save me hundreds of dollars in the future on new racks.

 

[DADoES]

 
Bookmark your threads for later reference.

 

[maytaga806]

Today I finally got around to ripping it apart. The bolt for the impeller would not budge so I had to take the whole pump and motor out to get better leverage and I got it out. All I found in the sump was a rusty bolt, which you will see in the photos, and some transparent tape pieces just under the chopper laying there. Could this have caused that terrible sound the machine was making, as well as reduce pumping power to the upper arm?? I see nothing else wrong here. Definitely will need a new impeller, but I’m considering getting a whole new motor and pump assembly due to the corrosion that rusty bolt caused. I’m sure the impeller being a little worn has been affecting pump performance alone. Wonder how long this screw was down there for!

 

[maytaga806]

I also took the chopper and spring off, when I’m spinning the motor shaft by hand it’s making a scraping sound just under the shaft. Don’t think that’s normal. Probably needs a whole new assembly.

 

[maytaga806]

*correction

The drain impeller shaft was making a scraping sound while turning either direction. It was my understanding before that the wash impeller also acted as the drain impeller but I just realized that the shaft I was speaking of is a drain impeller after watching some repair videos.

 

[combo52]

Noisi motor? Whirlpool power clean dishwasher pump.

Since you got it apart, remove the drain impeller and hook the motor up and see what it sounds like. Just set it back in the dishwasher and plug it into the wiring harness that's the way to tell if the motor has bad bearings, etc..

The rusty bolt didn't cause any problem, except a stain on the plastic housing, the impellers do not wear and lose efficiency either unless pieces are broken off of them very unlikely.

These pump assemblies were often serviced by replacing the whole thing however they're no longer available so you're gonna have to find a good used one at this point, unless you can find a new old stock one somewhere.

If the motor sounds OK, you can buy a rebuild kit that includes the water seal and both impeller's and some gaskets and easily rebuild this one, but you need to make sure the motor runs quietly.

John

 

[maytaga806]

I found tons of new assemblies online, almost 400$ though. Thanks for the tips, I’ll try that out as I was thinking about rebuilding it and I already know where to find the rebuild kit as I will need a new impeller as is so if it sounds alright I’ll go ahead and do that and keep her in storage.

Are these modules alright to keep dry for storing purposes? I’ve always known to keep water in dishwashers when not in regular use “so the seals don’t crack”. Is this true for this module?

 

[maytaga806]

I forgot to mention. When I got the screw off the motor shaft for the wash impeller the shaft was emitting a propane gas smell, thought that was really strange.

 

[combo52]

Should dishwasher water seals, be kept wet

Reply number 10, they will last much longer if they're allowed to be dry, they should not be run dry however, because the water does act as a lubricant.

That's why the new pump assemblies are packed dry. They will keep longer if they are dry.

You should never believe old wise tales you should not keep water in the bottom of a dishwasher that you're not using either if it's not hooked up and not being used, don't keep water in it.

It's usually best to follow the manufacturers instructions. This is like the old wise tale that you have to leave a refrigerator standing up 24 hours if you laid it on its side before you plug it in again,no manufacturer has ever suggested that, it's another old wise tale

John

 

[gelaundry4ever]

video

I tried to play the video but it has been removed.

 

[ryner1988]

Reply #13

Jerome, that's likely because the OP no longer needed the video for diagnostic purposes, so he took it down. People do that often if the video is only put up to figure out a problem.

 

[maytaga806]

Yes your right Ryne.

Thanks John! Good to know.

 

[maytaga806]

Update

Just as I suspected the motor is bad. Ran it briefly without the drain impeller in with just the motor shaft bare, still made that awful sound which was coming from the motor. Bad bearings or something.

I inspected the rest of the module parts and everything is in great shape so I saved all of the pump assembly parts, racks, arms, even the inner plastic door and then threw the body and motor of the machine away as I don’t need or have room for it. Many great parts for my machine if needed in the future and I took the filter/seperator assembly and installed it into my dishwasher because I’ve been needing a new one for a while now due to the fact that the screw holes lost the threading and the original torx screws wouldnt tighten anymore and I was temporarily using regular screws to hold it down but those have rusted severely so it’s back to being original again with the assembly from the donor. You can’t buy that new. You’d have to buy the entire motor and pump! So that saved me several hundreds.

I still can’t wrap my head around why the upper wash arm in this tower feed dishwasher wasn’t getting pressure. I literally took the pump outlet & the nozzle cap, tower and upper wash arm from that machine and installed it into my daily Powerclean dishwasher which is direct fed & works perfectly but as soon as I installed those tower feed parts and tested it I had the same result, barley any pressure to the upper arm. After I installed the part donor dishwashers filter I tested it again and the result was exactly the same still no pressure. There is nothing wrong with either of the separator/filter assembly’s. I added a whole gallon extra of water and that slightly improved it but just barely the streams were very weak and wouldn’t hit any dishes on the top rack yet there was a powerful stream coming out of the upper arms tower for the third level roof spray. So I ripped all the tower feed pieces out and reinstalled the original direct feed parts and the upper arm was just blasting as it’s supposed to so I’ve determined there’s absolutely nothing wrong with my machine there is clearly a fault with one of the parts for the tower feed style. I actually have two sets of the tower feed parts, two upper wash arms, two towers, two nozzle caps and two pump outlets and both of them when used for testing did the same thing no pressure to the upper rack. It makes absolutely no sense.

I just find it so hard believe I’m the only one who’s ever experienced this problem. I highly suspect the nozzle cap is worn out and doesn’t create the pressure it once used to 20 years ago. If there was a problem with my pump or filter I wouldn’t get a full blast spray with the direct feed parts in as I do. It makes absolutely no sense. Anyway, I digress I just needed to share this cause it’s quite mysterious and now I have all these spray arms towers and nozzle caps I can’t use. I was going to get a brand new nozzle cap off eBay someone was selling but right before I was going to place my order someone had ordered it. Unbelievable. It had been in my cart for weeks prior to that but the second I was going to buy it someone else stole it. That was the last brand new old stock nozzle cap on the internet I could find. If anyone has any suggestions let me know but as mentioned I’ve inspected every part and nothing is wrong with any of them I can only assume the rubber nozzle cap is worn out that’s the only thing that makes sense.

 

[combo52]

Pure water pressure top wash arm

Hi Dan, are you trying to add a wash arm to a power clean pump assembly that has the fine mesh screen under the lower wash arm.?

I don’t think they ever made that power clean module with the center feed tube maybe they’re not compatible I’m not sure, I’m quite sure there’s nothing wrong with the cap that you’re trying to find a new one of they just simply don’t wear out. I literally have a box of 30 of them Probably including new ones but they just don’t fail except when they split shoot water sideways I haven’t seen that happen in a decade.

John L

 

[maytaga806]

No so I’m talking about the latest version of the Powerclean pumps with the filter screen under the lower arm. Some came in tower feed, but most were direct feed. My daily user is a direct feed model from 2006 and the machine I just tore apart was essentially the same machine but it came with the tower feed. I’ll add photos below. Both machines have the same pump and motor only difference between the two is the pump outlets & water feed.

First 3 photos is of the machine I just tore apart the black one, with tower feed. Last two pics are of my daily user direct feed with electronic controls.