Help! Speed Queen TC5003WN questions.

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william8

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Appologize for the length.
I already posted about my dying 1989 Maytag here:
https://www.automaticwasher.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?95782_24

So today I went to the local Speed Queen dealer, and I have a TC5003WN being delivered a week from Monday. Retail was $1479 according to SQ, they had it marked $1329. I ended up paying $1150, with free delivery, drain extension, installation, and haul away of the old machine, +tax. I'm wondering if this is a good price? Seemed like it to me, it was better than I thought they would offer.

But... I asked about the drian pipe (too short), beacause mine is 76" off the ground in the basement. The main drain leaving my house is 52" already, so there is no lowering it. The stand pipe, which has the minimum 18" rise above the trap is 76" off the ground. See pics.

The salesman said that was too high, manual states max 48", he called the service tech who said it should be fine, and gave me this extension today:
https://aaappliancecenter.com/products/speed-queen-part-for-commercial-laundry-appliances-451p3

The salesman also told me that if it didn't work, he could trade it for the TR5 or TR7 which is rated to 96", but I looked up all the top loaders, and they all state 48" max. I think he mistakenly looked at the front loaders, that will go to 96"

I also noticed SQ lists this part with check valve:
https://aaappliancecenter.com/products/speed-queen-drain-hose-extension-kit-204512

Questions:
1. Is anyone running one of these machines with a drain higher than 48"? Or 72"
2. Is the extention I have the right extension hose, or do I need the second one?

I was a bit shocked that the new Speed Queens have plastic hoses too. And that they would not pump as high as my old Maytag, or any of the new LG, GE's, or Maytags, that are all rated for 96".

Every machine I have ever used was in the basement, and the standpipe was just as tall as mine, so I didn't think it would even be a consideration.

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william8-2024050318305501668_2.jpg
 
Congratulations on your new washer

I think the new Speed Queen will be able to pump out to the height that you have without problems, you might need to put a check valve in the line, but I doubt it.

Front load washers generally have a check valve built into the drain line, which is why they can pump out higher.

Of the pump in the TC five is very powerful.

I think you got a good price on the machine. This often shows that small dealers are a better way to buy things than big box stores that have so much overhead and they keep adding fees on top of fees when you buy something. We can almost always beat any of the big box stores for our customers.

John
 
Thanks John,

If I'm researching right, it looks like the TR3/5/7 have electric pumps, and the TC5 has a mechanical pump? Either way they all say over 48" "not recommended". But SQ uses the same generic install manual for all of them, dated 2019.

Has anyone actually used a stand pipe this high with the TC5003WN? He said he would exchange, but I'm not sure about a full refund. since the others are the rated the same. The only other Top Loaders they had were GE/Hotpoint, and I don't want that crap, the tubs wobbled all over the place. And that was the commercial model.

The factory hose reaches over 5' is height, in the showroom I removed the plastic form, straigtened the bend which made it over 6', so just attaching the rubber piece from the extension would get about 7' and more than high enough. So not sure where I would even install a check valve. Doesn't seem like it would do much unless I put it closer to the machine. Looks like a 80" x 1" hose only holds .27 gallon of water anyways, if my math works.

If I call Speed Queen myself to confirm, will they talk to a consumer?
 
The TC5 has a 1/2HP drain pump, the TR somewhere around 1/20 HP.

 

At my old place I had three direct drives which drained at roughly that height without a check valve and there was no is issue with washing or rinsing. I haven't done that math but I'd go on a limb and speculate that a check valve might even cause more problems down the road then it solves. A failure point and the possibility that the pump might not overcome the flapper for a small amount of water on the tub side of thing.

 

At most you're looking at a slightly longer drain time which will not harm anything. Both spins give more than enough time to cover worse case scenario drain times. Exception being the spray rinse, however, those start prematurely in nearly all Speed Queen washers even at a typical drain height so don't even be worried about that. And unlike HE washers, the full tub fill will dilute away 0.27 gallons of water.

 

Call Speed Queen and ask about your concerns. Their customer service in the past has been hit or miss, however, it never hurts to try even if more than once. Explain your concern and pitch different solutions around various Speed Queen products.
 
That's not how power works

That's not how power works, chetlaham. The 1/2 HP has to drive the tub as well.
By that logic, my car would have a 105HP air conditioning system...

I don't think either SQ or the retailer will give you major issues in service or return if it doesn't work, but these limits are usually there for a reason.

Pumping out over a longer distance is way easier than height.
For pumping height, at lot of factors play into it, even down to pump design.
A high flow rate pump design is inherently less good at peak static pressure - and peak pressure is what you are looking for if it comes to water lift height.

That's also probably why certain machines in the same lineup have different pumps.
If you want to drain a full tub of a TC in 30sec or so you need flow rate and have to sacrifice pressure in return.
The installation instructions on the SQ website state 2 things:
The TR7s manual says that the machine will not drain with a standpipe higher than 8 feet - so your situation would work.
The TC5s just says anything higher than 4 feet is not recommended - so no hard no, but definitely discouraging such situations.

So my guess is that either will work.
However, longer drain times on the TC5 will mean more wear. As long as it spin drains, the belt slips. These machines are known to need belts every couple of years under normal situations, so longer belt slippage each spin just means that point in time will come sooner and more frequent, just to keep in mind.

Side note: The FLs list required flow rates for the drain up to 8 feet in height, so they probably will work similarly well in terms of draining.
 
William8

That dealer sounds less and less sympathetic...

Neither are direct drive, all are belt drive.
The TC5 has a transmission and reversing 2 speed motor. The pump however is directly mounted on the motor shaft.
The TR machines have a variable speed inverter motor and no transmission or mode shifter at all. The belt drives a drive wheel to the drum and agitator, which are coupled together.
 
Thanks,henene4

In my experiene, salesmen don't always know much, maybe he was new. He had to look it up in the manual. The head service tech does know his stuff, and he gave me the extension.

Do the TR's have electric pumps? In videos it looks like it drains water before spinning. The TR5 was offered for $50 less.

I'm concerned you say it needs a new belt every couple of years, I've never heard that before, and it looks like a pain to change.

My 1989 Maytag you just tilt it back, and change the belts from the bottom. Don't have to disconnect anything. Never had to though, in 35 years.
 
Th TR series uses an electric pump.

The early Speed Queen washers were belt eaters but that's mostly fixed. You won't get 35 years out of the transmission belt like the Maytag but you should get at least 5-7 with a 2 person household. You'll have to come to terms that NOTHING today is built like your Maytag.

Speed Queen pump in the TC series is stronger than your Maytag so you shouldn't have any problem with draining. The pumps are so strong that standpipes overflowing with suds occurs in a few instances. You won't have that problem with a higher mounted standpipe.
 
Thanks again, qsd-dan

That's still disapointing. I was hoping for at least 15, certainly not 35! I know those days are long gone.

Do the TR5 belts last longer with the electric pump? I still have a week to change the order.

Here's a sad tale. My wife was telling her sister we bought a Speed Queen yesterday, and her sister said they had one, it was great for many years (she wasn't sure how many) and started making noise. They never had it looked at, and replaced it with a Kenmore last year. They PAID $50 to have it hauled away at the time! Probably just needed a minor repair...
 
@Henrik: Indeed your car AC is driven by a 105HP engine. Thats why a car AC can start and stop repeatedly where as a home AC unit will stall unless the high and low side are equalized. A 5 HP motor simply can not do what a 105HP motor can do having enough power to spare for driving and passenger comfort.  

 

 

The belt slips and as such the majority of that 1/2HP is not placed into the tub at the start of the spin cycle.  When I had my 1998 post FF GE with the Italian pump and no strainer like a front load, there was a period when the pump had an issue bogging and slowing down, I assume threads or something had wrapped around the shaft causing the pump to slow. At 1/2HP, with a capacitor and start winding which produce up to 4 times the running torque upon start I've never had this problem with a 1/2 pump drive motor slowing down or seizing. Unless a sock or hair pin gets sucked into the port noting will ever slow the pump down.  

 

 
 
@William: The pump is direct drive, the motor shaft connects directly to the pump impeller. The rest is a belt however, as is the TR series.    

 

Consider that the Whirlpool direct drive, the most successful top load washer in history also used a direct drive drain pump driven by a 1/2HP motor.

chetlaham-2024050416175604456_1.jpg

chetlaham-2024050416175604456_2.jpg
 
started making noise

What type of noise? What year was the machine made? The Speed Queen design before the 2000 to late 2000s was renowned at being short lived and nothing like today. In terms of noise you will hear more noises than you're Maytag- just the design of the machine. The metal gears in the transmission, the tub leaning into the styrofoam pad at the front, the squeak of the tub brake before it breaks in. You will hear new distinct new noises however they are normal for the Speed Queen TC.

 

The belt will probably last longer on the TR, however the TR will not perform like you're old Maytag did washing wise and of course you've got a toy for a drain pump. 
 
The TC and helical Maytag designs use a slipping belt as a clutch for getting up to speed on the spin cycle. Speed Queen basically stole Maytags design with some minor changes but the transmission belt doesn't last as long on the Speed Queen. You may get 15 years out of the belt if the machine is loaded properly, which it sounds like you do. Most users overload top loading washers.

The TR series does not use a slipping belt but in my opinion (and most others) they don't wash worth a damn. The TC Speed Queen washer washes like the your old Maytag.



 

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