HVAC Woes

[sudsmaster]

That slab crack easily could be from settlement, not from quakes.

I have a much more narrow crack running the length of the 1,000 sq ft workshop building on the property. It hasn't got any larger that I can tell, and we've had some moderate tremors since I acquired it. I believe it's from settlement, because the neighboring property (the workshop building in in the corner of the lot about six feet from the property line) drops off about five feet. There is a concrete retaining wall along the short side, but the long side had a decaying wood barrier. The condo association there shored it up with a new wooden retaining wall, but there is still a drop-off. So I planted a row of fast growing trees along the chainlink fence. I believe the roots are helping to stabilize the soil there. At some point I'm going to fill the slab crack with grout or cement or whatever is recommended. The building itself is all wood and doesn't appear to be suffering from the movement. I suspect with non-pre-stressed slabs around here, there are those who have cracked, and those who are going to crack. There also could be some heaving under the workshop. I dunno. Once I fill the crack, I suppose any protruding edges could be ground down, as is done with sidewalk cracks (which are numerous around here).

I do not share your aversion to gas appliances in California. I don't have an operating gas oven here, but if I did I'd vent it up through the roof. The gas cooktop is vented by the range hood. The forced air furnace in the crawl is vented through roof, as is the gas fired water heater in the enclosed patio.

Nothing is guaranteed. Even electricity can kill you. And, remember the big fire up north that killed scores of people? That wiped out an entire mountain community? That was started by... electric power...

And I still don't understand the logic, if any, or putting a water heater in the attic. Seems like it's just asking for trouble, regardless of how it's powered.

 

[wayupnorth]

There are some, very few, places without basements up here on a slab, mostly modular and mobile homes. They are very cold in the winter on the floor. Most with basements have a furnace and water heater or some like me have a boiler for heat and hot water and I have 2 oil tanks in my basement. Those on a slab have to have an outside oil tank and pay dearly for kerosene in the dead of the winter as regular heating oil will always jell and mess the lines up. If they happen to be where they might be able to get natural gas,chances are very slim, but no chance of ever getting natural gas here where I am and propane sure aint cheap either. Some have put in those mini-split built heat/AC units and they seem to work ok, but in the winter the electric resistance costs them alot more. Alot of people still just burn wood here but I dont want to mess with that any more. I have never seen anyone other than businesses with central a/c around here. Usually its just a window unit for July and August and on with heat in September. A week and half ago we had SNOW and we hit 88 yesterday, go figure.[this post was last edited: 5/24/2020-23:25]

 

[sudsmaster]

Well, until I was 11 we lived near New Haven in a little tract house (it seemed huge to me) that had a full basement. The furnace oil was delivered to a spout - I think it was on the side of the house - to a big black oil tank in the basement. From there the oil was (pumped, probably) to an oil furnace more or less in the middle of the basement, which heated via passive radiators. The heat was good until the last year when we ran out of funds and had to crowd around a single electric space heater in the living room. Then in the spring we hightailed to San Francisco where my new life began. The rest, as they say, is history, LOL. But down in that Connecticut basement we had a Bendix front loader on a riser, as well as a spare fridge (our old GE), a work bench (from which I was eventually banned, LOL), and of course a set of slanted storm doors with steps leading up to them out of the basement. I remember the basement flooded once, which made the risers for the furnace, washer, and fridge make sense. I think every house in that neighborhood, which was built post-war, had a basement.

In the San Francisco area, only much older homes (like 1900's) had basements. Some had little basements that were about 8'x10'. And often a home built on a hill had a garage under the house and the excavation beyond that created a sort of half-basement. I've only lived in places that had crawl spaces or garages/half basements under the living quarters. I know of some slab construction that has hot water heating via pipes embedded in the slab. I understand that can be very nice until the pipes fail. Other places might have a thick layer of insulating foam under the wall to wall carpeting.

 

[DADoES]

 
Keep in mind it's not unusual here to run cooling in Sep, Oct, Nov, Mar, and Apr.  Occasionally in Dec.  Usually not Jan and Feb.

Regards to heating, there were only a few instances of a few hours of early-morn 30°F to 32°F for the 2019-2020 "winter" season.

On-slab being the normal construction, air distribution through the floor doesn't happen except for mobile homes.  HVAC blower/coils installed in closets isn't unusual but the distribution ductwork still runs through the attic.

 

[tomturbomatic]

RE reply 26: No basements are why you southerners have so many fewer classic appliances.

 

[bradfordwhite]

"And I still don't understand the logic, if any, or putting a water heater in the attic. Seems like it's just asking for trouble,"

I agree with you that it doesn't seem like the best choice, given the propensity for leaks. Plus they are heavy.

From a space consideration it would makes sense. And that would also save money. Also, it's in a hot attic which would help save heating costs. And it's outside the thermal envelope making it safer than being in the house.

California certainly has it's share of homes with the w. heater outside the home on a porch or in a special lean-to cabinet which is a good idea. Especially if it's gas.

I remember the day in 1989 turning on the tv and watching the coverage of the Loma Prieta quake and they talked about the homes that were built on mushy landfill and how those homes easily caught fire because of broken gas lines. That just scares me. Earthquakes can happen without warning and be over in a second, but the damages can be deadly.

----

"No basements are why you southerners have so many fewer classic appliances."

True, as well as other good stuff.

However, I'm learning we still have our hoarders. See people people with musty but protected basements in the North and midwest can collect stuff in their basements and just forget about it, for generations perhaps.

Here, there are people who deliberately hoard if they have the space. Its a little bit different.

Also, there is probably less mid century stuff down here in the first place. Look at history. How did the U.S. look in it's various regions in 1960 for example? North East, Mid-west, the South, West Coast, Mountain states?

South was generally poor (and it still is in a lot of areas),
Midwest had the manufacturing and thus people were better off, they bought stuff and tended to be thrifty and held onto stuff,
Northeast had money and could afford anything,
California and West and Mountain states were just booming and thus could afford stuff too but the needs and wants were different and more trendy than say the midwest.

Things are changing and people who are moving South don't tend to bring with them their large appliances and furniture.

They come to "retire" so all the "good" stuff gets left behind and auctioned or is made available for people in the Northern areas.

 

[DADoES]

 
Spent a few days last year July 4th camped in a friend's walk-out basement in KC, KS.  Local-born girl, moved there years ago.  Known them for 36 years.  Older bro & sis were on the first crew when the theater opened, she also worked there later.

Charming 95yo house.  A/C (set on 76°F) was cold as hell down there, not so much on the upper level.  System needs airflow balancing.

1 - Condensate handled by a small pump that sends it to a sump in the corner behind the air mattress (where I camped).

2 - Baseboard registers.

3 - Laundry (GE washer).  Bathroom/shower behind the door.

4 - Rand (her bro), Susan, Dan (her BF) @ Royals game.

5 - Rand's camping corner.  Her roommate/boarder has a room behind the door.

6 - Jameson (named after one of her favorite beverages).

7 - Trip stats.

 

[eronie]

My basement

 

[chachp]

I’d love that.

Wish we could have them here. I grew up with a basement.

 

[circlew]

Basementless Arkansas

Ralph, what is there about your area that precludes homes having basements? It's not near the coast; is the water table unusually high there?

 

While basements are rarely found in southern and central Mississippi, I've seen them in houses in the northern part of the state.

 

[chachp]

The Water Table

 

<span style="font-family: georgia, palatino;">Hi Tom,</span>

 

<span style="font-family: georgia, palatino;">Yes it's the water table being too high.  There are very few homes here with basements.  One of our hobbies is going to estate sales (or was until all this mess) so we go into a lot of houses.  When we stumble on one with a basement they are generally much older homes and so musty  you can't really spend much time down there.  We do see houses that are more like a split level and depending how much of the lower level is below ground, they may be musty without a dehumidifier but with one they are tolerable and sometimes not musty at all.</span>

 

<span style="font-family: georgia, palatino;">I would love a basement.  We always had one growing up.  </span>

 

[DADoES]

 
Coincidentally, the tenant at RJ's rental where the HVAC outfit initially installed the wrong heat strips reported yesterday that they were gone for a couple days and came home to water dripping from the ceiling.

They looked in the attic and found that the secondary pan is ... not level and overflowing.

This is the second time the primary drain there has clogged but the first time for a ceiling drip AFAIK.  Presumably the secondary worked on the first incident to provide a visible outside drip so I'm not clear on why that didn't happen this time regards to the pan now being askew.

They apparently are aware-enough to fix the primary clog but the secondary pan situation needs to be fixed properly, and the ceiling may need some repairs (I haven't seen it).

 

[mark_wpduet]

84

today. AC keeping house nice and cool all day. I can't imagine it being a freezing up issue...I remember he did say the A coil was really clean last visit.

Basements - In Brevard NC (my home town) there were lots of houses that had basements.

 

[bradfordwhite]

basement Tony

#46  Goals

 

OMG, Tony, your basement is awesome. 

Sunny pastel 60s yellow walls with a relatively fresh painted dove gray floor you can walk on with clean white socks. 

And full basements tend to be so peaceful because the ground is a natural sound deadening material so you can be down there and feel like you're in your own world.  

 

When I build my house I want to have a large "activities room" that looks like this with floor joists and 6" furnace ducts on the ceiling, tiny basement windows high up on the wall, a surface mounted electric box, a fake gas furnace and 30 gallon water heater, a few random water pipes,  and of course a plethora of washer, dryers and other basementy type stuff.   lol.

 

 

----

Ralph.  Two words.  

 

Adorable poodle.

 

[chachp]

Reply #52

 

<span style="font-family: georgia, palatino;">Thank you Keith.</span>

 

[vacerator]

A condesnate pump

can be installed to take the water away from the pan, and drain it out the side of the roof eve, or gable. They have a holding tank. Thats another line you must keep clean though.

 

[mark_wpduet]

He called me back

wanted to come today but he couldn't because we are changing ISP's to Metronet. So they were in the attic running fiber. So he's coming tomorrow around noon to check again, hopefully it will be fixed this time. But damn, I've never had internet this fast. They have 4 plans 100/100... 200/200......500/500...or 1000/1000. We got 200/200

https://www.speedtest.net/result/9506461359.png

 

[retro-man]

Blowing fuses

I have had a few interesting days with my hvac in my crawl space upstairs. A/C would start for a minute, compressor outside and the air handler. Then dead. Check and there is an automotive new type fuse marked 5 on it. This has blow before and had to have a service call and the guy left me an extra one to replace if blown. No problem opened up the service door and replace fuse. All well and fine ran for about 2 hours since the house was in the 80's and I set the temp for 74. Ran then shut off, about half hour later was calling for cooling and no response. Same thing fuse was blown. Now the fuse that they had put in and the extra they left were this orange color. Not the original tan color. Went to Autozone and picked a 5 pack of fuses that were the tan color. These had a 5A stamped onto them like the original that came with the unit. Put one in yesterday morning and all is well. Cycles on and off like normal. Apparently there is a difference in a 5 and a 5A. Anyone know what the difference is. This appears looking at board that this is a relay to let the compressor when to start along with the blower in the a/c mode.

Thanks
Jon

 

[DADoES]

 
An automotive blade-type fuse on the thermostat transformer circuit.

5 and 5a probably are the same ... the "a" was just not included on the labeling?

Color indicates amperage rating.  Tan is 5 amp, orange is much larger 40 amp.  That's a large disparity.  Maybe the orange fuses were discolored tan or non-standard coloring?

Automotive fuse - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[mark_wpduet]

Finally fixed!!

The compay came back Wednesday......only this time the owner made the tech call him so they could discuss different things. I'm not sure what he did......but he got the clog. No water coming into the garage anymore. The outside had a very slow drip and now it's much faster when the AC is running. I was so tired when he was here because I hadn't slept for 2 days...it was all such a blur. It's so nice to have a dry garage floor again and not having to worry about a pan full of water in the attic damaging something.

I now know more about AC condensate that I knew before. I always knew they created water.......I just never realized it was THAT MUCH water! I've never experienced a condensate clog before.

Anyway I do have a question. Those Algae tabs that you can buy..where exactly do they go in my Air handler? I know there's a filter door...it's very thin. I think the when you open the filter door, the A coil is ABOVE that and the pan below it.... could I just drop a tab in there through the filter door?