Laundry Detergent made in Mexico

[bobbyderegis]

Hi All!
I just bought an 11 lb. bag of Roma laundry detergent at K-mart. It looked just like old Rinso, which I loved. It smells nice, makes tons of suds, even in my old Maytag. It is made by "Fabrica de Jabon la Corona". The ingedients say sodium phosphate, but I thought that was banned in the US a long time ago. There are no directions as to how much to use, so I throw in a cupful. Is this going to leave a build-up in the machine? I got a sudslock in a couple loads. I would appreciate any info you good folks will share. I hope you will see this, Launderess!
Bobby in Boston

 

[mickeyd]

Bobby
Didn't know we could get that stuff in the North east. Try a half a cup. My Gram's pulsamatic always oversudsed with a full cup of soap. Or try cold water before the real winter chill. Is Boston still pretty warm like buffalo?

Mikey

 

[sudsmaster]

Bobby,

Laundry phosphates have never been banned or even restricted in the US on a national basis. They are however, banned or restricted in a number of states and localities. Generally speaking, they are restricted or banned in "wet summer" states, or states with lots of rivers, creeks, and lakes. The relatively arid Southwest, including all of California, allow the use of phosphated laundry detergents without restriction.

I believe Massachusetts is one of those states that ban laundry phosphates.

Aside from that, you should reduce the amount of Roma that you use to keep suds to a manageable level. Typically no more than 1 inch of suds in a top loader is just fine. The phosphates will NOT cause a buildup in your machine. In fact, they will help prevent buildup of hard water mineral precipitates, something that modern phosphate-free detergents have a hard time doing. Roma may even remove old deposits from within your machine.

You will probably notice that your clothes are much cleaner with a phosphated detergent. I noticed this difference in "Clout" in the 1990's. When Huish/Kirkland decided to yank the phosphates out of it, its performance on whites plummeted. I used to be able to get axle grease out of white jeans with the old Clout in my Whirlpool BD no problem. When it went phosphate-free, it could barely get black fabrics clean. When I got my Neptune, I remembered my experience with Clout and went searching for the missing ingredient. I soon learned about STPP, or sodium tri-polyphosphate, which is almost like a magic ingredient when it comes to getting laundry clean. I turned the folks at THS onto this "discovery", and the rest is more or less history.

Ironically, even states with laundry phosphate bans still allow their use in dishwashing detergents. And the human body excretes more phosphates than a typical laundry room that uses a phosphated detergent. Go figure.

 

[mickeyd]

When Lake Erie started to die and suds often washed ashore, phosphates were banned, except for dishwasher detergent. The whites went gray as you pointed out. Unbelievably, local nuns spread it around that you could add dishwasher detergent to the whites wich they had to keep immaculte and heavenly, but I'll try your chemicals. Never heard about it thanks.

 

[sudsmaster]

Phosphates have NOTHING to do with suds in creeks, rivers, and lakes.

That phenomenon was caused by early synthetic surfactants, which had branched chains that microbes had a hard time digesting. Thus the surfactants persisted in the environment, causing visible sudsing that raised an outcry. This would happen regardless of the presence or non-presence of phosphates in the detergent. The laundry detergent industry voluntarily switched over to synthetic surfactants with linear unbranched chains, which the microbes in the soil and water happily digested. Problem solved.

Unfortunately, anti-phosphate forces used old footage of sudsy streams to rally opposition to the use of phosphates in laundry detergents. This was outright fraud.

 

[mickeyd]

Sudsy

If they can lie about Weapons of mass destruction, imagine how easy it was to lie about soap. Thanks for the info. Imagine... they tricked us into believing "the wash did it," when in fact it was the huge dailly influx of pollutants from the two steel plants, Bethlehem and Republic flooding the lake causing the catastrophe. I'm getting a kick at the sudsmaster taking exception to suds. I love suds too,
and always doubted their
accessory to the crime of almost killing Lake Erie. Thank You.

Mikey

 

[launderess]

Roma, Focca,Zote, Ariel (non HE version) and other assorted laundry detergents from Mexico are sold all over the United States, espeically in areas with high Hispanic populations. Our local K-Sears has an entire shelf of Mexican laundry products, including the ones named above. All contain phosphates and unless stated for use in front loading washers, are for the most part highly sudsing.

Mexico's environmental/sewage laws are not nearly as strict as those in the United States (one not too small reason many "dirty" factories have relocated production under NAFTA south of the border), and phosphates are not restricted in any way.

Focca is designed for top loading/wash tub laundry, so you will just have to find the correct dosage. Personally think "Focca" and the rest are nothing better than "dollar store" detergents. Lots of phosphates, washing soda, perhaps some surfactants, perfume (usually lots) and that pretty much is about all. Then again any detergent high in phosphates is going to clean well and probably does not need the complex chemical cocktails developed to replace phosphates.

Phosphates and the United States:

Phosphates were not banned nationally, but each state had passed laws restricting or limited use of phosphates in residential laundry detergents. Commercial laundry detergents along with automatic dishwasher detergents were and still are exempt from these bans.

Phosphates are easily treated out of sewage, but that involves local areas spending money to update sewage plants. Many thought the ban on phosphates in laundry products would do the trick, but phosphates are naturally excreted by humans (and also used in meat processing), along with the fact so many homes have dishwashers these days plant upgrades became necessary anyway.

Residential laundry detergent makers began to consolidate production of their products and it was no longer cost effective to produce several flavors of detergent, each with varying phosphate content to satisfy local laws. Thus, phosphates were phased out entirely and replaced with the chemical cocktails we have today in laundry detergents.

Have some Ecolab commercial laundry detergent, which contains mainly only phosphates (STPP), washing soda, surfactants and am here to tell you for laundering bed linens and towels it rocks. According to the label it is made for "greasy and oily soils", and sold to commercial laundries for bed linens and towels. It is very low sudsing, when one has the dosage correct, but it is designed to be dispensed/calibrated automatically. One half ounce will launder 5kg of wash in my front loader.

Despite all the furore over phosphates in laundry products, no single chemical to date has been invented/found to do all the things phosphates can when it comes to laundry/dishwashing.

L.

 

[cr_atl]

Ecolab detergent

Laundress,

How/Where did you get Ecolab detergent?

 

[petek]

Wasn't the reason that phosphates were banned in some areas was because they acted as fertilizer in the water causing almost uncontrolled algae and plant growth that basically used up all the waters oxygen killing the fish?

 

[sudsmaster]

In a few areas (New York, I believe) even commercial phosphated laundry detergents are banned, maybe even dishwashing detergents.

Effective removal of phosphates from the municipal sewage flow requires what is called tertiary sewage treatment. It is more expensive, but more and more localities are ponying up the funds to so do.

In the southwest, the main pollutant of concern is nitrates, not phosphates. And guess what? Without nitrates, there can be no algae growth, either. In the Southeast, some of the worst pollution comes from agribusiness, particularly huge hog farms that spew tons of noxious waste daily into holding ponds that are not guaranteed to prevent flow into the surrounding water bodies.

Although I haven't seen any corroborating evidence, a publication sponsored by the phosphate industry suggests that due to the buffering capability and low toxicity of phosphates, they may actually be beneficial to the environment in areas where acid rain is a problem. Theoretically this seems sound, but I haven't seen any studies that prove or disprove this suggestion.

Anyway, if you want a phosphated laundry detergent, and can't find one of the Mexican brands, try looking in "Cash and Carry" types of restaurant supply stores. The stuff labeled "for institutional use only" may be what you're looking for.

While Mexican brands of residential laundry detergents may be widely available, it's still illegal to sell them in states with phosphate bans. And in some cases, it's also illegal to use them.

 

[launderess]

CR_Atl

Sorry, a lady never tells.... *LOL*

 

[launderess]

You can buy all the STPP (phosphate) you wish at various online and in person at chemistry stores. Folks over at THS have been preaching the gospel of STPP for ages, with "The Chemisty Store", an online chemistry place the store of choice.

Have ordered huge buckets of STPP from the above source, the stuff is great for cutting with Persil or any other detergent for a great clean wash using less detergent. Also use STPP straight in several rinse cycles to help rid laundry of detergent build up/in case of using too much detergent in the wash. Am here to tell you STPP and Fels Naphta make a GREAT laundry detergent for greasy/badly stained laundry. In fact use STPP when laundering anything in pure soap (except woolens and silk).

Of the many chemicals used as phosphate replacments, two; borax and it's cousin perborate bleach, along with zeolites are being phased out in Europe. Turns out both are harmful to water supplies and creatures living in said water, so it's back to the drawing board.

In another thread, someone mentioned Persil non-bio tablets (UK version). Take alook at the contents list for the product, it is very heavy on phosphates. Enzymes have been the detergent industry's answer to removing phosphates, so detergents without enzymes still need that certian something, and that "something" is phosphates. Study after study over the years has proven laundry washed in phosphate containing detergents will be cleaner,whiter, and brighter than any other combination of chemicals to date. Finding the perfect replacement for phosphates has kept generations of chemical people's butter stuck to their bread.

Launderess

 

[launderess]

PeteK

Yes, phosphates make great plant food, so do nitrates; however post a certian event in the Mid-West buying bulk amounts of nitrates raises red flags.

Launderess

 

[ironrite]

Thanks to Toggle's post where he showed a bag of the Chinese Tide, I went to a local dollar store here and bought a bag. Can't tell by the label what it has in it, but it does a very nice job cleaning on the whites.

I've recently tried the Foca and Roma, both sold at a local Smiths (Kroger) store here. Phosphates are listed in the ingrediants as water softening agents. I was careful at first with the Frigidaire FL on the amount of each I used. However, now I just load up the dispenser. Both of these suds less than Coldwater Tide in the machine. And I'm finding they clean both clean better on white and light color clothes.

 

[sudsmaster]

Folks over at THS have been preaching the gospel of STPP fo

Yeah, and it was I who introduced the STPP concept over at THS in the first place... it was around 2000/2001, as I recall.

Be that as it may, while it may be possible to buy STPP, it's not legal in some localities to actually use it in laundry. Check with your local/state ordinances if this concerns you.

Also, the type of nitrate used in bombs is ammonium nitrate. It's become very hard to find in garden centers, after Oklahoma City. However, other sources nitrogen, such as potassium nitrate or ammonium sulfate, work just as well for fertilizing gardens, but don't lend themselves to explosives.

 

[tolivac]

farmers use Ammonium based fertilizers everyday.They even pump ammonia gas into the ground as a fertilizer agent.Its true the fertilizer grade Ammonium nitrate isn't pure enough for bomb making.Any Ammonium coumpound could be used for explosives-but entails alot of chemestry work-and other ingredients.

 

[westyslantfront]

Phosphates

Speaking as one of the members of the Tucson, Contingent, we all use Mexican detergents. Love the scent of Viva, but we also use Roma and Foca. They all seem to do a better job than Tide, but we have to be careful as they all make lots of suds.
We have washed clothes in Tide, only to re-wash in Mexican detergents which gets out dirt that Tide left behind.
They are readily available all over Tucson, Arizona.

 

[48bencix]

other uses for Roma

If you look on the Roma bag it shows that you can use if for dishes. The old Tide boxes had that too, and my Grandma did use Tide for her dishes, lots of suds.

I also use Roma to wash my dirty melamine shelving units, wash walls before painting. It is also great to soak those burner bowls from my GE cooktop (electric).

I still like Tide powder on a day to day basis, either Tide Free, with no scent, or Tide with bleach for whites. However, I do like to add some Roma for especially filthy stuff.

Here in Sacramento, we have Roma at Albertson's along with the other Mexican detergents. Also at the 99 cent store.

I assume that phosphates are banned in laundry detergents here in California, if they are banned anywhere it would be here. I just don't think those people who look into this sort of thing really know what's going on or how to stop the imports.

 

[sudsmaster]

Phosphated laundry detergents are legal in California.