MOVING A MAYTAG E2L

[stan]

I see it!

You have to look at it JUST right ! Like Art!
The piece of metal dose not look like the chuck missing, but maybe it is, and has just been smashed around for 20 years? seems a little big though??

I have the same question... about the spin?

 

[e2l-arry]

EVERYTHING MOVES

freely. I'm just wondering about the worm wheel. It' not missing the complete tooth. Just a bit of one is broken off on the end facing the inside of the P.U. I don't think that what was on the shaft though. Completely different size and shape.

 

[stan]

Humm

I guess we'll wait for Geoff to come along.
Think getting that big loose piece out should make a big difference, but lets see what he has to say about the gears!

 

[mickeyd]

And about the mysterious fly wheel

How did a non-pump model end up with the larger one? Assembly error? Replacement? It once was a pumper?

 

AH ! a Maytag Mystery

 

[e2l-arry]

My suspicion is that

By 1964 there was a consolidations parts to save money and reducing BOM's. (Bills Of Materials) That way they only maintained inventory of 1 parts vs. 2. Since this pulley worked for either pump or non-pump, it didn't matter.

But another theory is that the machine did originally have a pump that broke and was simply removed vs. fixing the pump. The original drain hose was threaded? Who knows. I've learned to expect the unexpected with this thing. I'm wondering if it's even really a Maytag. Might be a knock off Hoyt-Clagwell. Leave it to that Mr. Haney! He's a slippery old cuss!

 

[stan]

Good question!

looks like there are two factory holes to accommodate a pump ?? Did Maytag do this with E machines so that one could add later??

 

[geoffdelp]

I see the missing piece; not sure how that would break off. Larry ... when you turn the flywheel, does the gear turn a full 360 degrees? Do you feel anything grabbing at the bottom? One of the purposes of that wheel was to bring transmission fluid up and over the worm gear; keeping it well lubricated during operation. We should research that a little more. It may be OK just the way it is; I'm worried about something at the bottom of that wheel, however.

Also ... all Maytag models (E, J, N) had those two holes added to the frames for possible future pump additions ... BUT ... my 1968 Model J does not have the larger-lipped flywheel; it is a non-pump model. If that model was originally a pump model, you would have seen a gray-primed space on the right hand side (where the hose is) of the bottom of the skirt ... in the middle ... the pump handles were placed on the machine prior to painting.

A mystery if that is a pump wheel. Do you have the parts manual Larry? Can you look up the pump feature and check the wheel? There could have been a repair to this machine earlier; who knows.

 

[e2l-arry]

I think,

Maytag just made one set that would accommodate either model by the 60's. I mean, why have 2 sets of parts when 1 set can be used for either? I think maybe back in the 40's and 50's maybe the extra $10.00 for a pump was considered a luxury and a lot of people wouldn't pay the extra. But by the 1960's? Yea, some cheep-os might not want a pump but from a manufacturing point of view it would make sense to have one set of tooling that made one part that could be configured either way. Just speculating. It would take a true Maytag historian to confirm any of this.

So there's my 2 cents on the subject.

 

[stan]

so...

how to proceed ?

Can that P.U be turned upside down, and flushed out in case there is something (broken piece) laying on the bottom that might be brought up by it's turning?
Kind of looks like maybe you've done that already?

Curious to know what you used to clean it with?

 

[geoffdelp]

Larry ... Not sure if that is so true. A lot of homemakers did not have the plumbing to accommodate the pump model; my cousin's mother-in-law was one (where I inherited the 1968 Model J). She washed clothes in the cellar of their farm home in Central MN until the day she died in the early 1990's. She had no formal plumbing; hot and cold water had been dropped from the kitchen up above via regular garden hoses. Rinsing was done with standard, non-plumbed, double galvanized tubs. She let water out through a small drain in the floor that ran underneath the ground into the farm yard.

In all the Maytag historical data that I have, I don't find a mention of the flywheel being made as one specific version but I would guess that towards the end of production in 1983, that could be possible. The final parts list still showed both flywheels.

I would also guess that your machine had been repaired at some point. One of the easiest ways to repair these machines was to have a power unit "ready to go". The service shop would determine if the power unit was the problem and take the machine back to the shop and "swap" out units. Hence, the possibility of getting a unit with a pump flywheel AND ... possibly ... the other things you noticed (missing tooth on worm wheel, scrap of metal). Without knowing the history of the machine, it's pure speculation!! It doesn't really matter, either, as long as it functions OK!!

Sure wish I could have heard the sounds it made when it blurped its Bosco all over the floor!!!!

You're doing an excellent job, BTW. Did you remove the right angle drive yet and clean it out? Kind of messy, huh?

 

[e2l-arry]

I THINK IT CAME WITH A PUMP

That had been removed somewhere along the line. I thought I saw a space on the skirt where the "ON OFF" sticker was. I just went to look but it has been painted over.

So you're not worried about the chipped tooth? I'm wondering if that had anything to do with it locking up. Or is it more likely that wayward loose metal fragment was the culprit? Later today I'm going to dump out the cleaning fluid after soaking and see if there's anything else loose in there. It does turn freely 360 degrees but it also would do that before or after it would lock up. But whenever it did seize, the cure was to back it up, then turn it forward so maybe that freed up whatever was jamming it from the inside? How knows? I can go crazy trying to figure this thing out!

That sound it made when it leaked was something else It DID sound like a long fart followed by the sound of something dripping. For a minute there I thought I had a "personal problem"! I was somewhat relieved to see it was only the washer. LOL

The right angle drive is still in the machine. I unbolted it from the skirt AND transmission but it held tight to the skirt. It was oozing Bosco yesterday so I just put a bucket under it. I may attack that tonight. I saw what you meant about messy! Even with your warning I made a mess. Some oil dripped that I didn't notice. Then I stepped in it and tracked it all over the basement!

The parts manual does show 2 different pulley part numbers. A4367 is the standard pulley and A4368 is the pump/pulley

 

[mickeyd]

Laughing pretty hard right now about the farts, etc.

 

 

Thanks, Larry!

 

[geoffdelp]

I'm chuckling about the "farts", too! I have never heard one do that before. It must have had some air/water/oil bubble in the right angle drive and just sort of belched Bosco right out of there. Good grief.

There has got to be something then, that made that tooth break off. I am wondering what might have gotten beneath that wheel. Just see if anything flushes out of it when you take it out of the parts cleaner. I'm going to "try" to look at the documentation I have about that wheel so we clearly understand its purpose. I know it moves the worm feeder bar and also moves the oil back up over the top so it can keep the worm drive fully lubricated during operation.

You wanna talk about an oil mess ... my first time working on a machine, I decided it would be cool to see the transmission in action ... with the center plate off. Good gravy ... I had Bosco all over the place. What a mess to clean up.

Also, since this was a pump model before, I bet that the pump jammed up and that's why it is no longer on there. That also explains why you have the strainer plate; those only went with pump models.

Ah ha ... we're solving the pump issue!!

 

[e2l-arry]

From what I can tell,

I'm the third owner. The woman I bought it from said she used it for her kids diapers in the early 80's but did mention that she bought it second hand. So probably 2 sets of bad owners before me. How oafish to just yank something off when it breaks instead of just fixing it correctly. Good thing they didn't do that with everything wrong with it or there'd have been nothing left for me to buy. Well, I'm off to empty and flush the trans. See what I can see. Dare I even look? . . morbid curiosity forces me!

 

[stan]

Farts

"it must have had some air/water/oil bubble in the right angle drive"

like I said up thread "these are old ladies, they just do that" can't be helped !

waiting to see if what you find Larry, if nothing, than it had to be that loose piece of metal that hung up in there!
I'm curious to see what the new gaskets/seals are going to look like when you get them!

Also curious about the right angle drive re packing.

 

[e2l-arry]

I got it all cleaned up

Didn't find anything else loose although I could have missed something when I was flushing it with water. I can turn it by hand and watch it go through it's cycle. Back and forth. Nothing under the worm shaft and I didn't see any chips or obvious damage to it either. I did seem a little stiff but I gave it a light coating of WD 40 because I did use hot water on it and don't want any rust. From the pictures in the Service Manual I always assumed this worm wheel drove something related to the wringer but now since Geoff said it's only function is to lubricate when in use, I can't see how one little piece of a tooth missing can screw anything up. The thing does somehow move a shaft to the rt. angle drive but the teeth have nothing to do with that. So here's a picture of the newly cleaned part. Can't think of anything else to do to it at this point. I see a few spots of gunk I can go after but after that???? Maybe I'll go have another shot at getting that right angle drive out.

 

[geoffdelp]

BEAUTIFUL, LARRY!! You cleaned that right up! Now you can see how that transmission functions; not so scary ... solid mechanical workings. That wheel does more than oils ... it also drives the connection to the right angle drive; you'll see it when you take it out. It's pretty powerful because the right angle drive turns the pinion in the wringer post feeding up to the wringer head. "The foot bone's connected to the ankle bone, the ankle bone's connected to the leg bone ... "

Those casted parts are heavy, aren't they? They had to be for a "lifetime of dependability." Just think ... Maytag had the ability to cast all of their parts; they did their own quality control and it shows.

Also ... think about washing clothes AND wringing all at once; that power unit is the heart of the machine. It sure does a lot and should be cared for.

You were gutsy to use hot water ... I've never done that; only parts cleaner. I suppose as long as it dries well. No ... you don't want anything rusting or seizing.

Way to go; hard part's done!! Get the worst over with first.

 

[geoffdelp]

Stan you're funny. Poor old lady ... she just had to get that stuff out of her! Larry to the rescue!!

 

[e2l-arry]

I used water

because it was plentiful enough to really force it's way through the unit and jog any loose pieces of debris loose I used the hose in the basement sink I use to fill the washer. On those rare occasions where it's working! I just checked it again and there's no rusting. That light coating of WD-40. And I'll wipe that out best I can before I re-fill it with the 90 wt.

I did get the right angle drive AND vertical drive out. They're still oozing Bosco out in the garage. Do you actually dis-assemble them or just pack fresh grease as well as you can? I cleaned the gear that goes to the vertical drive and scraped off the old gasket. I tried pulling it out. It comes mostly out but just before it comes to the end, it stops. So do you just grease it up as good as you can or do I need to get it all the way out?

I did see there the worm wheel works the wringer shaft but I doubt anything in there was hanging up. It's funny but I never knew the power unit ran the wringer until I got this washer. When I used to use the old Speed Queen I always assumed some electric motor made the wringer go. Never would have though a series of gears and shafts from under the washer did that. It's been an education. No one can deny that!

 

[stan]

Larry

if you can, show us a pic of the inside of that shaft (sounds kinda sexy) after the oil drains out.

Unless you do find a way to disassemble ! And of course we want to see that too LOL

Would assume that it's packed with wheel bearing grease? Or something like.