Whirlpool HybridCare Dryer Review

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So you basicly confirmed what I said. I said "size of the compressor". So, you showed a fridge with the compressor on the top. Guestimating, the unit that contains the compressor is about, lets say, 5 inches high. So you need 5 inches of heigth clearence to install a compressor unit. Show me one modern FL that has 5 inches of clearence above its tub unit.
And, please, don't tell me what I wrote if you clearly could not just scroll up and read what I wrote. That post #34 is just 2 lines. It does not take much to read it and understand it, time and effort wise.
 
Assumptions

I don't think we are on the same page. A euro sized machine would not sell here. I am referring to a duet sized machine or larger. The uber sized machines on the market are near 30" wide and would make more sense. And clearly with the popularly of pedestals and the right height machines the GE offered, make the machine taller by default.

Malcolm
 
Panasonic has a Japanese washer/dryer with the heat pump above the drum. It's 24 inches wide but taller than normal Euro units. And, of course, filled with all the techno gadgets one could think of...
 
I love how at about 4:20 warm and hot water washes are extolled :-) I find that particularly interesting as last I heard Japan was rather more 'green' than the U.S.

A friend directed me to this link from The Daily Show:



I assume the figures cited at about 4:00 are correct as successful satires usually need to have accurate facts and figures. Given that, it seems that household water use in California is getting rather more attention than is deserves. Or is my perception skewed because I'm on the east coast?

Jim

 
Heat Pump Dryers and Combos

To make a fast and efficient appliances these appliances will need to grow in size, the compressor and heat exchanger could be placed either in the top or bottom of the machine, I would probably place the compressor in the bottom and the heat exchanger in the top, the lines to connect the two are tiny and cheap to make [ all refrigerators do this ].

 

Since all dryers and combos are going to be front loading and are more convenient at a higher level anyway a permanent pedestal will be part of the machine. Now that FL washers are common around the world it is only logical that combination washer-dryers are coming, and making a heat pump unit part of the machine would have the added advantage of letting the HP heat the wash water using only 1/3 the amount of power as using an electric element to do the same.
 
Back on topic.... apologies for the hijack.

Yeah, I think you're both envisioning 2 different machine sizes, hence the differing opinions on feasibility.

I agree that 30"/'uber-sized' units are the norm here in the U.S. However, people who are in the market for that sized unit are much more likely to have access to venting than those interested in euro/dishwasher/24"(61cm) unit.

People who're looking at euro-sized units generally are doing so because a regular sized unit is not an option. I submit there's a huge overlap in the population shopping for a euro unit and the population that doesn't have access to venting. IMO, there'd be far more potential sales with a ventless heat-pump 24" unit than a 30" one. Also, here in the U.S. 24" is a standard size for kitchen cabinetry. It's far more common to see raised counter height (for whatever reason) than it is to see the 24" width ignored..... at least in the kitchens I've seen.

I think in older cities there'd be a huge market for euro-sized heat-pump combos, even if they were taller.

The U.S. standard counter height of 36" is ridiculous. I'm only 185cm (6'1") but with my bad back and hips I find 36" painfully low... literally. Any kitchen I remodel for my own personal use will have a counter height of 40 or 42". I'll happily buy a tall 24" washer-dryer combo!

That 36" recommendation is outdated. See attached link:

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB111111057029883344

Jim

 
Washer-Dryer Sizes In The US

All FL washers are just 27" wide [ not 30" ] in the US and this is also nearly standard for dryers as well.

 

No US built W&Ds will fit under a 36" high counter top any longer.  { yes I agree Jim that 36" high counters are a little low for me as well, but the US population is becoming shorter on average due to immigration, so don't expect to see higher counter-tops mandated any time soon ].

 

The market for European sized 24" Wide laundry appliances in the US is very small and shrinking, No US based manufacturer is building this size here and I dough they ever will, even the biggest laundry builder in the world only sells one Chinese built FL washer model here.

 

I can see a huge market for an approximately 4 foot high 27" wide combo, that uses a heat-pump for many reasons.

 

It would require no venting.

 

It would only require a cold water connection, electric power and a drain.

 

Because of the HP for water heating and clothes drying it would be by far the most efficient electric laundry possible, allowing the entire cost of $2000-3000 to be eligible for federal and local tax credits.

 

And best of all the shear convenience of a combo, no transferring laundry, no smelly washer, larger families could have two or more units and really large homes could have these units in more than one location.

 

They would make total sense, this after all this is the promise that the US appliance manufactures told us of in 1952 when Bendix introduced the worlds first Combination Washer-Dryer.
 
You can't use the same heat-pump for heating the wash water and for drying. The water-heating heatpump would have to have a cold heatexchanger in the room air and a heat exchanger submerged&#92flowed by by water. And the heatpump would take an awefull long time to heat the water. Keep in mind, you need 4,2 kJ to heat 1l of water by 1k. Air only has about 1/4 of that.
The thing is, again, not that you could not put a heatpump into a standard sized 27" washer to make it a combo without modifying the cabinet. It is perfectly fine if you put it at the bottom of the machine.
The problem is that if you change the design of the cabinet of the washer, you would need a whole new production line. This would increase cost dramaticly.
Further, the price of such a unit would be closer to 3000$ rather that 2000$. Take the price of the full-sized LG combo, and than look at the price difference between the HybridCare dryer and a simmilar, standard dryer. Add that on top of the LG combo plus another few dollars because of it being harder to assamblem, and then you are doing real talk.
Going on, cycle time would be a major problem. One hour wash cycle for a 3/4 load. Ok so far. Now check how long the reviews on Amazon say the big LG combo needs to dry a load of laundry. Lets say, 3-4 hours. Now, as we saw, the heatpump technology takes about twice as long to dry a load of laundry. So one would end up with cycles of 6-8 hours, and that load wouldn't even be that big of a load.
Now, you could incorporate a traditional heater to speed up drying times. But this would push you to make it run at 240V, which again shrinks it target group dramaticly. (How many spaces do you know that only allow one 27" unit but have 240V service?)
In theory, everything is nice. But this will probably not happen anytime soon.
 
Regarding counter height..... My stance is this: I'm only 6'1" which is not too terribly tall so if I hit my head on it or if I have to stoop to use it, IT IS TOO LOW! Period. And I am unanimous in that, to quote the esteemed Mrs. Slocum.

Henene brings up a good point. The target audience (which I maintain is underestimated) consists primarily of people living in older apartment buildings. They will most likely:

1. Have to put the washer in the kitchen
2. Will need to have dishwasher type hookups or attach the hose to the faucet
3. Will not have access to venting
4. Will have access to 120v, NOT 240.
5. MAY be able to stack as the older a building is, the higher ceilings tend to be.

This is why I maintain a combo with a separate 120v condenser dryer (which does not exist at the moment, but could easily) is the best alternative in a bad situation.

Jim
 
Interesting...

I hope these machines will continue to evolve and get faster and more economical to purchase.

Malcolm
 
Yesterday I dropped in at my local independent appliance dealer (Eden Prairie Appliance) to see what they knew of this new WP hybrid dryer. They had heard of it but that was it, no brochures not even a photo. Have they started marketing these at all to the public or are they still in a "beta test" mode?

They did have four brand new Speed Queen (both FL and TL) electronic control models on the floor though. Neat to see those!
 
I still can't see using this over my natural gas vented dryer and I live in a city. I don't even want to use a conventional electric dryer. Why would anyone currently using a natural gas dryer want to use a HP dryer?

And now I see I have to pull the unit away from the wall once a month to vacuum the cooling fan? So I have to get help to pull this thing out away from the wall?

If you are living in a condo will you even have room for a washer/dryer this large?

Will see what happens but this dryer technology is not for me at this time.
 
Unless The US Federal Government

Creates some insane energy use standards/laws/rules that pretty much force vented electric or gas dryers off the market can't see these hybrid units taking off.

As with condenser dryers these hybrid dryers do serve a purpose for those who either cannot or will not have a vented dryer. Then factor in a percentage of "tree huggers" willing to have anything with a "green" whiff attached to it; but for the rest of us just don't see it happening.

This past winter/fall used my AEG condenser dryer about three times in total. Now that warmer weather is slowly arriving the thing will go into mothballs until next winter. Despite having about half the heating power and a smaller diameter drum my little vintage Whirlpool "compact" dryer does a full load from either the Miele or AEG washers faster than the Lavatherm.
 

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