Can a KitchenAid (KDI16) be saved? Anyone?

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Steve thanks for the Hobart web site!

I might even apply for a job with them! Becky, my sister, found out where the office in Greensburg is so we will probably go there.

Rollermatic, what do you do with all your KitchenAids? Do people say you have too many dishwashers?

BTW, my BIL worries that Becky is getting more handy and is starting to get a "Tool belt".
 
Brother In Law. He is an athletic Italian who I am not supposed to mention on the internet, especially on a forum like this one but he wants the 16 out of the house as soon as possible. Oh, and he doesn't see why anyone wants a 42 year old dishwasher. BTW, they paid 800 for a Maytag dishwasher - think it will last?
 
They will teach you well!

Bob, Hobart is always looking for a few good men and women! If you feel so inclined, do fill out an application. I can't say if there are any openings per se in your area but if you have an electro-mechanical background and a good understanding of which end of a wrench is the business end, you should do it. You never know what may happen!
 
do people say i have too many kitchenaids?

i don't tell everyone that i collect appliances, most people would not "get it" so i just skip it.

my friends who i do tell think i am nuts ofcourse! but that's ok. i'm not one to be easily swayed by anyone elses opinion, especially when it comes to any of my hobbies!.
the main question they ask is where i keep them all. i tell them i have a room in my house i keep them all in which is a partial truth. i also have 7 of the kitchenaids in the kitchen area and 8 washers in my living room area. i enjoy being around them! plus i am still working on the rollermatics, 3 are done, 3 more to restore.

i probably do have too many dishwashers but when i started here 2 years ago my goal was to collect at least one of every model kitchenaid made up thru the 23 series. at this point i still need a 10, 11, 20, and 22. plus i really love the old d&m machines, g.e. mobile maids, and just about any other brand made in the 50's or 60's. so i spent most of 2008 and all of 2009 scouring e bay and craigs list and grabbing them all up like a hungry kid!

but if i never get those remaining kitchenaids it's ok, i've had my fun! i'm not actively looking for them anymore. once i discovered how much i love the frigidaire rollermatics, and love working on them my dishwasher cravings really tapered off! if they come my way fine, if not, oh well!

it's a great hobby but it doesn't matter if we have 2 or 42, it's the enjoyment that these old vintage classic machines bring to us that is important i think! at first i thought the more i got the better collector i was, now looking at it i realize it's not a race! i'm not in competition with anyone! and i'm going to thin out my stash a bit here in the next year.

thanks for asking! good luck with your kitchenaid!
 
Rollermatic,
Have any of your machines been heavily used? I was having second thoughts because I notice Robert gets his dishwashers from little old ladies at estate sales. Aunt Mac had this dishwasher for 20 years and she was only one person but my sister had it the next 22 and they used it hard, sometimes twice a day. I'm worried that the other parts are all worn out. The tub and racks, however, do not look worn at all. They look a lot better than the Maytag we have that only 6 years old.

Wouldn't it be something if the new Maytag they spent 800 dollars on had an early demise and they wanted the KA 16 back? You think that could happen?

By the way, what number are they up to now? Would a current KitchenAid be like KD127?
 
Sorry, the news may not be good...

It turns out there may be no way to get this machine to my house in time and I also found out that there is a burning smell from the blower and the detergent dispenser never worked. My sister really used the dishwasher heavily and they want it out tomorrow. My BIL and my brother are both coming down with something and they cannot help me haul it.

So I think I am going to raid it for parts. I know I can get the racks, strainer, upper pump, buttons, light, timer, knob, and maybe the latch assembly? Anybody want these? Is there anything else I should try to get? Since you have all been of help, I'm willing to give the parts away for shipping.

Thank you all.
Bob.

P.S. Pictures are coming as soon as a get a cable for my camera.
 
gee that's too bad

but maybe another kitchenaid will come along you can get as a whole machine. i personally don't need any parts, i have tons now, but i'm sure someone here will want something. that timer, motor, and pump assembly would be the choice selection in my book!

you ask about my machines, most are in very good shape, the little old lady type as you say. but a couple of the 17 models are rough, racks not that great and some sump rust. but all are in operating condition. if the sump is rusty i give it about 3 coats of rusty metal primer and then 3 coats of rustoleum before i put the pump and motor back in.

as far as model numbers go, i stopped collecting at the 23 series and even that one is not interesting to me in the least. i think the 23 was the last model before whirlpool completely took over, i may be wrong here. the kitchenaid historians on the site will probably know that one!

i don't have much interest in them after they changed the pump and went with a reversing motor on the 21 series. and even the 18-20 are not one's i really care for. i like the old one's i remember as a kid, one spray arm at the bottom! 15-17 are my favs!
 
News Flash!

Just as I was raiding the 16 for parts, somehow I figured out how to get it out of there and my BIL came with the Element and he said we might as well get it to your house. So now I have it after all!

I find it actually is quite dirty and it may be pretty bad off but I think if I fix the leak it mostly is just a lot of cleaning. I could not get the timer off, so good thing he came.

But now that I started taking it apart, now I have to screw it all together again! Fortunately, I have the screws and it seems that Hobart used actual screws instead of clips and I really didn't notice much corrosion.

Actually its better that he came today. I had a chance to clean the dishwasher space. It was disgusting, and I think the installers would have just installed the new one without cleaning it up.
 
need parts breakdowns?

Bob, if you need the parts breakdown for that machine, I still have a copy I can scan and send to you. Let me know.
I think you will find that some cleaning up will do the machine justice. If you decide to use it, make sure that you wrap the sides, top and back of tank with some insulation. Go with as thick a blanket as you can use and still fit in into the space under your counter. And even wrap it around the bottom if you can.
Don't forget to pack the door with insulation too, avoiding the detergent dispenser so it can move freely.

Use unfaced insulation in the door. And consider gluing a nice 4 inch thick piece on the back side of the lower panel and maybe even the black kick panel. You can also lay some down on the floor under the machine and all this will result in a much quiter machine and one that retains its heat better too.
 
Well, I am going to work on putting the parts back tomorrow before I forget.

To be truthful, KA was never as loud, even toward the end, as the dying Maytag we have now and the cheap Hotpoint that roars I had in my apartment. You know when its running, but it you could have a conversation.

There is some dense fiber insulation on there already.

I also wonder if before I use something like CLR on the tub inside I should probably order the kit and repair the leak first, shouldn't I?

Have you come across many Hobart KitchenAids that were "too far gone"? It's possible this could be one of them. Then again, just about any other machine (Kenmore, GE) would probably be shot a long time ago.
 
too far gone??

i doubt it. i have 23 kitchenaids at this present time and out of all of them only 2 have even needed a new pump seal when i got them. one was an 18 model, one a 19. all the early ones, the 12, 14, 15-17 series didn't even leak and still don't.

sump rust can be a problem and i have had a couple that were starting to get to be a problem but again i cleaned it all out and coated them with rustoleum rusty metal primer followed by several coats of rustoleum paint and they are now as good as new.

without looking at it i cannot say for sure but i would guess your 16 model is in fine shape overall. like steve said don't use it till you replace that seal or you will ruin the motor most probably. but even then motors are out there, used and new.

pump gaskets are still available too, i bought 6 from larry in parma last year. he's at modern parts house. he has those seals as well.
 
I promise, pictures are coming!

The motor seems to be fine. Should it be oiled somewhere?

I felt better when I started to clean some of the parts up. There seems to not be any sump rust but a lot of mineral build up. Sam recommended CLR to remove it. There was also a LOT of crap in there, and that might have been why she was complaining of burning odors. The strainer at the bottom and the door handle were particularly cruddy. What I ended up doing was filling a pot up with a solution of new Cascade and water and heating it up on the stove. The chrome is so bright it almost blinded me! Be careful when using new Cascade to clean things like that, it dried and caused almost chemical burns to my hands. It must have more lye than the phosphated detergents. Right now I am cleaning up the outside and when I get the seal from Hobart I thought I would work on the crud inside but I don't want to do that until sealed. The wheels on the racks are shot but I think I can steal wheels when our Maytag dies.

Even though I pulled some wires I was able to put them back. It turns out Hobart neatly labels all the wires and terminals, I guess to make it easier to assemble? With some other brands, it was easy to get lost.
 
Little by Little

Bob, take the cleanup project in little steps. I would say that if there is little or no sump rust,especially around the motor and its mounting bolts, do not remove the motor at this time. Do try to get an extra set of gaskets for future use, though. You never know what you may encounter.
If your water is naturally soft or mechanically softened and you plan on using this machine as a daily driver, I would not recommend using any chemicals at all in it. The soft water will eventually and rather quickly with daily use wash away the lime buildup and leave a spotless interior.

Take it from someone who sees this everyday on commercial machines as well as thru personal experience.

IF the blower/heater assembly is making a burning smell, it may have a bad blower motor. Or it was simply the buildup of dust on the heater element that burned off when you turned it on. It should all go away assuming the blower itself is good.
I have plenty of blower assemblies so if you need one, let me know. That is one thing I always would take off a condemned machine. I am glad you were able to rewire the machine and yes, the wire markings sure make it easier to do.

Hope you will add some picture soon so we can see what youa re dealing with and the progress you make.
 
No needto, most of the time!

No, sorry, all those motors came with permanently lubricated bearings. So there would not be any place to add oil or grease to them. They will fail if enough water gets in to them so if the seal fails, it would be wise to replace it as soon as possible. The bearings can be replaced, but the problem with the 15 and up machines was getting the cooling fan off without breaking it. They are not available so if you break it, the motor is garbage. The top bearing goes on over the top of the motor shaft so you cannot get it off if the fan is stuck.
 
Thanks Steve. The KDS 20 I have stored in my garage has a fairly noisy motor. Since the bearings are permanently lubed, I don't think it stands much chance of ever making it into my kitchen. Believe it or not, the Thermador makes less noise.
 
Thinking and thinking!

Ralph, I have been thinking about your last statement and I think you might want to check your motor on the KDS20.. The later motors started coming with plastic cooling fans which were held in by a retaining clip. They had a tendency to break and get noisy especially at startup when the highest torque of the motor occurs. Then they would literally spin on the shaft and then catch up to the motor and quiet down a bit.

If you have one of these types, and the fan is intact, they come off rather easily and you can then install new bearings with little trouble, They are available at any place that sells bearings. The bearing numbers are stamped right on the bearings so you can easily identify them. If you need the numbers before hand let me know and I will get the info for you. I would go with the ones that have the rubber type seals and not the metal seal which could eventually allow water to get in again. So given the base bearing number, the transmission shop can cross reference it and get you one of better quality.
 

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