bradfordwhite
Well-known member
I have yet to check out induction. I've seen the single burner plug in units. Just hasn't been a priority.
Gas Stoves and Indoor Pollution
- Thread starter blackstone
- Start date
Help Support :
Are there any health concerns for people with pacemakers etc vis-a-vis induction cooktops?
More info:
"The British Heart Foundation recommends that people with a pacemaker should get no closer than 60 cms (2 ft) from an induction hob. "
inductionguide.com
"The British Heart Foundation recommends that people with a pacemaker should get no closer than 60 cms (2 ft) from an induction hob. "
Do Induction Cooktops Affect Pacemakers?
Pacemakers are small electrical devices that regulate electrical activity in the heart. Anything that produces a strong electromagnetic field can interfere with a pacemaker. The British Heart Foundation recommends that people with a pacemaker should
inductionguide.com
And, an induction cooktop may also interfere with insulin pumps.
No thanks!
If I had a pacemaker or an insulin pump, I wouldn't get an induction cooktop or range. I don't think I could cook effectively staying two feet away, and I wouldn't want to run the risk.
No thanks!
If I had a pacemaker or an insulin pump, I wouldn't get an induction cooktop or range. I don't think I could cook effectively staying two feet away, and I wouldn't want to run the risk.
If You Want To [ Or Have To ] Use Gas To Cook In Your Home
Just be sure you have a good exhaust system that vents outside, and use it even if you are just boiling water in a tea kettle.
This can be a good vented hood, a wall mounted fan or a ceiling mounted exhaust fan, If you have a ceiling fan in the kitchen with gas cooking NEVER run it when the range is on, it causes inverted air currents and poor combustion of surface burners making the pollution problems worse. A ceiling fan also causes air currents that keep vented hoods and wall or ceiling exhaust fans from doing their job.
If your kitchen does not have a vented exhaust system use a portable fan exhausting air from the nearest window to the range, even if the closest window in in the next room.
John L.
Just be sure you have a good exhaust system that vents outside, and use it even if you are just boiling water in a tea kettle.
This can be a good vented hood, a wall mounted fan or a ceiling mounted exhaust fan, If you have a ceiling fan in the kitchen with gas cooking NEVER run it when the range is on, it causes inverted air currents and poor combustion of surface burners making the pollution problems worse. A ceiling fan also causes air currents that keep vented hoods and wall or ceiling exhaust fans from doing their job.
If your kitchen does not have a vented exhaust system use a portable fan exhausting air from the nearest window to the range, even if the closest window in in the next room.
John L.
bradfordwhite
Well-known member
Most people don't have pacemakers.
Most people don't have positive Covid-19 tests.
Doesn't mean there isn't a significant health risk from induction cooktops.
Doesn't mean there isn't a significant health risk from induction cooktops.
I did some searching of articles on the proposed health risk from gas stoves.
On one of them from the Rocky Mountain Institute, they have a photo of a gas burner at the top of the page.
Guess what? That burner is in extremely poor adjustment, with a massive orange flame. Guess what? That is a badly adjusted burner that is not getting enough air. Of course that will pollute! A well adjusted flame is all blue, with no yellow or orange.
rmi.org
On one of them from the Rocky Mountain Institute, they have a photo of a gas burner at the top of the page.
Guess what? That burner is in extremely poor adjustment, with a massive orange flame. Guess what? That is a badly adjusted burner that is not getting enough air. Of course that will pollute! A well adjusted flame is all blue, with no yellow or orange.
Gas Stoves: Health and Air Quality Impacts and Solutions - RMI
Across the United States, millions of homes and apartments rely on gas appliances for heating and cooking.
rmi.org
No association found between gas stove usage and adults with asthma:
warmsecondrinse
Well-known member
I think I'm beginning to lose the plot here.
From what you guys are saying it sounds like there are people on the planet who cook with gas burners that flame yellow and orange and don't have a problem with it???
Last I heard flames were supposed to be all blue all the time. Or did I grow up in some alternate dimension?
From what you guys are saying it sounds like there are people on the planet who cook with gas burners that flame yellow and orange and don't have a problem with it???
Last I heard flames were supposed to be all blue all the time. Or did I grow up in some alternate dimension?
The Little Discussed Dangers of Induction Stoves
"While it is extremely controversial whether this type of radiation source is actually dangerous, the data is sufficient enough for me to avoid it. The latest information I found that should give anyone pause about bringing an induction stove into their home was published by the Journal Bioelectromagnetics in 2012 (1).
The study authors concluded that most induction hobs (rings) exceeded even the high 1998 maximum exposure levels set by the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP) when a person was standing close to the induction stove.
The worst-case scenario was an up to 16-fold increase from these maximum exposure levels!
So how in the world did induction stoves ever pass the safety tests? According to Powerwatch, the safety tests assumed that a person’s body is never closer than 1 foot (30 cm) to the front of the induction stove. Standing that far away would be considered “normal usage”.
I don’t know about you, but I don’t cook standing at least a foot away from my stove. My arms definitely aren’t long enough!
In fact, this would be pretty much impossible if you needed to reach the back burners."
www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com
"While it is extremely controversial whether this type of radiation source is actually dangerous, the data is sufficient enough for me to avoid it. The latest information I found that should give anyone pause about bringing an induction stove into their home was published by the Journal Bioelectromagnetics in 2012 (1).
The study authors concluded that most induction hobs (rings) exceeded even the high 1998 maximum exposure levels set by the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP) when a person was standing close to the induction stove.
The worst-case scenario was an up to 16-fold increase from these maximum exposure levels!
So how in the world did induction stoves ever pass the safety tests? According to Powerwatch, the safety tests assumed that a person’s body is never closer than 1 foot (30 cm) to the front of the induction stove. Standing that far away would be considered “normal usage”.
I don’t know about you, but I don’t cook standing at least a foot away from my stove. My arms definitely aren’t long enough!
In fact, this would be pretty much impossible if you needed to reach the back burners."
The Dangers of Induction Stoves (and what to buy instead)
Why using an induction stove in your home should be approached with caution as this technology is a source of excessive EMF radiation.
www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com
"Exposure of the human body to professional and domestic induction cooktops compared to the basic restrictions."
"ABSTRACT: We investigated whether domestic and professional induction cooktops comply with the basic restrictions defined by the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP). Based on magnetic field measurements, a generic numerical model of an induction cooktop was derived in order to model user exposure. The current density induced in the user was simulated for various models and distances. We also determined the exposure of the fetus and of young children. While most measured cooktops comply with the public exposure limits at the distance specified by the International Electrotechnical Commission (standard IEC 62233), the majority exceeds them at closer distances, some of them even the occupational limits. The maximum current density in the tissue of the user significantly exceeds the basic restrictions for the general public, reaching the occupational level. The exposure of the brains of young children reaches the order of magnitude of the limits for the general public. For a generic worst-case cooktop compliant with the measurement standards, the current density exceeds the 1998 ICNIRP basic restrictions by up to 24 dB or a factor of 16. The brain tissue of young children can be overexposed by 6 dB or a factor of 2. The exposure of the tissue of the central nervous system of the fetus can exceed the limits for the general public if the mother is exposed at occupational levels. This demonstrates that the methodology for testing induction cooktops according to IEC 62233 contradicts the basic restrictions. This evaluation will be extended considering."
My conclusion: with a gas cooktop, I can turn on the range hood over it and exhaust the pollutants it might emit. With an induction cooktop, there is no way to blow away damaging EMF.
I'll stick with gas, or resistance electric, thanks.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
"ABSTRACT: We investigated whether domestic and professional induction cooktops comply with the basic restrictions defined by the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP). Based on magnetic field measurements, a generic numerical model of an induction cooktop was derived in order to model user exposure. The current density induced in the user was simulated for various models and distances. We also determined the exposure of the fetus and of young children. While most measured cooktops comply with the public exposure limits at the distance specified by the International Electrotechnical Commission (standard IEC 62233), the majority exceeds them at closer distances, some of them even the occupational limits. The maximum current density in the tissue of the user significantly exceeds the basic restrictions for the general public, reaching the occupational level. The exposure of the brains of young children reaches the order of magnitude of the limits for the general public. For a generic worst-case cooktop compliant with the measurement standards, the current density exceeds the 1998 ICNIRP basic restrictions by up to 24 dB or a factor of 16. The brain tissue of young children can be overexposed by 6 dB or a factor of 2. The exposure of the tissue of the central nervous system of the fetus can exceed the limits for the general public if the mother is exposed at occupational levels. This demonstrates that the methodology for testing induction cooktops according to IEC 62233 contradicts the basic restrictions. This evaluation will be extended considering."
My conclusion: with a gas cooktop, I can turn on the range hood over it and exhaust the pollutants it might emit. With an induction cooktop, there is no way to blow away damaging EMF.
I'll stick with gas, or resistance electric, thanks.
Exposure of the human body to professional and domestic induction cooktops compared to the basic restrictions - PubMed
We investigated whether domestic and professional induction cooktops comply with the basic restrictions defined by the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection (ICNIRP). Based on magnetic field measurements, a generic numerical model of an induction cooktop was derived in...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Jim wrote:
"I think I'm beginning to lose the plot here.
From what you guys are saying it sounds like there are people on the planet who cook with gas burners that flame yellow and orange and don't have a problem with it???
Last I heard flames were supposed to be all blue all the time. Or did I grow up in some alternate dimension?"
Nobody is saying people who use mal-adjusted gas ranges don't have problems with it. What I'm saying it that an observant homeowner should make sure their gas range is operating to spec, and yellow/orange flames are NOT to spec.
Yes, the gas flame should be all blue all the time. If it's not, call the gas company. I remember as far back as the 1960's our local gas company informing customers of this requirement.
"I think I'm beginning to lose the plot here.
From what you guys are saying it sounds like there are people on the planet who cook with gas burners that flame yellow and orange and don't have a problem with it???
Last I heard flames were supposed to be all blue all the time. Or did I grow up in some alternate dimension?"
Nobody is saying people who use mal-adjusted gas ranges don't have problems with it. What I'm saying it that an observant homeowner should make sure their gas range is operating to spec, and yellow/orange flames are NOT to spec.
Yes, the gas flame should be all blue all the time. If it's not, call the gas company. I remember as far back as the 1960's our local gas company informing customers of this requirement.
I will add this to the natural gas story: Some years ago, perhaps 20 or more, our local gas company, PGE, notified customers that it was purging its gas distribution lines of a toxic additive, PCB (polychlorinatedbiphenyl) that had been used to help prevent internal corrosion of the pipes.
PCB's are somewhat notorious because they have been used as an insulating medium in electrical power transformers, such as seen mounted high on power poles in neighborhoods. By law it was phased out starting in 1979. It is mentioned as a continuing contaminant in maintained power transformers, which may be how it wound up inadvertently being added to gas distribution lines.
In any case I wasn't too alarmed because the announcement stated that residual PCB was in minute amounts, and that the purging of the lines would eliminate the problem.
Also I have learned since from Googling the issue, that PCB's can be made less toxic, perhaps non-toxic, by treating them to remove the chlorine atoms and then the cleaned up product can be used as a safer transformer insulation fluid.
Anyway, this thread triggered the memory of that announcement and I though I'd share. But I won't point at gas being the evil here, because without electric power distribution transformers the PCB's wouldn't have been used so much. And there is at least one hit in Google that a 16 year old girl was harmed by PCB's leaking from a failed power distribution transformer.
PCB's are somewhat notorious because they have been used as an insulating medium in electrical power transformers, such as seen mounted high on power poles in neighborhoods. By law it was phased out starting in 1979. It is mentioned as a continuing contaminant in maintained power transformers, which may be how it wound up inadvertently being added to gas distribution lines.
In any case I wasn't too alarmed because the announcement stated that residual PCB was in minute amounts, and that the purging of the lines would eliminate the problem.
Also I have learned since from Googling the issue, that PCB's can be made less toxic, perhaps non-toxic, by treating them to remove the chlorine atoms and then the cleaned up product can be used as a safer transformer insulation fluid.
Anyway, this thread triggered the memory of that announcement and I though I'd share. But I won't point at gas being the evil here, because without electric power distribution transformers the PCB's wouldn't have been used so much. And there is at least one hit in Google that a 16 year old girl was harmed by PCB's leaking from a failed power distribution transformer.
Everything said and done, all this info leads me to start using the hood fan over the cooktop every time I turn it on. Especially in winter, but year round as well.
Reply# 67
Oh dear, I must have imagined those asthma attacks.
So they didn't check if the people with gas stoves used them or not? lol! And I haven't seen the difference between allergic and non-allergic asthma being mentioned. As a matter of fact they mention testing for atopy, which means that the people tested positive for that may not have had non-allergic asthma, the type of asthma that gives problems with fumes, smoke etc.
Oh dear, I must have imagined those asthma attacks.
So they didn't check if the people with gas stoves used them or not? lol! And I haven't seen the difference between allergic and non-allergic asthma being mentioned. As a matter of fact they mention testing for atopy, which means that the people tested positive for that may not have had non-allergic asthma, the type of asthma that gives problems with fumes, smoke etc.
Cooker hoods
My catering kitchen had a built in safety device that would not allow any gas to flow without the hood being switched on first it was made to prevent fumes building up and when your stood in front of a 6 ring hob a grill and 2 gas fired fryers you needed something to take the heat out let alone the fumes
My catering kitchen had a built in safety device that would not allow any gas to flow without the hood being switched on first it was made to prevent fumes building up and when your stood in front of a 6 ring hob a grill and 2 gas fired fryers you needed something to take the heat out let alone the fumes
orange flames
I remember seeing cooking shows on TV and the flame photographs yellow, orange and blue. I was told it had something to with the heat and chemical composition of the flame and how they are picked up by cameras. I do not know if that is true, but that is the way it was explained. I do remember from when we had a gas stove that the flame would be shot through with orange streaks and sparks when dinner was being prepared around 5pm. I, of course, asked mom about this and she said it had to do with heavy gas usage at that time of day and impurities in the gas mains being dislodged by the greater flow. Again, this is only what I was told. At other times of the day the flame was all blue.
I remember seeing cooking shows on TV and the flame photographs yellow, orange and blue. I was told it had something to with the heat and chemical composition of the flame and how they are picked up by cameras. I do not know if that is true, but that is the way it was explained. I do remember from when we had a gas stove that the flame would be shot through with orange streaks and sparks when dinner was being prepared around 5pm. I, of course, asked mom about this and she said it had to do with heavy gas usage at that time of day and impurities in the gas mains being dislodged by the greater flow. Again, this is only what I was told. At other times of the day the flame was all blue.
bradfordwhite
Well-known member
We're always working to improve and become more efficient and safe.
50 years ago, people were still using coal and wood for heat. Something that is so dirty noxious. When I lived in the Boston area in 2006 one could still find listings in the news paper for people who sold and delivered coal. Unthinkable.
I think that all residential gas service should be discontinued. I think there should be an deliberate effort to convert to electric or solar.
In the sunny areas/cities where it typically doesn't get below 40 degrees and we really don't need large quantities of gas they should give it 12 months and have rate freezes on electric as well as offer customers help with installing alternative appliances.
In the north areas they should do similar but offer more help with insulation and heating appliances and funnel the gas to more portable neighborhood gas power plants. But we need to remember that because the U.S. has been getting more efficient in it's electric usage, we peaked in electric consumption around 2012 so there is excess capacity already.
As solar and battery storage continues to take over, the idea of having volatile gas appliances in our homes is going to look as ridiculous as having a coal burner.
And we can't forget, there was actually a time when homes were plumbed for (unvented) gas LIGHTING. Can you imagine the heat build up and poisonous fumes? OMG. .....and the house fires.
Those old technologies served their purpose..... it's just that better stuff came along.
50 years ago, people were still using coal and wood for heat. Something that is so dirty noxious. When I lived in the Boston area in 2006 one could still find listings in the news paper for people who sold and delivered coal. Unthinkable.
I think that all residential gas service should be discontinued. I think there should be an deliberate effort to convert to electric or solar.
In the sunny areas/cities where it typically doesn't get below 40 degrees and we really don't need large quantities of gas they should give it 12 months and have rate freezes on electric as well as offer customers help with installing alternative appliances.
In the north areas they should do similar but offer more help with insulation and heating appliances and funnel the gas to more portable neighborhood gas power plants. But we need to remember that because the U.S. has been getting more efficient in it's electric usage, we peaked in electric consumption around 2012 so there is excess capacity already.
As solar and battery storage continues to take over, the idea of having volatile gas appliances in our homes is going to look as ridiculous as having a coal burner.
And we can't forget, there was actually a time when homes were plumbed for (unvented) gas LIGHTING. Can you imagine the heat build up and poisonous fumes? OMG. .....and the house fires.
Those old technologies served their purpose..... it's just that better stuff came along.
Reply #66 and 69
reply # 66 was probably a dramatization of a bad gas flame, no properly working gas range produces a flame that looks like that,
Note : there are no adjustments possible on the great majority of gas ranges built today.
reply #69, I dare say no one has ever been harmed by either an induction cook-top or a microwave oven, up until a few years ago [ last time I actually checked ] there had never been an injury from a MWO caused by MW energy according to HEW which regulates MWOS in the US, this makes MWOs about the safest appliance in a home, I suspect that the injury rate on ICTs will also be a fraction of injuries caused by conventual electric or gas CTs.
John L.
reply # 66 was probably a dramatization of a bad gas flame, no properly working gas range produces a flame that looks like that,
Note : there are no adjustments possible on the great majority of gas ranges built today.
reply #69, I dare say no one has ever been harmed by either an induction cook-top or a microwave oven, up until a few years ago [ last time I actually checked ] there had never been an injury from a MWO caused by MW energy according to HEW which regulates MWOS in the US, this makes MWOs about the safest appliance in a home, I suspect that the injury rate on ICTs will also be a fraction of injuries caused by conventual electric or gas CTs.
John L.
