GLBT Rights (OT)

[petek]

Re Alberta and such. My partner and I lived there for 20 years up until moving here to Ontario in 2006. Alberta is commonly referred to as Canada most redneck province akin to the worst of a southern US state but in fact isn't anywhere near as bad as that nor as backward as many from elsewhere believe. Certainly the govt there at the time was against the same-sex proposal bowing to pressure from the rural strongly religious vote, who like in the south always vote whle the urban cities, Calgary, Edmonton etc take a more liberal view. Their last ditch attempt to thwart same-sex marriage was to institute a very broad domestic partnership statute which gave any two people regardless of relationship the same rights as a married/common law couple. That meant for example two old ladies with no family or two old men, two good friends etc sharing a house who were dependent on each other could register as domestic partners and gain the benefits without being married. A very big win win for many people in dire circumstances with no family but dependent on another person. It's actually the basis on which the UK civil unions was based (same as marriage but not marriage.

Still in all the federal government of Canada defines what the term "marriage" includes or doesn't include and the provinces are only given the right to register marriages. Any province that does not agree with any federal legislation has the right to opt out by using what is termed a "notwithstanding clause" for a term of I believe 5 years at which time it must either comply or again apply/vote to continue not complying. Not quite sure how it works..

Anyways in the case of Alberta in the end they saw the writing on the wall as the only holdout and withdrew fearing that for them to invoke the "notwithstanding clause" would be politically disasterous because it would be the first time in history that it had happened where a province actually took away citizens rights enshrined in the Charter.

 

[rp2813]

Hey Greg,

Thanks for the kind words. No issues with family here. I think you meant Keven. And Keven, I feel for you. That is some fcuked up BS you've had to deal with. I've actually never formally come out to my parents. They married late and are/were much older than any of my friends' parents. I have always felt that they preferred a dont-ask-don't-tell situation. My dad was a very liberal guy. He was hiring black men at his company in Chicago without giving it a second thought prior to being shipped off to combat in the early 40's. He once mentioned that after he returned from the war, he ran into one of these men and the guy advised that he had been promoted. My dad said that was some of the best news he heard after coming home. Yet I knew that he'd feel crushed if I ever came out to him. He stayed in touch with military buddies right up until his final days and I just didn't even want him having to discuss my situation with them. I felt he'd take an apologetic tone or ask what he could have done wrong, or feel otherwise like he had failed at producing a "real" son. I didn't even want to open that can of worms.

Mom I'm sure knows but has never said anything. I never came out to her after my dad was gone because I knew she'd be on the phone to everyone telling them. It's weird, I know, but this arrangement works for me, and I think it has worked for my parents too. Neither of them would have disowned me or anything, but I didn't want to saddle them with this whole issue. Their generation is quite different from mine in how they handle this sort of thing.

Greg, my partner and I have a similar situation to yours. We are well-received by our neighbors. I dare say the cute young dad across the street was overly anxious to introduce himself after moving in a few years ago but we're not in the business of wrecking homes. We tend to keep to ourselves but since we are on a neighborhood "collector" street we get our share of traffic and exposure. Most people have done the math. My partner's strategy is not to give anyone a reason to complain about us being in the neighborhood. Indeed, there are a lot of houses around us that have chosen our color scheme and have done similar things with fencing and landscaping. We feel pretty good about being an example and having that sort of respect, but re-painting the house because so many have copied us gets expensive after a while!

This has been a great discussion. And it's nice to see some straight guys contributing their thoughts.

Ralph

 

[panthera]

There are

some very interesting thoughts and discussions here - I don't feel quite as isolated listening to folks.
As everyone here knows, I am moving back to the US. As a German citizen with American parents, the only way to do this is with the Green Card.
Ironically, although it has been granted, I have to wait for my "number" to come up - a wait of several years. The people who could make a waiver because of my parents' dire need are all Republican political appointees and, as one of them so delicately put it "we can't stop it, but we will do nothing to expedite it".
Just in case anyone was wondering why I so love Republicans.
My friends here in Germany support me. They think I am more than a bit nuts - social services here being what they are, they can't imagine how alone and desperate for help even well-off elderly people can be in the US - but having met my red-neck family through the years, they understand my predicament. Not the roots - tolerance is a very important aspect of life here in Western Europe, Christians here tend to be loving and supportive people, not at all like the monster Christianists in the US.
But it is a cultural shock every time to go from a country where I can hug my students without someone screaming favoritism or sexual abuse. Where I can walk through a park after dark without fear of being murdered. Where it is a natural thing, a good thing that my partner, if he gives me his hand in marriage, will automatically have full resident rights and all the other rights which are denied to us in the US.
My redneck family have already stated that they will fight my parent's will down to the last line. They already have fought every decision I have had to make for my parents. They refuse to help or make decisions themselves, mind you.
So if I tend to be a bit nasty about the Christianists and Republicans, now you know why.
Christians are absolutely not persecuted, they are protected - homosexuals in the US may be legally discriminated against. Please, all you "deeply offended" Christians out there, keep that in mind when one of us who have been badly hurt and attacked (including physically) gets upset with your religion. No, you may be the incarnation of all the fruits of the spirit...but your fellow Christians have done all in their hatefilled power to make our lives a living hell. Funny, I thought it was their task to save our souls, not drive us away...gonna be some interesting conversations on judgement day...

 

[danemodsandy]

Food For Thought:

One thought-provoking joke I've enjoyed pulling many times over the years is to remind straight guys that gay men perform a valuable service for them. They always get a very puzzled look on their faces, and then I deliver the punch line:

"They leave that many more women for you to enjoy!"

There's usually a laugh, and everyone gets back to work, or whatever, with a slightly different perspective on the situation, which ain't bad for a joke.

 

[conate]

Panthera....

As a person who lives within a few hours of you, you have a friend when you return to the USA.

Sorry about your family. You have my sympathy.

Nate

 

[panthera]

Thanks, Nate

You and a lot of folks here have helped me get through some tough times, not to mention given me some good laughs - something I need to do more often.
The laughs, I mean, not the tough times.

 

[perc-o-prince]

Wonderful and thought-provoking discussion as always,

...but please don't forget the purpose of the thread: visit the link, sign and send the message, get on the mailing list, and tell people you know who aren't part of this group about it! The link is below again for convenience sake!!!

Chuck

p.s.- 20 years this August 16th, and not married though we can here in MA. We decided we'd do it if it had some real benefit, and not just a piece of paper. We have enough paper to keep track of now! Our lawyer is going to make sure we're well-protected as far as the house, wills, powers-of-attorney, et cetera.

http://www.hrcactioncenter.org/campaign/family_matters_0408

 

[carlstock]

Thanks, Keven

Thank you for your message here, Keven.

I have been somewhat quiet but hope to be here a bit more often soon.

Carl